Re: XR700 Glitching games during gameplay

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-05

So I bought this router about 3 days ago. First to get to the admin page (192.168.1.1) took a very uncomfortably long time and makes you wonder if you have a bad unit. Once the setup wizard actually appears on screen the delay between screens (usually just a white page) also makes you wonder if the unit has stopped responding or if it is just taking it's time. On the .10 FW The download speed did not come up but the upload speed did and was accurate. GUI on .10 was very muddy and not nice to navigate through and saw somewhere on a forum if .10 didn't work go back to .8 since .10 was only fixing (supposedly) a WAN drop issue. I don't personally experience this issue with .8 so I guess I'm safe. When getting into the router's settings, when selecting NAT type on both IPv4 & 6 as open, I'm still getting test results as it being a PAR Nat - should be a full cone on open NAT. Also setting the %'s to 70 and selecting Always for ABB we're seeing some very interesting issues in game. We play various games in this house from Rainbow Six, Fortnite, Overwatch, etc. So lets start with Overwatch - seems to hang a bit like lag spikes, also have had times where it feels it physically pulls your character backwards or your character will continue to move in a certain direction. As far as Fortnite and Rainbow, we're noticing issues where our player will shoot on the controler or keyboard and nothing will happen. Also reported in Rainbow where the character will glitch and also have movement issues like Overwatch. Traffic Prioritization is set up with both Xbox, PS4 and Nintendo Switch all as Game Console as well as 2 gaming towers - Both set up for Unreal Engine and one of them again for Overwatch. All devices in the house have been turned on at once at begining of setup to assign name and type in Device Manager. Geo Filter has been configured for 2 consoles (Xbox and PS4 in filter mode) and 2 gaming towers (in spectate mode). Geo Filter Map has been configured for our state (Arkansas) and has an Overwatch profile @ 1304mi. Strict Mode and Auto Ping are both enabled as well as Ping Assist set to 30ms, fast search has not been enabled due to possible unwanted high latency server connections. In settings SIP ALG has been disabled, Respond to Ping on Internet Port has been enabled in case one of our machines happens to be server in console playing. UPnP is also enabled as well as some fowarded ports. Lastly I have set the NTP to the correct time zone through Netgear NTP servers and checked to allow automatic adjustments for Daylight Savings. If you see any settings that are incorrect please instruct me the correct adjustments.

Netduma-Fraser · ‎2019-04-06

What web browser were you using? Were you accessing using HTTPS?

You don't need to add the consoles to Traffic Prioritization as DumaOS Classified Games does that, you're prioritizing it twice essentially which could be leading to your issues.

How are your consoles connected, wired or wireless? If wireless, 2.4/5GHz? Are ALL devices connected to the router, none to upstream modem/router?

Also could you use paragraphs please if you're going to write a lot, it was quite hard to read!

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-06

I use Edge and IE. I was accessing by IP - the default is HTTP but when I force HTTPS it gives a Cert error. I took out the 3 consoles in Traffic Prioritization and everything is gigabit hard-wired except the baby cam, Nintendo Switch, our phones (5), some TV/Roku's (5), and our laptops/tablets (8). I have 2 towers (Work Server / Plex Server) directly on the router, I have a cluster of 4 PC's, PS4Pro, TV and the a printer on one switch, I have the Xbox One along with a TV on another Switch and I do have another switch for the garage in case I need to bring some bench work home. As for the topology I'm using a CM600 in front with the XR700 directly behind and as I stated I have 2 towers and 3 gigabit switches on the router.

Sorry about paragraphs I'll try harder at grammar.. Oh, I also have lowered my speed from what the speedtest gave me to what I'm paying on my ISP which is 300/30. Hope this helps and I'll let you know my findings when we use the router a bit more with the changed settings.

Netduma-Fraser · ‎2019-04-06

Could you use Chrome please, that's our recommended browser so you should notice a difference there.

Okay that sounds good thanks. When gaming how many devices are gaming at the same time?

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-06

Ok, I'll install chrome and use that see if it's an improvement. Also when gaming can be anywhere from 1, 2 or 3 devices gaming at the same time. With this setup though we could eventually have up to 6 gaming devices gaming at the same time and with 4 kids it'll be just a matter of time.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-06

Just some food for thought, the overwatch glitching happens when it's just my PC gaming and almost no other devices active on the router.

Netduma-Fraser · ‎2019-04-06

Great let us know! The router can handle that many so that should be fine. That's interesting then, doesn't sound like a local congestion issue. What's the average ping you're getting to the game?

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-06

Just got home from a family outing. Installed Chrome as my son is about to play some 2k19 on the PS4 Pro (not online) and I'm about to go on some overwatch. Went to go into the admin GUI on Chrome using HTTPS and got this message:

Your current browser does not support HTTPS on DumaOS.

You have chosen to access DumaOS using HTTPS on Chrome which is not supported. Please switch to HTTP using the buttons below, or if you require HTTPS because you are accessing your router remotely, please use an alternative browser such as Firefox.

Remember this setting

I can continue with HTTPS - although I do have a message that it is not secure.

Ok. In game now playing Overwatch. Latency in game is 53ms. NetDuma tells me I'm getting 33-38ms. I didn't get to play much - it's family movie time. BUT I will keep you in the loop and let you know if I do see anymore glitching. Hopefully that did the trick. Sure would be nice to see that 33-38 in game but alas we both know that's a pipe dream living in the middle of the country. If I have anymore issues I will report back to this post.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-06

Quick question - Why can I only have 4 devices in the Geo Filter? I have 3 consoles and 4 gaming towers, it would be nice if I could set them all up for Filtering/auto-pinging.

Netduma-Fraser · ‎2019-04-07

That's correct for HTTPS, I wouldn't recommend using it. HTTP is just fine, there is no sensitive information on the router and it can only be accessed locally assuming remote management is disabled which it is by default.

The router tells you the direct ping from your router to the server. Games also have things like processing delay which add to the ping. There is no way for the router to detect this. Some games choose to add these values onto the ping, others don't. So that is likely what the discrepancy between pings is. The ping you have from the router, which is what you can control is very good.

If you had that many devices all playing at once then the map would be hectic. We've also found that it's rare for users to need more than 4 slots on the Geo-Filter.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-11

Just a quick question - what type of network topology should I be using directly with the router? For most routers I've set up and owned I've installed a switch coming off port1 of the router so every other device is connected to the switch or a break off from that switch (i.e. connected to another switch connected to the first). Is that still opimal for this series of gaming router or should I be using as many built in ports on the back of the unit as possible? Thanks for the fast responses.

Netduma_Jack · ‎2019-04-11

That topology is good. The most important thing is to ensure your Nighthawk is the furthest router upstream, directly connected into your modem. That way you can apply QoS rules to all traffic on your network.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-04-11

What Firmware is currently loaded?
What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too?

To go from PAR NAT to Full Cone NAT you have to set NAT Filter to OPEN on the router.

@PCLLC-JFenn wrote:

When getting into the router's settings, when selecting NAT type on both IPv4 & 6 as open, I'm still getting test results as it being a PAR Nat - should be a full cone on open NAT.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-11

Currently I'm on the .08 FW since .10 seemed very sluggish. No ISP modem using a CM600. NAT is set to OPEN which is why I thought PAR was abnormal but NG FW on the 8000, 8000p and 9000 also have this issue. Also after hooking up the TP-Link 8-port gigabit switch to the XR700 the lag came back in Overwatch. I took it out of the picture and things are smoothe again.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-04-11

The CM600 is an ISP modem. Just probably one you bought?

Have you done a full factory reset on the XR after downgrading and then set NAT Filter to OPEN then run the NAT test mentioned here?

https://badmodems.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=21

Im very curious as why the 8, 8P and 9 also have this issue. I'm seeing this with another model I have. Full Cone should be seen if set to OPEN.

@PCLLC-JFenn wrote:

Currently I'm on the .08 FW since .10 seemed very sluggish. No ISP modem using a CM600. NAT is set to OPEN which is why I thought PAR was abnormal but NG FW on the 8000, 8000p and 9000 also have this issue. Also after hooking up the TP-Link 8-port gigabit switch to the XR700 the lag came back in Overwatch. I took it out of the picture and things are smoothe again.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-11

The CM600 is not an ISP assigned modem but it is a cable modem. ( https://www.netgear.com/home/products/networking/cable-modems-routers/CM600.aspx ). My ISP (Cox) does not offer this modem but does recommend it - Most ISP modems Cox offers are Arris or Motorola. I had an R7800, R8000, R8000p and a friend of mine has the R9000, appart from the R7800 they all report as PAR when set to Open. It's Netgear having random dev teams patchwork their FW together like a quilt. It's not good practice imho. Everytime I upgrade/downgrade FW I always do a hard reset of the router and re-configure, tends to alleviate issues.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-04-11

What version of FW do you have on the R7800?

Do you know what the last FW version you had that worked with Full Cone?

Ya, Last issue I saw was with my CBR40, exhibited same issue. I worked with NG to get it fixed. I now see with with another model I have and one user on a different forum mentioned same thing. I've asked NG to look into this. This seems to be propagating across the router lines.

I use ISP Modem loosly to ask people what modems they have connected to there ISP.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-04-11

I understand. I tend to just ask my clients what modem/router they have. They usually tell me if it's an ISP issue or something they've bought. I RMA'd the 7800 as the QoS didn't work with Roku devices. The R8000 was RMA'd due to lack of muscle and also the R8000P because of multiple FW issues. I've since given up on the standard "Nighthawk" line and went to the "Pro Gaming" line. I don't remember what FW I was using on the R7800 because it was Beta from L3. I also did not get a chance to test the NAT on that device BUT on the R8000, R8000P, R9000, and this XR700 the NAT is always PAR no matter what you set it.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-04-11

Ok, this is good info. Thank you for giving details.

I've sent a PM to someone that I hope will have a look at this and let me know some information. Seems like this had been working and now it's not and it's propogating accross the router lines.

I'll try and post back if I get anything. May take some time.

You might go ahead and file a support ticket here and link this forum thread as well:

https://www.netgear.com/mynetgear/registration/login.aspx

I would let them know that you can also get debug logs and NAT Test logs as well. I've collected Java logs as well while running that test. Any and all data should hopefully help NG get this resolved. I would like the have the full cone back working again.

@DarrenM

@ChristineT

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-04-11

Ok, contact made. NG will be looking into this.

Will probably take some time so be patient.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-06-25

I how have a XR700 to play with for a bit.

I can confirm that NAT FIlter is not working correctly when set to OPEN:

XR700 with both shipping FW and latest v.10 loaded. Full cone is not showing when NAT Filter is set to OPEN.

Shipping FW 1.0.0.20
XR700: NAT Filter set to Secure

Address Restricted NAT: http://nattest.net.in.tum.de/individualResult.php?hash=0b26c9adccd38a9bcf7eb5f9e13f9c33

XR700: NAT Filter set to Open
Test 1 Address Restricted NAT: http://nattest.net.in.tum.de/individualResult.php?hash=cf61e881b487ee2fe40629446eae95b6
Test 2 Address Restricted NAT: http://nattest.net.in.tum.de/individualResult.php?hash=888362e460a1a63ec3e6c7fa52740d60

Updated FW with NAT Filter set to OPEN: v1.0.1.10
Address Restricted NAT reported with Windows 7 and OSX: http://nattest.net.in.tum.de/individualResult.php?hash=9e3b46f4c2b36f38f76b3a2b25adce19

Factory reset and NAT Filter set to OPEN:
Address Restricted NAT reported with Windows 7 and OSX http://nattest.net.in.tum.de/individualResult.php?hash=0ef0dd7bc2d5bbed451deece53fa8a61

My XR450 doesn't have this problem and reports FULL CONE NAT when NAT Filter set to OPEN.

Netduma-Fraser · ‎2019-06-25

Thanks for the heads up, I’ll pass this onto Netgear.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-06-25

Thank you much.

PCLLC-JFenn · ‎2019-06-25

No need. I've spoken with the L2 team about this issue and it was resolved in the XR700 V1.0.1.10 firmware. I can say with confidence that selecting open NAT on this version does report a full cone during testing. I still feel as the .08 firmware seems a bit snappier in the gui where the .10 variant seems to be sluggish (especially on a router with a 1.7Ghz quad-core) but it does work as intended with all features. Only place I've noticed an issue (and not really an issue if you don't have the topography) is when I connected the router direct to a switch, then piggy-backed the rest of my switches off that switch to various wired devices. Instead I run wire to the individual switches where the devices are plugged in. Good thing we have 6 LAN ports as I have 6 switches in various points in the house. Anyway, keep up the good work boys.

FURRYe38 · ‎2019-06-25

Interesting, I have not been able to get FULL CONE NAT with mine, with shipping for v10 FW.

What versions of browser and Java are you using to test for NAT?

I tried a Windows 7 laptop and a Mac Book Pro 2008. Both are not reporting FULL CONE NAT.

What modem is your XR700 connected too?

@PCLLC-JFenn wrote:
No need. I've spoken with the L2 team about this issue and it was resolved in the XR700 V1.0.1.10 firmware. I can say with confidence that selecting open NAT on this version does report a full cone during testing. I still feel as the .08 firmware seems a bit snappier in the gui where the .10 variant seems to be sluggish (especially on a router with a 1.7Ghz quad-core) but it does work as intended with all features. Only place I've noticed an issue (and not really an issue if you don't have the topography) is when I connected the router direct to a switch, then piggy-backed the rest of my switches off that switch to various wired devices. Instead I run wire to the individual switches where the devices are plugged in. Good thing we have 6 LAN ports as I have 6 switches in various points in the house. Anyway, keep up the good work boys.