New - RBR750 / RBS750 Firmware Version 4.6.7.13 Released

What is the Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

What is the Mfr and model# of the ethernet switch in the configuration?

What is the size of your home? Sq Ft?
What is the distance between the router and 📡 satellite(s)?

What channels are you using? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and 40 to 48 channel on 5Ghz.

Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

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MNChuck wrote:

I have an Orbi 753 system (router, 2 satellites) and upgraded manually to 4.6.7.13 using the process recommended here:  updated the satellites first, then the router, then powered everything off for about 10 minutes and restarted the router and then the satellites.  This firmware update was done on March 24.  The Orbi portal shows the router and both satellites on the latest version of firmware.  The satellites are both hardwired back to the router and I have previously gone through the process of making sure that the ethernet switches in my system are compatible with the Orbi.   My system was very stable on the previous version of firmware (4.6.7.5) which I had also updated manually back on January 18 using the same manual update process as described above.

Since the firmware update, I have had the wireless network in my home disappear several times.  It just happened again a few minutes ago and I was able to verify that the router remained operational as a PC that is hardwired to the router continued to have internet connectivity, but devices connected wirelessly to the router showed no wireless network in the home.   After about 5 minutes the wireless network reappeared, but both satellites displayed the blue light as they started up again;  the routed did not display the white flashing or solid light.

I am not sure what to do at this point to get this system to be more reliable on this latest version of firmware, but would welcome any suggestions.

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Thanks for the quick response on this. 

The modem is a Netgear CM1150V and the ethernet switches are Netgear ProSafe GS105E's.  The house is 5000 sq ft on two levels;  one satellite is about 50 feet from the router with an interior wall in between, and the second satellite is about 50 feet from the first satellite with interior walls in between as well.   But as I indicated in my post, both satellites are hardwired back to the router.

I do have neighbors in houses detached from ours, and at least one of their wifi networks shows up in my house though interference has never been an issue.  But, I will try designating the channels as you suggested.

I think it is significant that both satellites disconnected from the router for some reason while the router remained able to provide wired internet connectivity to a PC wired directly into the router.  To me, this would eliminate issues with the modem or ISP provider, and would seem to point to an issue with the Orbi system.  What could cause wired backhaul satellites to lose connection to the router while the router continues to operate.

One other detail - when I was unable to access the wireless network, the 'Guest' network on my Orbi system was also not working.

Yes, same here.

This firmware is still buggy af. Devices disappear, devices have temporary disconnects, even if they are in the same room then the rbr or rbs. The wifi speed is not even constant and sometimes my devices have no access to the internet, especially iPhones and iPads. I have to reconnect manually. This is still a shame.

I would give the system a full factory reset and setup from scratch. 

Also that switch has some 'Green Ethernet' features. Something that maybe causing problems with your system. Seen some switches work ok but others give problems. 

Also be sure LAN cabling is good. CAT6 is recommended. You might use CAT6A Shielded Twisted Pair (STP) between the modem and RBR. Shortest lenth possible.

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MNChuck wrote:

Thanks for the quick response on this. 

 

The modem is a Netgear CM1150V and the ethernet switches are Netgear ProSafe GS105E's.  The house is 5000 sq ft on two levels;  one satellite is about 50 feet from the router with an interior wall in between, and the second satellite is about 50 feet from the first satellite with interior walls in between as well.   But as I indicated in my post, both satellites are hardwired back to the router.

 

I do have neighbors in houses detached from ours, and at least one of their wifi networks shows up in my house though interference has never been an issue.  But, I will try designating the channels as you suggested.

 

I think it is significant that both satellites disconnected from the router for some reason while the router remained able to provide wired internet connectivity to a PC wired directly into the router.  To me, this would eliminate issues with the modem or ISP provider, and would seem to point to an issue with the Orbi system.  What could cause wired backhaul satellites to lose connection to the router while the router continues to operate.

 

One other detail - when I was unable to access the wireless network, the 'Guest' network on my Orbi system was also not working.

 

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If you turn OFF the RBS, does the RBR by itself see this problem? 

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Theobuck wrote:
So, the reboot of the ONT & Router + Satellites for ten minutes didn't help. The devices show up till the next morning, then nothing. My connection seems good for WiFi and connected devices with no speed drops, just the odd status of the network. It seems important to know what is connected and what isn't. 😕
Anyway called Gearhead support again, they reflashed the router, and the agent talked to the engineering team. From what I understand, I am not the only one who reported this issue, and in a week or so, he said there would be a new release (patch) for the new FW version. 🤞

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Is there a way to do the full factory reset using a saved file of my current set up, or do I need to start over as when the system was just purchased?   And to start the process, do I push the reset on the router and both satellites?  I dread doing a complete setup as when new as that took a number of tries and calls to Netgear, and calls to Netgear are not an option now.

I read in another message in this string that someone heard from Netgear that there may be a patch for this software version soon, so I may just wait for that and then give it some time to see if the system is more stable.

I echo the comments of many others on this and other message strings on this community site regarding how frustrating it is to be having such severe and prolonged issues with a very expensive system from what used to be a brand that could be trusted.  It is especially frustrating that Netgear doesn't provide free technical support for longer than the initial 90 day purchase period - that is really meager for this type of product and is such a poor contrast to a great consumer brand like Apple.

I do really appreciate, however, the time and efforts of the advisors on this site who are providing support!  We would be completely lost without that resource and help!

Yes you can factory reset and use a back config from file. 

https://kb.netgear.com/000062080/How-do-I-back-up-the-configuration-settings-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-System

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MNChuck wrote:

Is there a way to do the full factory reset using a saved file of my current set up, or do I need to start over as when the system was just purchased?   And to start the process, do I push the reset on the router and both satellites?  I dread doing a complete setup as when new as that took a number of tries and calls to Netgear, and calls to Netgear are not an option now.

I read in another message in this string that someone heard from Netgear that there may be a patch for this software version soon, so I may just wait for that and then give it some time to see if the system is more stable.

I echo the comments of many others on this and other message strings on this community site regarding how frustrating it is to be having such severe and prolonged issues with a very expensive system from what used to be a brand that could be trusted.  It is especially frustrating that Netgear doesn't provide free technical support for longer than the initial 90 day purchase period - that is really meager for this type of product and is such a poor contrast to a great consumer brand like Apple.

I do really appreciate, however, the time and efforts of the advisors on this site who are providing support!  We would be completely lost without that resource and help!

 

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I did end up doing a factory reset of the router and both satellites, and set the system back up from scratch using the orbilogin website on a pc connected to the router via ethernet cable.  That all went smoothly, and so far the system is stable.   Interestingly, my wifi connected devices seem to be working much better with no freezing of web pages, etc.

The only issue now is that the Orbi app on my phone does not recognize the system as being set up and is trying to get me to set it all up again.  Is there a way to get the Orbi app to see the system as set up?

Unfortunately, that is the only surefire way to make sure that things/memory/stuck stuff get cleared out and the new be really be new. 10/10 times if you use a backup, which I admit to doing, you could bring back over problematic things that developed that is putting you in this place. And a Power Cycle of each device after wouldn't hurt either. Start with unplugging the Orbi, then Sat 1, then Sat 2 and so on. Then Plug the RBR back in and let it come back up all the way. The Sat 1, then Sat 2, rinse and repeat.

Having to reinput the settings is a pain, I use to use PDFs of each page that needed changes to follow. Now I have done this so many times I have memorized many of the settings.

As far as the Orbi App, it should show you a selection saying that you want to do it manually. That should take you out of that App wanting to it. I have to use PPPoE login with a Tagged 201 VLAN that the app doesn't support. So I always have to do it manually. If it still acts up, I'd uninstall it, then reinstall. Yes, I too hate the way this sometimes doesn't mesh when trying to set thing up when you're in a bad mood as it is . . . .

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MNChuck wrote:

I did end up doing a factory reset of the router and both satellites, and set the system back up from scratch using the orbilogin website on a pc connected to the router via ethernet cable.  That all went smoothly, and so far the system is stable.   Interestingly, my wifi connected devices seem to be working much better with no freezing of web pages, etc.

The only issue now is that the Orbi app on my phone does not recognize the system as being set up and is trying to get me to set it all up again.  Is there a way to get the Orbi app to see the system as set up?

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After the last update I am having issues with devices connected to the Satellite dropping offline, in particular my thermostat. If I shut the satellite off and the thermostat jumps over to the router it immediately comes back on line and I can see it via its app or the web page. I performed a factory reset and am hoping this resolves the issue.  So far the thermostat is staying connected to the router instead of the satellite. I'd have to try 'forcing' it to the satellite to test whether the factory reset helped. 

Glad you got it working. Be sure to save off a back up configuration to file for safe keeping. Saves time if a reset is needed.
https://kb.netgear.com/000062080/How-do-I-back-up-the-configuration-settings-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-System

There seems to be a odd issue with Orbi app. We've passed this on to NG for review.

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MNChuck wrote:

I did end up doing a factory reset of the router and both satellites, and set the system back up from scratch using the orbilogin website on a pc connected to the router via ethernet cable.  That all went smoothly, and so far the system is stable.   Interestingly, my wifi connected devices seem to be working much better with no freezing of web pages, etc.

The only issue now is that the Orbi app on my phone does not recognize the system as being set up and is trying to get me to set it all up again.  Is there a way to get the Orbi app to see the system as set up?

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The algorithms behind the "assignment" of individual devices to a satellite or the router is a continuing mystery because it seems a) unpredictable and b) dynamic/changeable. Superficially, common sense does not always reign here, in that a device close to a satellite will connect to the router, or will connect to the close-by satellite and then later jump to the router, or vice versa, sometimes permanently and sometimes not. It is entertaining!

My experience is that the firmware's bias is toward the router so as to sidestep the satellite's middleman function when desirable, which does make some sense. The only solution I've so far found to "correct the assignments" is to reduce the transmit power of the router (in my case to 50 percent, doable only through the desktop interface) so that the satellites are more likely to reliably latch on to their nearby devices. I note this "reduced router power bias balancing strategy" as the assignment of individual devices to routers vs. satellites seems to be a pain point for some Orbi owners. I suspect that most don't care what connects where as long as the in-use performance of the connected device meets expectations. Please correct me if you have a better interpretation and good luck to all.   

My issue does't really lie with whether the device connects to the satellite or the router.  My issue is why when its connected to the satellite does it go offline and immediately come back to life when the satellite is removed from the picture and it jumps over to the router.  My satellite is about 30 or so feet from the router however the thermostat is pretty much halfway between the router and the satellite.

Saw same thing with NEST controllers couple of years ago. I found that with mine, one NEST controller being 4-5 feet away from the RBR. Would still ping pong back and forth thus causing the NEST to drain it's battery. I found last year that after I moved the RBR to a different location, 25 feet away the NEST stopped ping ponging back and forth. Also reduction in transmit power helps as well. 

What the distance between this one device and the RBR and RBS? 

It's probably about the same distance from both, I'd say maybe 12-15 feet.  The thermostat having the problem is on the same floor as the router, the satellite is upstairs. The path may be a little less obstructed to the satellite as it only has to go through the floor and not a wall. I'm not sure how much the signal from the orbi radiates downward? But this issue is new since the most recent firmware.  

So ya, being about equal distance from the device to the RBR and RBS, seems that it can't make up it's mind on which signal source to lock on. Turn the transmit power and see if this helps. You may need to move the RBS and or RBR around to see if you can get the device to lock on better. 

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Timothy88 wrote:

It's probably about the same distance from both, I'd say maybe 12-15 feet.  The thermostat having the problem is on the same floor as the router, the satellite is upstairs. The path may be a little less obstructed to the satellite as it only has to go through the floor and not a wall. I'm not sure how much the signal from the orbi radiates downward? But this issue is new since the most recent firmware.  

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I can give it a try.  It's very befuddling how it decides which to use. My wife's office is directly above the router and her laptop would be closest to the router but it chose the satellite which is on the opposite side of the house. 

Yep. It's up to devices to pick and choose where they connect too. 

This will be problematic for the controller if it's in between the RBR and RBS and the distance is about the same from the controller to the RBR or RBS. You'll need to move the RBS closer to the RBS then turn down the RBRs transmit power in hopes that the controller connects to the RBS. Again this is a controller issue with it handling different signals and preferring to connect to the RBS. 

Another possibility is that the RBS is not in a good state. Thus something on the RBS maybe wrong. A full re-load of the RBS firmware, factory reset, remove the RBS from the RBS web page and setup and resync of the RBS while in same room may help with this, then place back in remote location. 

Why not revert back to FW that was working for you as well. 

Can you draw up a floor diagram of where you have the RBR, RBS and these controllers at and give the distances? 

How big is your home? Sq Ft? 

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Timothy88 wrote:

My issue does't really lie with whether the device connects to the satellite or the router.  My issue is why when its connected to the satellite does it go offline and immediately come back to life when the satellite is removed from the picture and it jumps over to the router.  My satellite is about 30 or so feet from the router however the thermostat is pretty much halfway between the router and the satellite.

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This will be problematic for the controller if it's in between the RBR and RBS and the distance is about the same from the controller to the RBR or RBS. You'll need to move the RBS closer to the RBS then turn down the RBRs transmit power in hopes that the controller connects to the RBS. Again this is a controller issue with it handling different signals and preferring to connect to the RBS. 

Why has it worked for all this time and then after a firmware update its now a problem?

Another possibility is that the RBS is not in a good state. Thus something on the RBS maybe wrong. A full re-load of the RBS firmware, factory reset, remove the RBS from the RBS web page and setup and resync of the RBS while in same room may help with this, then place back in remote location. 

Already tried this. 

Why not revert back to FW that was working for you as well. 

I mentioned that as well.

Can you draw up a floor diagram of where you have the RBR, RBS and these controllers at and give the distances? 

Already gave approximate distances in previous post.

How big is your home? Sq Ft? 

Approximately 2000 SqFt.

I've given up on the issue. I've lost way too much time in my life on this. It's extremely frustrating to pay the kind of money that is being charged for these devices to have the amount of problems they do.  Look at this entire forum its all about problems that people are having with these devices.  I surely don't see many positive posts regarding these products.  

For now I've decommissioned the satellite and am only running the router.

I am curious about one other thing:

What does Netgear give you that you defend them so much?

And again I reiterate how can you trust what's being released when they can't even catch a blatant bug in the app with a totally missing device icon. It probably does't affect functionality but it sure doesn't promote confidence in their abilites.

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Timothy88 wrote:

This will be problematic for the controller if it's in between the RBR and RBS and the distance is about the same from the controller to the RBR or RBS. You'll need to move the RBS closer to the RBS then turn down the RBRs transmit power in hopes that the controller connects to the RBS. Again this is a controller issue with it handling different signals and preferring to connect to the RBS. 

Why has it worked for all this time and then after a firmware update its now a problem?

Possible NEST could have changed something on there side as well. 

 

Another possibility is that the RBS is not in a good state. Thus something on the RBS maybe wrong. A full re-load of the RBS firmware, factory reset, remove the RBS from the RBS web page and setup and resync of the RBS while in same room may help with this, then place back in remote location. 

Already tried this. 

 

Why not revert back to FW that was working for you as well. 

I mentioned that as well.

 

Can you draw up a floor diagram of where you have the RBR, RBS and these controllers at and give the distances? 

Already gave approximate distances in previous post. More accurate distanced would be preferred. 

 

How big is your home? Sq Ft? 

Approximately 2000 SqFt.

For this size of home, just the RBR is enough to cover so having the RBS and such in this size of home and the controller in between will be problematic at best. The RBS would not really be needed. This is NOT the first time NEST controllers have causes problems with Orbi. Again this is a handling on the devices side. 

 

I've given up on the issue. I've lost way too much time in my life on this. It's extremely frustrating to pay the kind of money that is being charged for these devices to have the amount of problems they do.  Look at this entire forum its all about problems that people are having with these devices.  I surely don't see many positive posts regarding these products.  

For now I've decommissioned the satellite and am only running the router.

I am curious about one other thing:

What does Netgear give you that you defend them so much? This is not a defensive thing. I've already troubleshot this with a NG engineer two years ago and spent time with collecting logs and trying different configurations. Some of this was dealt with by NG and also GOOGLE/NEST was involved as well possible NEST has done something as well on there side. 

 

And again I reiterate how can you trust what's being released when they can't even catch a blatant bug in the app with a totally missing device icon. It probably does't affect functionality but it sure doesn't promote confidence in their abilites. IMO, this isn't a FW bug, rather a environment and configuration issue. Again your size of home and placement of the controllers and RBS is playing a roll in what your having problems with. I see others are not having issues with there NEST controllers. So this mostly pointed to your environment and conditions and not being a bug.  

 

 

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Sounds defensive and deflecting from Netgear again.

 Examples:

1. Possible NEST could have changed something on there side as well. 

2. This is NOT the first time NEST controllers have causes problems with Orbi

3.IMO, this isn't a FW bug, rather a environment and configuration issue. Again your size of home and placement of the controllers and RBS is playing a roll in what your having problems with. I see others are not having issues with there NEST controllers. So this mostly pointed to your environment and conditions and not being a bug.

Number 1.  How did Nest change something? Last firmware update was 11/2/2021?

Number 2. How about this in not the first time we have seen problems with Nest thermostats on an Orbi system?

Number 3.  My environment hasn't changed. I've seen one or two posts in this thread doesn't mean others aren't having a problem and just haven't noticed it or haven't upgraded firmware. Are you a Wifi engineer?  

Agreed that the satellite may be overkill for the square footage but it is a two story house. It's sold as a "Whole home mesh system" with coverage up to 5000 sq ft. Well I am in the up to 5000 sq. ft. so that really shouldn't be a problem. And if it is then Netgear should let you purchase just the router.  

Try to take off the Netgear glasses and look at this logically to what has changed most recently and that is the Netgear firmware. 

The last firmware update on for the thermostat was 11/2/2021.  So Nest put a 5 month  orbi wifi bug in their firmware? 

There have been NO changes in my environment other than upgrading firmware. 

How can you without a doubt guarantee that there is possibly not an issue introduced?  Netgear does not have a great track record with their releases?