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Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

two routers - RAX35 & R7850

RAX35 & R7850 are these known by other model numbers since they do not appear in the model drop down list?

 

RAX35 is being used as primary behind ISP modem/router. I tried using it in a bridged port but it always shows no internet so I just plug it in ethernet port and it works fine.

The ISP has a USB 2 port.

The R7850 has USB 2&3 ports which I would like to try using. And also use it as a range extender. I reserved 192.168.1.2 for the R7850 on RAX35.

First attempt was setting R7850 as an access point. The wifi seemed to work but I was unable to access it with browser or app.

I reset it and set it to use 192.168.1.2 and turned DHCP server off. Again the wifi seems to be working but I am unable to access it with a browser or the app.

 

Suggestions please to achieve full use of both devices. Both have latest updates. The R7850 would drop connection randomly requiring a reboot at a minimum and that is why it was declinated to a less important position.Unfortunately it seems the RAX35 does not have as much range and less features.

Thanks Norm

Message 1 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

Addendum: In Access Point mode the cable was plugged as in the demo diagram, into the wan ethernet port of R7850.

When DHCP Server was turned off I tried that port and a lan port on it. There seemed to be no difference. What should be the difference between a lan and wan port with DHCP turned off and using a changed address?

Message 2 of 12
Razor512
Virtuoso

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

With Netgear routers, if it is in AP mode, the DHCP is automatically turned off, and the router will instead become a DHCP client and get an IP assigned to it from the main router. It will then treat the WAN port as a LAN port, thus allowing for easy access of the web UI of the secondary router that was placed in AP mode. AP mode is well optimized, and maintains full hardware acceleration, and to client devices connecting to the AP, it is fully transparent to the client device.

 

ˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇ(Not needed for modern Netgear routers)ˇˇˇˇˇˇ

For older routers that may have lacked an AP mode, the old method used to be disabling the DHCP server, and then specifying a static IP to the secondary router (In the Advanced > LAN setup) page. For example, Disabling the DHCP server, and changing the IP to something in the IP range of the main network, such as changing it from 192.168.1.1 to 192.168.1.9). The secondary router will then be connected to the main router using an Ethernet cable from a LAN port of the secondary router, to a LAN port of the main router. The WAN port on the secondary router will then remain unused.

^^^Not needed for modern Netgear routers^^^^^

 

 

If the ISP supplied a router/ modem combo, then you will need to see if it offers a transparent bridge mode, or if they offer an option to supply just a basic modem. If the ISP is charging a monthly fee to rent a modem/ gateway from them, then please consider buying your own modem, it will be cheaper overall, with them often paying for themselves in terms of saved money within 1-1.5 years depending on how high end you decide to go with the device.

 

If it is a cable provider and they are charging rental fees, then consider going with good DOCSIS 3.1 32x8 cable modem. Both Netgear and Motorola make a number of really good models.

 

If you cannot avoid using an ISP supplied modem/ router combo unit, and you cannot get it into a transparent bridge, then put all of your additional Netgear routers into AP mode so that you can avoid a situation of a double NAT.

Message 3 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

In either AP mode or the manual setup I made sure it was using a specific IP so I should not have to hunt for it when typing into browser. Either way 192.168.1.2 does not work in Edge or Chrome.

Connecting to my primary router with 192.168.1.1 works great and the app also works. The app does not work with the second router. I see the connections on the second router from the interface of the first router which states wired even though it is wifi connection likely because of wiring between the two routers.

The ISP, Hargray, furnished an Arris modem/router. It seems they require their modem and don't charge me for routing since I have my own. There are setting in it that allow putting each lan port into bridge mode but then I have no connectivity. They seem to have done some software magic that learns the MAC address of routers connected to it and automatically puts them in a bridge. From my first router I see an internet address and not a DHCP assigned number such as 192.168.0.2

 

Message 4 of 12
Razor512
Virtuoso

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

If the main Netgear router is getting a proper WAN IP address, then that should be fine as is.

For the secondary router in AP mode, try allowing it to dynamically acquire an IP address.

Also make sure that you are connecting from the WAN port of the secondary router, to a LAN port on the main Netgear router.

 

The best way to narrow down any potential issues, is to check if the defaults at least work. If needed also consider doing a factory reset of the secondary router, then after doing a basic setup and giving it anew SSID and password (typically the same SSID and password as the main router, to allow for proper client directed roaming), put it in AP mode, ensuring that while in AP mode, an Ethernet cable runs from the WAN port of the secondary Netgear router, to the LAN port of the primary Netgear router.

 

When done that way, it should automatically handle everything else to become a properly transparent AP to any clients connected to it.

 

The nighthawk app can still connect to the secondary router if needed, though you will need to tap the home icon in the upper left hand corner of the app, and then tap the first entry that would list a router model, there it will show a list of all Netgear devices on your network, and you can select which one you want to control.

You can also switch using the network map.

 

Message 5 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

I shall retrace efforts but there are some glaring points.

My first effort with AP mode it was assigned 192.168.1.17. The results were the same as with all other efforts. No access with browser through main router or wifi. In all cases I see it in the app and it says disconnected. Clicking pops up device is offline. The only way I could access it even after connecting directly to computer is a factory reset. That is unless someone knows a trick.

 

RAX35 is dual band. R7850 is tri band. Also has the USB ports I want to use. 

Message 6 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

"You can also switch using the network map"  Please explain.

Message 7 of 12
Razor512
Virtuoso

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

In the nighhawk app, when connected to the main app, the the network app is able to show other Netgear routers on the same network, and clicking on them will give you the option to switch the app over to controlling that specific product.

 

Though the issue you are having is strange since the default behavior of AP mode is for the web UI of the secondary router, is to be accessible from any part of the LAN whether you are connected to the AP, or using Ethernet.

 

With it not loading, I wonder if it would be worth manually reinstalling the latest firmware for the R7850.

Message 8 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

Definitely will be trying that if I get to a state possible.

I reset it and hooked it in line to the computer. It brought the advice of using the app. Could not get it to connect so deleted it and went through redetecting. I get as far as saving the password with phrases and I get an error message saying it could not.

Decided to try the browser more and got this address http://www.routerlogin.net/genie_index.htm

with this message

Important Update

 
 

To avoid a conflict with your Internet Service Provider, your router's IP address has been updated to 10.0.0.1.

 

and what I was expecting was a message asking if this was my only router which I have seen in the past multiple times.

Yosemite Sam words repeated many times.

Message 9 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

Hidden offscreen was the 'next' button. I am experimenting I guess since I am hooked into the WAN on the second router and I continued. It allowed me to continue setup with the values the app refused to take. Guessing, the app had a problem with figuring the 2nd location for this router. Doing it with a browser it interpreted the first router as belonging to the ISP.

If Hotspot Shield, my VPN, is turned on I am not able to access the first router via the second with browser. Still more checking but it seems to be working albeit assigning 10.0.0.x numbers to connected devices and not being able to use wifi to connect to opposite router with app or browser through wifi.

Norm

Message 10 of 12
Moose-Squirrel
Aspirant

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

First I must correct or add to my last post/statement. The key being I may have had the VPN turned on for some of the testing.

With it hooked and numbers assigned as previously stated I found the following concerning accessing the routers, and I will include the ISP modem/router which apparently puts itself in some automatic bridge mode and is accessible via 192.168.0.1 via its wireless connection. And though I did not try likely through one of its lan ports.

Netgear 1, RAX35 is accessible at 192.168.1.1 via its wireless or lan port and Netgear 2, R7850 wireless or lan port at that address when using the WAN port on 2. Also accessible via the its app when connected to wireless from 1.

But Netgear 1, RAX35 will not allow connection to Netgear 2, R7850 via lan or wireless.

 

OH NO! WHAT CAN MAGICALLY CHANGE SSID? I was having wifi connection issue and when I checked RAX35 the SSID was mysteriously changed to RAX40-Pseudo.

What is this?

 

Message 11 of 12
Razor512
Virtuoso

Re: two routers - RAX35 & R7850

Many VPN applications will cause issues with Netgear's setup wizard, this is largely due to how they handle DNS, even if they offer a split tunnel or other basic segmentation functions, they tend to route DNS traffic through the VPN as a way of enhancing privacy and preventing leaks of your real IP.

 

The problem is that it doesn't play nice with one of the more annoying aspects of Netgear's setup wizard and that is the redirecting from the router's IP to the routerlogin.net page. Ideally it would be best if it did not change addresses when you specifically enter in the LAN IP of the router.

Often you will have to close any VPN applications that are running in order to avoid DNS related issues with the setup wizard.

 

Beyond that, under normal conditions, the AP mode is really self-configuring as long as the router that you are placing into AP mode has an Ethernet cable running from its WAN port, to the LAN port of the primary router.

Message 12 of 12
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