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R6050 DNS and DHCP

I'm posting here for the R6050. Why is there not a forum for this router? (Rhetorical).

The R6050 DHCP server appears to be updating clients with the Gateway ip address as the DNS server. I do not want this, but I cannot find a way to change this behavior.

I have keyed in a DNS1 and DNS2 server ip addresses into the Internet configuration to prevent the router from obtaining the DNS servers from my cable modem automatically. I thought this might also trigger the functionality to update the clients with the DNS1 and DNS2 addresses instead of the router address same as Lan Gatewway address.

I would like to be able use Google's Public DNS, or the ISP DNS servers, or possibly, although not likely, allow the router to provide DNS lookup for clients. This should be configurable.

Thanks,

James
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Re: R6050 DNS and DHCP

The router will/should act as a DNS forwarder and forward DNS lookup requests to whatever DNS servers you have specified in the configuration, or to your ISP's DNS servers if you haven't specified any DNS servers (assuming that you get the WAN ip & DNS entries from the ISP using DHCP) - in my mind this seems to achieve the end result you are seeking, which is to have your name resolution done using the DNS server of your choice.. The alternative would be to set the DNS server entries on each computer as if you were using a static ip address. I want to make sure you're aware, that your ISP, if they so choose, can "override" whatever DNS server you specify and force the use of a DNS server of their choice by filtering the outgoing DNS requests and redirecting them.

Give a man a fish, feed him for a day
Teach a man to fish, feed him for life.
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Re: R6050 DNS and DHCP

Yes, I understand the router would do the DNS forwarding as a default, but I've never used them that way and always had the option to configure the DNS forwarding functionality and DHCP to either provide clients with the router gateway for router forwarded DNS or provide DNS server ip's directly to the clients. Usually this would just be the DNS servers that the router get's from the ISP DHCP server, or the static DNS server ip addresses configured to the router.

I don't like losing this ability to decide how I want to setup my DNS on my clients and I really don't want to have to manually set every client this way. We must have something like 8 clients in our household.

Most ISP networks I've used don't get fancy with basic Internet functionality, why should they care what DNS servers I use? Plus, if the router has proper functionality I can certainly see that that is happening and the deprecate my configuration to use whatever DNS servers are provided to the WAN side of the router. The point is, that I should be able to choose, and this choice assists other types of troubleshooting.

This feature has always been available in the past with Netgear routers that I know of. Now it appears to have been removed in order to make the interface more user friendly. I do not want a router that can't be configured properly just so that it appears to be more friendly for plug and play functionality.

There are also good reasons for troubleshooting etc. to remove the router from doing forwarding duty and just let clients make the DNS request directly. Many web pages are now requiring multiple DNS lookups per page load.
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Re: R6050 DNS and DHCP

First - let me ask this question - let's assume you leave your LAN clients to get their DNS setting using DHCP - how does this prevent you from having your clients resolve a DNS query the way you would like it to happen? Option #1 - you leave the router with the ISP's DNS server entries, and the resolution is handled by the ISP's DNS servers. Option #2 - you set a DNS server of your choice in the router configuration, and the resolution is handled by the DNS server of your choice. What do you see as being the problem? The bottom line is that the name resolution is being done using the DNS server of your choice. Second - whilst I have seen other brands of router (Linksys comes to mind) that pass the DNS settings on to the clients, I've never seen a Netgear router that did it. Finally - you might surprised at what your ISP (whoever it is) does with your/their DNS - you may not be aware of how things are being manipulated, most people neither know nor care - I run my own DNS servers and will generally resolve from the root, and one day I was quite surprised to discover that my ISP had changed how lookups were being handled - I can no longer do certain types of lookup, because they have been blocked, in an effort to deal with SPAM - fortunately, I rarely need to do that type of lookup, and have the option on those rare occasions of picking up the phone and having the ISP administrator do it "on the other side of the filter". Oh - by the way - regardless of router functionality - you may never see how your ISP is manipulating your DNS queries, unless you're familiar with the CLI NSLOOKUP tool, and what to expect when you make certain queries - and there is noo prize for guessing how I discovered this.

Give a man a fish, feed him for a day
Teach a man to fish, feed him for life.
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Re: R6050 DNS and DHCP

Assuming the router forwards the forward DNS requests transparently and with no latency, theoretically there would be no difference between the functionality I am asking for and the functionality as you describe it. I confess to not knowing how a reverse lookup might work, or if it is even necessary for internet clients behind a firewall and NAT, but due to NAT it might be actually required for the router to "intefere" with the DNS requests.

And, yes it may be from Linksys routers that I developed an expectation (unrealistic?) to see this functionality. But, this was probably 15 years ago in the first consumer devices, so to see it missing now is a bit irking.

I have so much experience troubleshooting network issues with basic TCP/IP related services under pressure, in the middle of the night, with people looking over my shoulder, for literally 1,000's of clients on a network, that I'd like to forget most of that experience. But, from that experience I like to see predictable behaviour and to remove as many potential failure points as possible and I like to see some basic ip routing functionality the same throughout every device I own from my home router to enterprise class machines (which I don't deal with anymore.)

Often routers that implement DNS forwarding also may have some DNS cache or other performance hacks that can cause problems. Sometimes the DNS protocols are not implemented perfectly in the device. Also, when I see a client has both DNS1 and DNS2 entries that have been passed down from the ISP DHCP server, to the router DHCP server, to the client, I know that there is not a problem with the DHCP lease or other connection issue. It do not like to need to pull up another interface to work my way back up the chain or to need to reboot modems, routers, etc. in sequence to make sure each has completely obtained the DNS information from the next server up the chain.

And finally, with the appearance of Google Public DNS, and Open DNS, I would like to be able to have the ability to really control how my clients access DNS. It's not just PC's anymore, it's android phones, ipads, Netflix boxes (linux kernel), etc. I just don't want the router to be doing a lot, just basic routing, firewall, and NAT.

Yes, it may be a pet peeve, but considering that this functionality existed in the kernel firmware of most of these consumer grade devices long ago, and appears to possibly exist in the current Asus devices and Lynksys devices, I do not want to see it deprecated in the Netgear devices. I like the Netgear products I've owned and have considered going wall to wall Netgear, but now I am very concerned about the product management at Netgear and the dumbing down of the adminstrative interfaces of the consumer products.
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