NETGEAR is aware of a growing number of phone and online scams. To learn how to stay safe click here.
Forum Discussion
Solved
How to connect 2.4GHZ Devices
I just bought few smart plugs. But they only connect to 2.4 Ghz. How do i add them to my home network as they will not show up in App on my phone for a setup. I have a good coverage in my house so mo...
Kcobra1 wrote:I just bought few smart plugs. But they only connect to 2.4 Ghz. How do i add them to my home network as they will not show up in App on my phone for a setup. I have a good coverage in my house so most of the time phone is on 5Ghz.
While the smartphone apps for many (most?) Internet of Things (IoT) devices are able to deal with "mesh" WiFi networks, there are some which are poorly written and simply fail to work when the smartphone is connected at 5G. What has worked for many people (including me) is this:
- Access the Orbi web interface (http://orbilogin.net) using the admin credentials user "admin" and the Orbi router password (not the WiFi password)
- Navigate to the Advanced Tab, Advanced Settings, Wireless Settings
- Uncheck the box "Broadcast SSID on 5G Channel"
This will not affect any devices which are currently attached to the Orbi at 5G. - On the smartphone settings, "forget" the Orbi WiFi
- Search for WiFi networks and select the Orbi WiFi
- Enter the WiF password and connect
- At this point, open the IoT app and go through the steps
- After the device is connected, reverse the steps
Check the box "Broadcast SSID"
"Forget Orbi WiFi"
Search for and connect.
This sounds like a lot of work, but doesn't take very long.
p.s. "Poorly written" may seem harsh, but GEEZ. My TP-Link, Belkin, Eufy, Teckin (and other) smart plugs connected immediately. I have only had one that required the above steps. For one plug, I simply ignored the warnings "MUST connect to w.4G" and kept hitting "Continue" until it worked. "TAKE THAT!", I said.
The answer to this will not make you happy, but users need to know this when considering purchase of an Orbi system or when tearing their hair out because most (if not all) of their smart devices cannot be connected or configured on the network.
The problem is that almost all mesh systems, and particularly the more advanced ones like Orbi are set to have a single SSID for both 2.4ghz and 5.0ghz bands, and they cannot be separated nor can you turn off or temporarily suspend 5.0ghz. But, almost all smart devices, whether locks, video cameras, doorbells, thermostats, security systems, lights etc, are designed to ONLY work on 2.4ghz, and your phone MUST be connected to the same band and SSID during setup for the app to recognize the device. But the rub is, smartphones will ALWAYS prefer 5ghz when it's available, and you can't force them to connect on 2.4.
The generic solutions are:
1. Move far enough away from the router so that the phone can't connect on 5ghz. Because 2.4ghz has greater range, the phone will switch to 2.4ghz. Unfortunately, if the phone needs to be in bluetooth range of the device, or to be able to scan a QR code or some other identifying attribute, you'll be too far away from the smart device for this to work and solve your setup problem.
2. Turn down the radio strength of the 5ghz band and unplug all your satellites temporarily. Go to the desktop portal to your router (192.168.1.1) and click on the Advanced Settings tab, and then Advanced Setup, and then Wireless Settings. You should see settings for the 2.4ghz and 5.0ghz bands on this page. You want to change the Transmit Power Control value from 100% to 25% to reduce the broadcast strength of the 5.0ghz radio. In theory, this is doing the opposite of (1) above, by shortening how far the 5ghz band will reach and giving 2.4ghz a chance to be the best choice for your phone to connect to. Unfortunately, the Orbi routers, particularly the higher end ones are still able to reach a considerable distance, even at 25% power (I've had laptops and phones with only 2 bars of signal strength, still preferring 5ghz at 45ft from the router). So, if you're trying to install a video camera or doorbell or even a light, and you can't move the router far enough away, this will not solve your problem, but it's worth a try.
3. If (2) didn't solve the problem and your phone still won't connect on the 2.4ghz band, then the next thing to try is to turn off the AX functionality (the Wifi 6 features) if your router has Wifi 6. Leave the 5ghz radio set to 25%, and go up to the regular Setup link (still on the Advanced Settings tab), and then choose Wireless Setup. At the top of this page, you will see Enable AX-This Wifi Mode Will Enable AX Features. You'll want to uncheck the two boxes below that -- turn off both 2.4 and 5.0 bands. Apply that change and wait for the router to reset. Then go try again to see whether your phone can connect to the 2.4 band. (For both steps 2 and 3, if your phone is near the device that you need to configure with the app, you'll be able to see on the Basic Settings tab under Attached Devices what things are connected to the network and what band they are connecting on.)
If none of these power adjustment settings tweaks work, then you are at the end. There is no access to a finer level of control. You can't turn off the 5.0ghz radio, or split the networks and give 2.4ghz a different name, nor do you have any settings that can force devices onto the 2.4ghz band that you need.
Generally, at this stage, Netgear advises that the best/only solution is to upgrade your Orbi system to the 960 series, where features that you expected to have on lower end routers, are once again added that allow you to force things onto 2.4ghz. It isn't called 2.4ghz, but rather the IoT (Internet of Things) band -- i.e. the 2.4ghz band where most smart devices live. With this, you can temporarily connect your phone to the IoT band, and set up your smart devices. Unfortunately this fix can cost you a lot more money -- from the 760 to 960 Orbi is a $700 jump, and from 860 to 960 is $500 more. Anything below 760, and you're looking at $1000 or more to get this expected feature.
Netgear claims all this is by design, and that the power of Orbi systems is they're simple to set up and just work. Unfortunately, what they've overlooked or misunderstood is that one of the reasons people get mesh networks is because they have, or plan to have, a lot of smart devices, and want a problem free network where signal coverage spans their entire home for everything that needs to be connected. And, the types of people who buy mesh networks are the ones most likely to have smart appliances, and vice versa. Which makes all of this a design error of gross negligence. You shouldn't have to spend $1500 to connect smart doorbells and lights that you had successfully connected with equipment that cost a fraction of that price, nor should a feature that is simply expected only be available in the most expensive product that most people who are not super power users or businesses will ever need. Unfortunately if you need the high bandwidth and speeds that Orbi supports throughout your home, the only choice is to get the top end product if you also have smart devices that need to connect.
Like many of you who will read this, I've learned all this the hard way. It never occurred to me that the most advanced networking technology made would be unable to connect to smart appliances that we've been using for years. Or that I'd be looking at a substantial upgrade to a very expensive purchase in the first days after installing it. But, this is the only full and truthful explanation you'll find.
Netgear doesn't have this anywhere on their site or documentation, and their sales advisors don't know this when steering you to the "correct" purchase decision for your needs. And, no one asks the simple (common) question "do you intend to connect smart products", and then tells you why you'll need the 960 for that. The support engineers know it, but it will take you 4-8 hours to get this from them, at which time they'll tell you this is the reason the 960 is designed as it is, because they've had thousands of customer complaints about this single problem, and it's one of the most common issues they hear from unhappy customers.
bad_guy wrote:
The answer to this will not make you happy, but users need to know this when considering purchase of an Orbi system or when tearing their hair out because most (if not all) of their smart devices cannot be connected or configured on the network.
This has not been my experience, nor does it appear that most Orbi customers face such issues, nor are the issues that do come up unique to Orbi.
- Aside from one smart plug, every 2.4G device that I have wanted to connect simply connected. From the original Nest thermostat to the latest smart plugs, window blind controllers, inexpensive security cameras, etc. They all connected. Only one time did I have to disable the 5G signal (which cannot be done on any of the newer Orbi systems, not even the 960 series).
- If every Orbi customer could not connect most of the IoT things they bought, there would be so many complaints that Amazon, Best Buy, Costco and the forums would be overwhelmed. Seriously, if nearly every system sold failed to connect IoT gizmos, all of those outlets would stop selling Orbi. I would also expect to see reviewers blasting the product, "Avoid this like the plague because no IoT things you buy will connect to it!"
bad_guy wrote:
If none of these power adjustment settings tweaks work, then you are at the end. There is no access to a finer level of control. You can't turn off the 5.0ghz radio, or split the networks and give 2.4ghz a different name, nor do you have any settings that can force devices onto the 2.4ghz band that you need.
Not exactly "at the end". The technique of temporarily creating a cell phone Hot Spot on the 2.4G band works not only with Orbi, but with any brand of mesh WiFi that is incompatible with the smartphone app for a specific device. (Not the device; the app.)
This is not to absolve Netgear. It would have been nearly trivial to keep the option to disable broadcasting the 5G SSID (or even add an option to turn the radio off entirely).
I can't speak to what "most customers experience" (and I didn't say that), nor do I think anyone who isn't handling complaints and returns for Netgear has any better knowledge. I do know that I have seen hundreds of people asking the questions and complaining about it online after I experienced the problems myself and went searching for a solution (including on this community forum). And I can only tell you what the Netgear ProSupport agents have told me, which is that the reason the feature exists on the 960 is because not being able to connect smart devices on the consumer Orbi products was the number one complaint and support issue they have to handle due to removing some simple features that have always been there in previous generations of routers. There are even magazine columnists who've reported on how angry users have been that these features were deleted.
I don't think it matters whether it's most customers, but it does matter that if you have this problem, it will affect almost all smart devices in your home. I can't reconnect a video doorbell, a smartlock, or some smart lights, and I spent at least 4 hours troubleshooting with a support rep to try to make it work. But there are probably a good number of customers who haven't tried yet, so we also don't know whether they'll eventually encounter it. Besides, if the number is only 5%, that's too high, but I'd wager that it's actually between 10-30%, and maybe higher. And, when you've purchased one of the most expensive consumer network products on the market, you simply don't expect this kind of headache, or to need to return it because of bad engineering design decisions.
There ARE Orbi products that do connect, in particular, the business line of the same routers. But unfortunately, one doesn't automatically assume that the business product would be the better choice for home use, especially when the Netgear site steers you away from that line, and the presales engineers tell you a particular product is best for you based on the questions they've asked you, and they explain their reasoning. In fact, when I discovered that the business version of the same product did not have this issue, I went back to Netgear and asked them to explain the differences between the two products, but no one on either the business or consumer side of the house could tell me anything about the product they didn't sell, and that in itself is a problem, because they can't truly recommend the best solution for your needs if they don't know. From what I've found out, my suspicion is that almost everyone would be better off buying the business product, which offers more control and more configurability, and is offered at a lower price.
Regarding temporarily creating a hotspot on the 2.4ghz band, that assumes you are paying your phone service for hotspot functionality, and forcing 2.4 is only supported by some phones. Sadly, my phone is two years old, and doesn't have this feature. And, if it did, it would not be on the same network (SSID) which is a requirement for most apps. Yes, I know that it's a lazy programming decision by the app writers, but that doesn't make it work.
Not that most readers will care about this, but this was a deliberate and bad engineering design decision. I was told this is the way the consumer products were designed to work, to be simpler. But taking away features that are needed to accomplish common tasks that the sweet spot of your market wants/needs does not make the product simpler, but actually accomplishes exactly the opposite, and is extremely frustrating. The assumption is that we're all dumb users who can't find the "on" switch, and who will be intimidated by a button which lets you turn off the 5ghz radio, or to specify that my phone NEEDS to connect to 2.4. But for some really bad design choices, all of this would be dead simple to do, like almost everything else with Orbi is.
Not only would it have been nearly trivial (which I told them myself), it was actually more work to remove the feature than to have left it alone, and if you've already created a feature to attenuate the radio to 25%, how difficult can it be to add 0% at the bottom of the list of choices?
As new user of the RBR750 + Satellites; and I have to thank 'bad_guy' for helping me understand the root cause of my IOT problems. Specifically, I have DEKCO cameras on my property, which stopped working as soon as I installed the my new ORBI, from Costco. My old DLink handled my Network & Camera without problem; but I wanted to upgrade to a MESH system for better coverage. I was not expecting to step backwards in flexibility & usage, by upgrading to a new product that claimed to support 2.4G & 5G systems.
I have to admit that the 'HACK' suggested by 'CrimpOn' worked for me. I was able to use my Smartphone's 'Hot Spot' resources to get my Camera on the Network. The specific trick is to use your Home's Network's Name & Password, in the Hot Spot; to initially set up the 2.4G Only Camera. Without that workaround, my ORBI would have definitely returned to Costco; and it still may go back for other performance reasons. It has been far from Plug & Play experience, in my case.
You're welcome. I wish this info had been there for me to find, and would have expected something from Netgear themselves to this effect. They definitely know about the problem, but choose not to acknowledge it or provide the needed help.
For me, none of the potential workarounds work, without spending a huge amount of money. I only have two choices: buy a new iPhone to replace my top of the line phone that's just over 2 years old (so I can toggle the Hotspot compatibility switch that was introduced on the iPhone 12, which forces the phone to operate on 2.4 ghz), or upgrade to the 960 Orbi (the upgrade cost alone is more than I spent for the system I have, but other than connecting to smart devices, it has no added value to me -- I'm already operating at the maximum speeds offered by my internet service provider and top end modem).
I'm looking at switching to the business gear, but Netgear seems to think that's a bad idea (I think it's poor support on their part to discourage it and not have information available on what the issues are or what the precise differences are between the two).
It's a nasty snag that Netgear should have addressed a long time ago with firmware updates and/or a rewritten dashboard that adds back this basic functionality that they took away. Or, they should get rid of the 760 and 860 series Orbi's and replace them with the 960 for the same cost.