NETGEAR is aware of a growing number of phone and online scams. To learn how to stay safe click here.
Forum Discussion
Solved
Did I make a mistake with NetGear $$$$$
Caution very long post seeking honest opinions. I am 68 and computer electronics, read the F---- manuals smart guy with a rural since 1994 dial up internet home network I am IT?NOC guy for. Curr...
fredvon4 wrote:
I already know I am hosed with NetGear because no support for Genie and I do NOT want MY NOC on a Android tablet or smart phone.
I have not tried using Nighthawk routers in AP mode with an app, but I do know that I can use an app to control an Orbi router in AP mode.
I can also control more than one router on separate Internet account by enabling remote management and using Anywhere Access.
Again, you may have landed yourself with extra problems through your choice of devices. Using purpose built APs rather than repurposed routers might have been better.
I suspect that other brands will land you in the some territory.
Fair enough. My rant is too long and my frustration masked that I have a 2011 LinkSys network that works. I am getting a new ISP soon with 100Mbps down and over last several years we have accumulated more and more IOT stuff and newer laptops/PCs. I bought NetGear devices NOT NOW set up to replace my LAN in next 60 days. In preparation for the new deployment I have tried to read Every thread about this Gear on Tom's Guide and here.
Due to the refurbished nature of two devices
I have bought, with GearHead 6 months support plan:
R8000----4MRE0878A1FC6 refurb
R8000----4MRF097LA2F78 new but mid 2021 purchase
EX8000---5001815K01BE8 Refurb
With out looking I know they do NOT have latest firmware.
I want to log into each and do the following:
1. Update firmware I have already downloaded to my desktop
2. Change device admin password to something unique for each of the 3
3. Change the SSID of each radio and assign WEP3 passwords
4. Disable WPS
5. Enable Guest and assign a password
6. Save copy of each configuration file
I prefer to disconnect the desktop from my network and attach to each new device with Cat6.
I have a Win 10Pro 64bit desktop with USB dual band WIFI dongle and internal Real Tech Ethernet port.
My initial attempts to do this fail trying 192.168.1.1 or 1.2
I have a registered Android app for Nighthawk. It needs to see the new routers on the internet
GearHeads tell me I must connect each device to the modem directly to access the device.
There is not a device or setup specific question. There is frustration that the App and each device has a LOT of problem questions here that you guys have been answering for many years now.
I am questioning the wisdom of selecting this Brand and my frugal choices. It seems before I even deploy, I have to scan all my notes to set the firmware to something other than most current. And it seems any choices between bridge or AP mode limit the ability for Nighthawk App to see or manage the entire network.
fredvon4 wrote:
I have bought, with GearHead 6 months support plan:
R8000----4MRE0878A1FC6 refurb
R8000----4MRF097LA2F78 new but mid 2021 purchase
EX8000---5001815K01BE8 Refurb
As I suspected from the footer to your earlier messages, you may have set yourself up for trouble.
Do you have two R8000s on one network?
That is a bad set up. It means you have two competing with each other.
Two routers on your network can cause headaches. For example, you can end up with local address problems. Among other things, the other router can misdirect addresses that the Netgear router usually handles, such as routerlogin.net or the usual IP address for a router, 192.168.1.1.
This explains some of the other drawbacks.
What is Double NAT? | Answer | NETGEAR Support
Unless you have specific reasons for using two routers, it is often easier to use just one router and then to set up the second router as a wifi access point. Netgear advises this, as does just about every site you will visit.
I want to log into each and do the following:
1. Update firmware I have already downloaded to my desktop
2. Change device admin password to something unique for each of the 3
3. Change the SSID of each radio and assign WEP3 passwords
4. Disable WPS
5. Enable Guest and assign a password
6. Save copy of each configuration file
You will not be able to do those things with two routers.That's the "NAT" issue.
You can deal with the first problem, the firmware, one router at a time. You do not need an Internet connection to update firmware, just download the new version and update the firmware manually.
How do I manually upgrade firmware to my NETGEAR router? | Answer | NETGEAR Support
There is not a device or setup specific question.
I do not understand why you have come to that conclusion. You are trying to configure these devices in an incompatible way that the Nighthawk app was not designed to handle.
You van use two R8000 routers on the network, but you have to set them up correctly. The app can't manage that. It is designed to make it easy to set up simple networks that use the routers as designed.
To use two, you can put one of them into access point mode. You need to do that with a wired connection to the router. But do that and you lose some of the features on one of the routers:
Disabled Features on the Router when set to AP Mode | Answer | NETGEAR Support
That has nothing to do with Netgear's devices. All routers work in the same way and will hit the same brick wall.
There may be other issues on your network. For example, you haven't said what the modem/gateway is that connects you to the Internet. If that is also a router – many are – you are simply adding to the problems.
And it seems any choices between bridge or AP mode limit the ability for Nighthawk App to see or manage the entire network.
Again, you are trying to use the app to do something that it was not designed for. But you can manage both routers by tracking down their IP addresses – there are various ways of doing that – and using a browser to connect to the IP address of the device that you want to manage.
You can certainly create a network with your devices, although a bit more thought in advance might have led you to make different hardware choices.
I sincerely appreciate alll the time it took to send this advise.
Yes I know in my haste the twin R8000s were/might be a mistake
MY topology envisioned has main house fed with full capabilities of a R8000
The 2 Faraday cage 100% metal buildings will have Cat7 direct burial expensive 150+ foot runs...
Wife's Hobby shop has minimal High Bandwidth needs for her Quilting machines and one Low tech Smart Roku TV-- Planning EX8000 in that shop as AP
My 100% Metal is where I really spend 8~14 hours per day and want as my NOC with very high end computer, High end 4K TV, and three monitor array, NAS to share in the network.
Also several apps managing the property camera security systems, many connected in main ranch house on 2.4Ghz
WAS planning the second R8000 om my shop Cat7 back haul bridge or AP mode and your answer tells me either is a mistake for how I want to use my Apps for a total NOC
I suspect if I ran the NOC in the main house this would be doable BUT I cherish my time in MY man Cave
The Rural broad band ISP is a Motorola High Power point to point radio/MODEM 30' up my 40' Ham tower to a 6 mile away tower it is POe giving me a single Ethernet connection to MY user provided switches or routers. It would be about 200' Cat7 Run from the tower to my shop (doable with what I have on hand)...But ISP engineers doubts their POe injection dongle won't over heat trying to power the radio/ MODEM over that distance no matter how well the CAT7 is constructed 24 Gage copper vs typical 26 gage copper
My 300' away electronic gate has a video doorbell w/gate code key pad and can be 2.4 or 5 Ghz... To reduce 2.4 loads for all the IOT crap in the main house R8000 I have an out door dual band (illegal power level) I plan to set up in AP mode only for the 5Ghz connection to the Gate I will be POe Cat7 connected to a gigbit port on the R8000
We do not game
Should I sell the second R800 and get something different for MY shop?
I did not get a warm fuzzy that a second EX8000 would do what I want
fredvon4 wrote:
WAS planning the second R8000 om my shop Cat7 back haul bridge or AP mode and your answer tells me either is a mistake for how I want to use my Apps for a total NOC
So, there are three places where you want Internet, the house, the man-cave and the workshop.
You haven't said what now delivers the Internet on the house. But here's one possibility.
Use one R8000 in the house connected to whatever delivers the Internet from the ISP.
Run Cat 7 from the house into the man cave.
Put the second, man-cave, R8000 into AP mode. It should handle all of the toys you plan to use, as long as there's enough bandwidth from your Internet service provider. Sounds like most of it can be wired, so wifi isn't going to be crucial.
Run Cat 7 cable from there to the wife's workshop. Use the EX8000 in AP mode there. If she doesn't need wifi, then just by cheap switch.
Alternatively, depending on where the Internet comes into the house, put the main R8000 in the cave with a connection to whatever delivers the Internet from the ISP in the house. Then cable the cave R8000 to the AP R8000 in the house.
But this is where the problems could arise:
My 300' away electronic gate has a video doorbell w/gate code key pad and can be 2.4 or 5 Ghz... To reduce 2.4 loads for all the IOT crap in the main house R8000 I have an out door dual band (illegal power level) I plan to set up in AP mode only for the 5Ghz connection to the Gate I will be POe Cat7 connected to a gigbit port on the R8000In general you are talking about pushing wired Ethernet and wifi to the distance limits. The 300 feet to the electronic gate is stretching it for wifi, especially 5 GHz.
Looking at these distances, I wonder if you are trying to use mid range domestic network kit to its limits. For a start your radio Internet isn't typical. You have long runs of cables connecting various bits of kit around the estate.
Sounds like you have an interesting project in your hands.
Thank you
Some additional info. I can see %ghz from currenty linksys very old dual band nearly to the gate but 2.4 is steady and reliable. The Off brand Outdoor device strongly suggests that it's radios on 2 and 5 are (with the high gain onmi antennas technicall in violation of FCC power limits and absolutely not to be used near weather radar at airports....not an issue for me in my location. However this device has no GUI provision to reduce ERP to only what I need for reliable 5Ghz to the gate..IE all or nothing. My current analyzer surveys suggest all of my neighbors are defaulted to 2.4 ch 11 and 3 locked. Thus no 5ghz is evident except my network so I am confident the high ERP won't interfere with my low tech OLD neighbors...yet...
Based on my current and future ISP being Broad band UP MY Tower 30' 30Mbps down right now, 100Mbps next month I am not going to fuss with the provider engineers to try POe over 200+ foot to MY shop.
The real issue is The House R8000 feeding 2 end points with Cat 7 for back haul to the world----- and in The house, most all of the stupid IOT devices live on 2.4ghz, most WiFi only ...talking bulbs, switches, vacuum robots, indoor and outside cameras, a Thermostat, and too many Alexa snoopers.
I can deploy the WavLink out door 2 Band either from above the house or off My Man cave shop ....either way POe to an Ethernet port to the world. And for the singular front gate device, on 5GHz I think setting it with discreet SSID Name and password in AP MODE IS BEST.
Again I think I know how to cobble this all in a Managed network, I just can't seen to determine the BEST way to do it within NetGear Nighthawks Android APP (I do not want to use) or the OLD Genie App to have an all inclusive network NOC in My man cave
Again...Very state of the art NUC, lots of CPU power, Lots of fast memory, Multiple Terabytes of HDD and SSD drive storage, Thunderbolt 3 big 27 inch curved monitors, I do not game.
I already know I am hosed with NetGear because no support for Genie and I do NOT want MY NOC on a Android tablet or smart phone.