Reply

Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

When I look at the Network Map in the iPhone app, I keep getting always different network topology and differen colours for the devices (green, magenta, orange) every time I look at it!

Strangely enough I have no problems with connectivity and everything looks ok but this issue gets me crazy.

Also I can see a daisy chain topology while the setting is disabled. I tried to enbaled but the map keeps changing randomly ignoring the setting.

I am on the latest firmware V2.3.1.60.

Does anyone have an explanation? Is there any other way to see the mapIMG_6403.PNGIMG_6404.PNGIMG_6405.PNGIMG_6406.PNGIMG_6407.PNGIMG_6408.PNGIMG_6409.PNGIMG_6410.PNG

Model: RBK53|Orbi AC3000 Tri-band WiFi System
Message 1 of 27
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Please post about this in the Orbi app forum:

https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi-App/bd-p/en-home-orbi-app


@Daniel-UK wrote:

When I look at the Network Map in the iPhone app, I keep getting always different network topology and differen colours for the devices (green, magenta, orange) every time I look at it!

Strangely enough I have no problems with connectivity and everything looks ok but this issue gets me crazy.

Also I can see a daisy chain topology while the setting is disabled. I tried to enbaled but the map keeps changing randomly ignoring the setting.

I am on the latest firmware V2.3.1.60.

Does anyone have an explanation? Is there any other way to see the mapIMG_6403.PNGIMG_6404.PNGIMG_6405.PNGIMG_6406.PNGIMG_6407.PNGIMG_6408.PNGIMG_6409.PNGIMG_6410.PNG


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CM2000 Modem | Wifi Router SXK30(v.122) and R8500(v.158) Router Mode and Wired Backhaul | Switches NG GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3

Message 2 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

I tried to post it in the Orbi app forum... but there is a bug...  i.e. "Labels" are required to be selected (mandatory field) but no labels have been defined so cannot post there!!!

Does anyone have a solution for this crazy problem?IMG_6414.PNGIMG_6415.PNGIMG_6416.PNGIMG_6417.PNGIMG_6418.PNGIMG_6419.PNGIMG_6420.PNG

Message 3 of 27
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Troubleshooting doesn't work as a lable? 

Others are posting there...

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CM2000 Modem | Wifi Router SXK30(v.122) and R8500(v.158) Router Mode and Wired Backhaul | Switches NG GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3

Message 4 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

No! There is ZERO labels available to choose if you try to post in the "Orbi app" forum... sorry I don't have time to send you also a screenshot for this bug..

Message 5 of 27
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

No worries, I see whats happening. Just tried it.

The following labels are not available here: Orbi

Not sure what other users are using. Lets see if we can get some moderator help on this.

@Blanca_O 

@Christian_R 

@ChristineT 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CM2000 Modem | Wifi Router SXK30(v.122) and R8500(v.158) Router Mode and Wired Backhaul | Switches NG GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3

Message 6 of 27
DexterJB
NETGEAR Moderator

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Hi @Daniel-UK, we will look into the label issue. As for the app, may I know what version you have installed? Also, does the behavior stay the same after a re-install or on another device?

 

Dexter

Message 7 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

2.3.5.20 is the version of the iPhone app

Yes, same issue after reinstall and using it from other devices
Message 8 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

 

@Daniel-UK wrote:

Does anyone have an explanation? ...

@Daniel-UK, this could be a problem with weak/unstable Orbi backhaul rather than a problem with Orbi App itself.  If you look at the LEDs color presented by Orbi app, it's trying to tell you the same thing.  The Orbi can't make up its mind, deciding which network topology is best, hencing keep trying to find the most stable one.

 

I had experienced the same issue when I splitted my Orbi SSIDs, the Orbi would go crazy as seen in your case.  To check if your backhaul is stable, login to Orbi GUI, go to Orbi Attached Devices page, check if Orbi/Satellites are stuck in "Config Sync" loop.  Next, go to Firmware Update page and check if both Satellites report the same 'Status' as Orbi, "No new firmware version available", or something else like "Waiting for connection".

 

Message 9 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

This could be a reasonable explanation looking at the pictures and I also splitted 2.4 and 5 Ghz ssid
However
1) from the Web interface 10.0.0.1 the back haul connection is good. Only rarely I saw config sync
2) the daisy chain setting is disabled. There should be no daisy chain topology
3) the Internet speed is very good. However there seem to be handover problems when moving around

I tried all the suggestions from agents and found on the Internet (reduce power, enable/disable fast roaming,mimo, etc) but no luck to have a stable network with a stable topology
Message 10 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

@Daniel-UK, it could be that Satellites configs are not fully sync'ed to Orbi.  To be sure, please verify Daisy-Chain is indeed disabled on each Satellite.  Login to your Satellite's debug.htm page (http://satellite-ip/debug.htm).  There should be a tick next to Disable Daisy-Chain.  If anyone of them said otherwise, you will have to force it to refresh its config so that it could pick up the latest settings from Orbi.

Message 11 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app


@Daniel-UK wrote:
This could be a reasonable explanation looking at the pictures and I also splitted 2.4 and 5 Ghz ssid
However

I tried all the suggestions from agents and found on the Internet (reduce power, enable/disable fast roaming,mimo, etc) but no luck to have a stable
network with a stable topology

There's no setting that could save Orbi from this situation that I could find, except for mering it back to single SSID.  @MrMediaGuy had resisted and finally submitted.  Check this thread for the issues with splitting SSIDs and how it was finally resolved.  I was also skeptical when I first proposed the solution.

 

Message 12 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Thanks you so much @SW_ 

 

Reverting back to SINGLE SSID fixed all my problems.. except that iPhones often are connecting to the 2.4Ghz and getting only 50Mb/s instead of 100Mb/s...

 

I bought Orbi because reviews advertised the dual SSID.. now it looks like it is either accepting sometime a lower speed or return it back to Amazon..

 

PS. this community is Amazing.. but Netgear support is abolutely the very worst ever!

Message 13 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

@Daniel-UK, to improve 2.4Ghz speed, please disable 2.4Ghz co-existence (untick the box).  If that doesn't help, try reducing the transmit power for 2.4Ghz from 100% to 50% or even 25% to nudge the iPhone toward 5Ghz.  After you made the change, reboot Orbi and give it ~15mins for the dust to settle.

Message 14 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

I have already done exactly what you suggested. Unfortunately with no luck, even with 25% power the 2.4Ghz is preferred 😞

Now I have a perfectly working network but speed is limited because the band steering doesn't seem to work properly 😞

I read quite a few threads on this issue and also BEAMFORMING not helping/working..

 

As an alternative, is there a way to make the splitted SSIDs working? Should I try to get back to an old firmware?

Message 15 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

@Daniel-UK, can you try to forget the WiFi setup on the iPhone, wait for 2mins and then reconnect?

 

I also have RBR50 with 2 Satellites with couple iPhones.  My average speedtest for the iPhone is ~200Mbps-250Mbps. I letf my transmit power at 100% for both 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz.  Here is a picture of my wireless settings.

 

Orbi-Australia.png

 

Can you download NetSpot to check if your 2.4Ghz channel is shared with another device or neighbor?

Can you turn off all Satellites and try Speedtest using this link, http://speedtest.googlefiber.net with above settings?  (Please reboot Orbi and do at least 3 runs)

 

There could be some stale settings that are still stuck in Orbi.  We could clean those out starting with the Orbi itself if the above speedtest result is still poor.  We can do that next.  If we're gone through all the experiments and the problem still exist, you could go back to v210 and stay there.  You can disable auto-firmware update using this link.

Message 16 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app


@Daniel-UK wrote:

Now I have a perfectly working network but speed is limited because the band steering doesn't seem to work properly 😞


The iPhone tends to remember/reuse old WiFi settings and may not switch to a different band, especially when the same SSID is (re)used.  The Orbi band steering seems to work as expected.  Please check out this thread.  If your other devices do not suffer from speed issue, it's most likely an issue with iPhone settings.

Message 17 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

I experienced this issue also with my laptop. Not just the iphones. Speedtest gives me full speed when I am on 5Ghz but only ~50MB/s on 2.4Ghz.

 

I just noticed I have firmware 2.3.1.60 while you still have the 2.3.1.44?

Can you update your firmware and see if it works?

 

I will also try few reboots and other settings and let you know.

Message 18 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app


@Daniel-UK wrote:

I experienced this issue also with my laptop. Not just the iphones. Speedtest gives me full speed when I am on 5Ghz but only ~50MB/s on 2.4Ghz.

 

I just noticed I have firmware 2.3.1.60 while you still have the 2.3.1.44?

Can you update your firmware and see if it works?

Oh, that picture is from a prior firmware version, but those settings have not changed since day 1.  I'm currently on v60 and I did not have slow speed issue.  BTW, 50MB/s (Mega Byte per sec) is much faster than 50Mbps (Mega Bit per sec).  I don't think Orbi can get 50MB/s on 2.4Ghz or we wouldn't be having this discussion.  Smiley Happy

 

Assuming your Orbi gets 50Mbps, it implies your device is either not compatible with 40Ghz band, not able to use 40Ghz band, or 2.4Ghz/5Ghz Co-existence is not active on Orbi.

 

To check this out, try these two tests:

  • Toggle "Enable 20/40 MHz Coexistence" (Enable/Apply, Disable/Apply)
  • Disable 5Ghz broadcast, verify that client is connected to 2.4Ghz, then run speed test
  • Disable 2.4Ghz broadcast, verify that client is connected to 5Ghz, then run speed test

 

Message 19 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Having disabled the "Enable SSID Broadcast" below for the 5Ghz doesn't turn off the 5Ghz band... even after few reboots and with the other satellites turned off.

i.e. there are still devices connected to the 5Ghz band

How can I turn it off?

router.png

Message 20 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Can't see the picture yet, it needs approval.

 

If devices are connected to 5Ghz when it's not broadcasting, it implies that those devices still remembered/reused their old settings to connect blindly (hidden network) unless Orbi rejects them.  To work around this problem, try to change to a new/different SSIDs for 2.4Ghz/5Ghz testing purposes.

Message 21 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

So the 5Ghz would be still on and only the SSID is not broadcasted? 

If this is the case then I could do the speed test from the device that is on each band. Or am I missing something?

Message 22 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Yes, that's correct.  It's akin to hidden 5Ghz network.  Yes, just verify the test device is connected to the right band for testing and ignore the rest.

Message 23 of 27
SW_
Prodigy
Prodigy

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app


@Daniel-UK wrote:
1) from the Web interface 10.0.0.1 ...

FYI, base on the Web IP address, 10.0.0.1, it seems that there's another router in front of Orbi and Orbi is also in Router Mode?  If that's the case, you might be in a double-NAT setup, which you might also want to avoid. 

Message 24 of 27
Daniel-UK
Apprentice

Re: Network map keeps randomly changing on iPhone app

Yes, I have the ISP router connected to the orbi router and you are right I have double NAT as I left the default settings.
Why should I change this and how can I do it please?
Many thanks
Message 25 of 27
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