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300 quare meters, it is home and office. Today the WiFi coverage is provided by 3 AP, different brand, different technology, the signal is good everywhere, but it is not the same network,,, if I move from one AP to another AP the network drops, then reconnect, and I suffer also sticky clients
I need to understand if using 3 WAC505 (or whatever you suggest) I will be able to:
- roaming from one AP to another AP without loosing the connection. seamless roaming.
if I am in a Skype For Business call, I can not loose it and rejoin moving from one place to another!
This requirement is MANDATORY
- manage 2 SSID: one for family, one for work and eventually one for guests
- separate 2.4 and 5 GHz
- no WLC, I prefer for home something more easy anche cheap
The hand-over between two AP does typically take a fraction of a second, almost not audible during a VoIP call. In my understanding, 802.11r does only help where EAP, RADIUS & Co. are involved, as these hand-overs typically take several seconds.
OrbiPro supports 3 SSID and does support roaming and client load balance.
One SSID for office work
One SSID for family
One SSID with welcome splash page for Guest (Splash page is optional)
But if you want more advance features like VLAN and full controll. you can look at WAC505/WAC510/WAC540.
you have three hardware choices in WAC5xx series. each has its advantages. all of them will serve your purpose.
WAC505 (Omni-Directional coverage. the antenna pattern is almost circular, has good coverage, can be put on table, wall or celing)
WAC510 (slightly directional towards the face of the AP, suited for all and ceiling mount, designed for longer range)
WAC540 (Tri-Band Omni-Directional coverage. Since it is 3 radios and PoE+ power, it also have a larger range than WAC505)
All of them can be managed by Insight manager.
(This is $10 fee per device per year, you can try it out for free trail at www.insight.netgear.com )
Roaming :
Definition :
Seemless roaming : Clients ability to roam on same SSID (different BSSID) and maintiance network conntivity(L2 roaming). but there maybe few packets loss.
Fast roaming: This is very use when WPA-Enterprise is used.
As per the Wifi protocol, "When to roam" and "where to roam" is purly depends on wireless client.
How every all the above netgear APs and OrbiPro helps clients make a better decision/choices.
Netgear WAC5xx APs send out information via 802.11K/V beacons that clients can use to roam better.
When managed by Insight, 3 of WAC5xx will talk to each other (like a cluster and create a mobility-group)
That allows them to exchange message and a special logic called OKC. If the wireless clients can take advantage of OKC and 11R. it will also help. Insight also help set up RX RSSI thresholds to help with sticky clients.
Standalone APs also have RX-RSSI threadhold that helps with sticky clients.
Moreover... you (and all the communities) says that at the end of the story, the roaming depends on clients. I can not understand why:
At the moment I have 3 AP: ADB, tp-link and Netgear, same SSID, same security, different channels
If I am on the ADB and move in the direction of the Netgear, then very quickly the client switch to the Netgear, but if I am on the tp-link, then the client does not leave the tp-link until the signal is so low that the connection drops.
I switched off the Netgear, I swapped the position of Netgear and tp-link... nothing changes.
"on the paper" 3x WAC505 seem to be a good solution, but there is something that I need to drill down a bit more.
Jusr to avoid disappointment: The WAC505 are very inexpesnsive devices, come wthout a power supply (so you have to use PoE or add a power supply), and come with two radios:
2.4 GHz, 2x2, max 300Mbit/s
5 GHz, 2x2, max 867Mbit/s
In comparison, the WAC540 comes with three radios (and a heftier price tag):
2.4 GHz, 2x2, max 400 Mbit/s (that's kind of rethoric, most clients dont' support this anyway)
5 GHz low channels: 2x2, max 867 Mbit/s
5 GHz high channels 4x4, max 1733 Mbit/s
Optional static trunk with two GbE uplinks (one PoE, one plain network) as the overall speed can exceed the GbE capabilities under some conditions.
Talking about roaming, what is the difference when managing theese 3 AP let me say.... standalone and with insight?
The WAC5xx are supporting in local Web management and Insight management mode:
802.11k RRM. This feature lets the access point and 802.11k-aware clients dynamically measure the available radio resources. In an 802.11k-enabled network, access points and clients can send neighbor reports, beacon reports, and link measurementreports to each other, allowing 802.11k-aware clients to automatically select the best access point for initial connection or for roaming.
802.11v WiFi network management. On the same access points, this feature lets the access point steer its WiFi clients to the 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz band, based on the access point’s channel load. In an environment with multiple access points, 802.11v WiFi network management helps WiFi clients that are roaming to select the best access point.
OKC (Opportunistic Key Caching) based layer 2 fast roaming. Supports Assisted Roaming for clients using 802.11k and 802.11v.
The WAC5xx in Insight mode are supporting supporting in addition:
802.11r Fast BSS Transitions aka. Fast Roaming. This feature permits continuous connectivity aboard wireless devices in motion, with fast and secure handoffs from one base station to another managed in a seamless manner. The key negotiation protocol in802.11ispecifies that, for802.1x-based authentication, the client is required to renegotiate its key with theRADIUSor other authentication server supportingExtensible Authentication Protocol(EAP) on every handoff, a time consuming process. The solution is to allow for the part of the key derived from the server to be cached in the wireless network, so that a reasonable number of future connections can be based on the cached key, avoiding the 802.1x process. Note: This applies to WPA2-Enterprise deployments only, where 802.1x is deployed.
Moreover... you (and all the communities) says that at the end of the story, the roaming depends on clients. I can not understand why.
This is correct. These modern access points provide as much information as possible The only exception is when an AP radio does "drop off" a client after providing neighbouring information (other radios, other APs) - expecting that it will pick up a better suited one.
Access point or router based WiFi radios which appear to be "sticky" do not provide enough neighboring information (typically none), so the client has not much of a choice than wait till the signal does weaken badly.
Are you sure? Have you deployed 802.1x authentication e.g. against a RADIUS server in your network? 802.11r is about the 802.1x EAP handling and handover, not the initial WPA2-AES.
The hand-over between two AP does typically take a fraction of a second, almost not audible during a VoIP call. In my understanding, 802.11r does only help where EAP, RADIUS & Co. are involved, as these hand-overs typically take several seconds.
OrbiPro supports 3 SSID and does support roaming and client load balance.
@sonus_faber stay far away from Orbi unless you have a need for K.I.S.S. wireless Mesh. ... Sorry @nmhTester - chime back when Orbi Pro is a business class product like the Insight manageable switches and WAC. Hint: VLAN support. by VLAN RSTP, ... User friendly Mesh (just "throw in" wireless, wired, on whatever switch, no problems with network switch STP, in whatever combination, no need to configure wired or daisychain or whatever - these things must be done automatically. So you see .... I was never involved in Orbo or Orbi Pro Beta .... otherwise Netgear would have heard a lot of noise.)
When managed by Insight, 3 of WAC5xx will talk to each other (like a cluster and create a mobility-group)
That allows them to exchange message and a special logic called OKC. If the wireless clients can take advantage of OKC and 11R. it will also help. Insight also help set up RX RSSI thresholds to help with sticky clients.
That is a valid argument for going WAC and Insight.
Standalone APs also have RX-RSSI threadhold that helps with sticky clients.
Yes, this will make an associated STA disconnect early, and start the wireless client to re-associate earlier - if you are lucky and re near enough to another of your APs, it will find one.
Implementing some WAC505 in my home, same SSID, same user and password, same security, without the Insight, just stand-alone APs.
Will I be able to roam from one AP to another and avoid my clients (expecially Windows) to place a DHCP request each time the AP changes?
I am asking this question because I setup 3 Netgear consumer router (WNDR3700) as pure AP and:
- Android clients roam very very fast (no drops even in a VoIP call) and more over there is DHCP request during the roam
- Windows 10 clients move very fast from one AP to another, but each time the AP changes, Windows place a new DHCP request and, for some seconds they loose the IP and everything drops down.
