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Forum Discussion
ORBI RKB50 and UPnP/IGD - Broadcasting in AP mode
I am running a pfSense Router and Firewall now (since Oct 2021) and using my ORBI RBK50 in AP mode (Router Firmware Version V2.7.3.22). I have been trying to find a way to disable the UPnP/IGD funct...
p.s. found an app for Android. called UPnP Scanner. It reports the same three devices on the network (DVD player, Sonos speaker, Plex Multimedia Server).
The common thread is that none of these apps can scan the Orbi WAN (public) interface.
(Damn, this is fun!)
After placing that test Orbi router in Access Point mode, (TaDa!) NOW the UPnP Scanner app "sees it":
Netgear,Inc NETGEAR Orbi DesktopAC3000 Router RBR50
Friendly name: RBR50 (AP)
Device Type: urn:schemas-pnp-org-device:WFADevice: 1
Base URL: http://192.168.1.80:56688
PresentationURL: http://www.orbilogin.net
Services: urn:schemas-upnp-org:service:Layer3Forwarding: 1
I logged into the router to double check: On the web interface, the UPnP menu option is greyed out. As the Orbi is not acting as a "router", the function to enable UPnP is not accessible.
My guess is that you have discovered a Bug. When the router is in "router" mode with UPnP disabled, then it does not respond to discovery probes. When in AP mode, it does respond but cannot actually "do anything." I have a feeling that this might have to do with changes made to the eth0 interface because of the change in mode. There's a lot that is different based on mode. Router mode is Layer 3 (IP). Broadcast packets do not pass through the Orbi WAN port in either direction. AP mode is Layer2 (ethernet), so broadcast packets do pass through in both directions. Waaay over my head.
I am glad you think this is "FUN" - LoL
I agree - it is a BUG - and given that these puppies (when I bought them - were considered "Premium" devices) this concerns me that something this simple is overlooked. If it was DISABLED in Router Mode - it should not start listening or broadcasting on UPnP port when the mode changes.
Given that this the RBR50 / RBS50 are both basically running OpenWRT (limited and lots of things disabled) - they need to fix this or allow OpenWRT to create a Firmware which gives access to Everything.
Who even knows if NETGEAR reads these posts and will even address this - probably blow it off, given they have their "SHINY NEW WIFI 6" Orbis out there now...and in their lameness do not offer an UPGRADE discount to us other ORBI owners - especially with the CHIP SHORTAGES. Just expect us to TRASH 'EM and spend another $400-600 to upgrade.
So NETGEAR - I ask - how do we fix this???
bearhntr wrote:
...... So NETGEAR - I ask - how do we fix this???
Considering the
clusterf**kfrenzy going on with Orbi AX model issues, my guess is that this UPnP issue is not likely to rate in the "top 10" for Netgear engineering. Software engineers do not spend time browsing the forums, so no one going to look at it until support makes a case to management that the problem needs to be fixed.To "complete the test", I put the Test Orbi back into router mode and verified:
- When UPnP is not enabled, a UPnP scanner connected to the test Orbi (not the primary network) did not detect any UPnP function.
- When UPnP is enabled, the UPnP scanner detected the Orbi router as an Internet Gateway Device, which it is when enabled.
(Note that this is different than the report on the Orbi when in AP mode, which did not claim to be an IGD.)
This is where my lack of network sophistication comes in. What damage does this UPnP flaw do?
- Will devices on the network not be able to find media servers?
- Will media servers not be able to announce themselves on the internet (if that's what the user wants and the primary router supports that capability)?
I think damage is the key element. an explanation of how this affects operation.
I cannot understand why there is no DD-WRT for the Orbi. I have looked at Voxel's stuff - but that appears to be a NIGHTMARE!! to implement.
bearhntr wrote:
I cannot understand why there is no DD-WRT for the Orbi. I have looked at Voxel's stuff - but that appears to be a NIGHTMARE!! to implement.
The folks behind DD-WRT simply have not chosen to implement on the Orbi platform. No idea why (or why not).
Voxel's firmware is almost trivial to install. (I have done it myself.) The only "gotcha" is to manually load a specific version of stock firmware first (as described in the READ.ME file.). There are huge sections of the Orbi code that Voxel cannot change because they are proprietary binary files. My guess is that whatever affects UPnP is in that part of the code, and thus Voxel's firmware will behave the same way. (That experiment is more than I want to do right now.)
I remain ignorant about what damage it causes to have the Orbi router announce what it is and what it might be capable of, while clearly not claiming to to be an internet gateway (IGD). I am used to kids saying, "Oh Grand Pa. You just don't get it." (and maybe I really don't.) My little network did not seem to melt down when I put that test Orbi into AP mode.