Re: New - RBR850 / RBS850 Firmware Version 4.6.14.3 Released

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-03

Be sure to clear out all browser caches and browser save PW profiles.

Does this happen with different browsers?

So you a 10.10.10.# IP address string on your host router?

What browser did you use to update the system?
Did you manually download and apply the FW file to the RBS web page first then the RBRs web page lastly?

kotfu · ‎2023-01-03

> Be sure to clear out all browser caches and browser save PW profiles.

I did. In Firefox I went to Preferences → Clear Data, and cleared everything. In Chrome: Settings → Privacy and Security → Clear Browsing Data.

> Does this happen with different browsers?

Yes. Same error in Safari, Firefox, and Chrome, all on macos. Same error in Chrome on Windows.

> So you a 10.10.10.# IP address string on your host router?

Correct. My internet router does NAT and has an internal IP address of 10.10.10.1, and an external IP address of whatever Comcast gives me. My RBR850 is in access point mode with an IP address of 10.10.10.36.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-03

When you factory reset and setup from scratch, did you use Orbi app or a web browser?

If you using a web browser, did you set up the system while disconnected from the host router?

Are you using a Dynamic or Static IP address configuration for AP mode on the RBR? Static would be recommended.

kotfu · ‎2023-01-03

> When you factory reset and setup from scratch, did you use Orbi app or a web browser?

I used a web browser, and did a manual update (i.e. I downloaded the firmware to my computer, and then uploaded the RBR850-V4.6.14.3_2.3.12-signed.chk file).

> If you using a web browser, did you set up the system while disconnected from the host router?

When I initially did the firmware upgrade, the RBR850 was connected to the host router. After the firmware upgrade was finished and I started getting the HTTP error 500, I disconnected the RBR850 from my wired network, and then did the factory reset. I connected a single ethernet cable directly from my laptop to the RBR850, so I could log in to the RBR850 using the 192.168.1.1 factory default IP address. After applying my settings in RBR850 web interface, I powered it down and reconnected it to the rest of my wired network.

> Are you using a Dynamic or Static IP address configuration for AP mode on the RBR? Static would be recommended.

Dynamic IP address. Agree there are some benefits for static IP assignment, but I chose to use dynamic because the web interface for the RBR850 won't let you change the static ip address if you are in AP mode. Either way, that doesn't seem to be the issue in this case, because the IP address it getting assigned fine and I can access the RBR850 web interface using the assigned IP address.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-03

Ok so you didn't mention updating the RBS. The RBS need to be updated first thing BEFORE The RBR. Use the RBS web page to update the FW on the RBS. Don't use the RBRs web page.

Then update the RBR lastly...

What you might want to do is set the RBR back to router mode, disconnected from the main host router. Factory reset the RBR using the ERASE funtion under Admin/Backup. Setup the RBR and RBS again with out the RBR being connected to the host router. Then update the FW on the RBS first and once you have the RBS FW file sent to each RBS, then manually re-load the RBR FW. Be sure you use the RBS FW file for the RBS and the RBR FW file for the RBR.

If you can get the FW re-loaded and updated, power OFF the RBR and RBS for 1 minute. Then back ON with the RBR then RBS.

Clear out all browser caches. Check for RBR and RBS web page access. Should be normal here. If it does, configure AP mode and set a static IP address on the RBR for something out side of the host routers default DHCP IP address pool. I use ###.###.#.85 on my RBR when it's in AP mode.

kotfu · ‎2023-01-03

re RBS firmware updates: when I originally did the firmware upgrade, I did the RBS units one at a time, using their own web interface. After the first RBS has the new firmware and had restared and synced with the RBR, I went to the next RBS and repeated the procedure. After all RBS firmware was upgrade, I did the RBR firmware upgrade for the first time.

I followed the procedure you suggested:

- disconnect my RBR from my wired network and set it to router mode

- factory reset using the software tool in Admin/Backup

- configure RBR and RBS from scratch while all disconnected from my wired network

- I was successfully able to login to the web interface of the RBR using https://orbilogin.net

- reapplied the 4.6.14.3 firmware update to the RBR

- still can log in using https://orbilogin.net

- change configuration of RBR to access point mode using a different known unused static IP address (10.10.10.251)

- unplug power to RBR. While it sits for 1 minute, I connect RBR to my wired ethernet network using a cable

- plug power in to RBR and wait for it to boot

- verify I can ping the RBR new IP address 10.10.10.251

- update my internal DNS to point ap1.example.com to 10.10.10.251

- try to load https://ap1.example.com, get HTTP 500 Internal Server Error

- try to load https://10.10.10.251, which works fine.

Now I'm pissed off, and I'm determined to track down this problem. First I unplug power to all by RBS satellites and leave them unplugged to remove complexity in the target configuration. I disconnect the RBR from my wired network and do a factory reset. Reconfigure it from scratch using the procedure outlined above, same result.

Then I downgrade the firmware on the RBR to 4.6.9.11, do a factory reset, and set it to AP mode with a static IP 10.10.10.251. Everything works fine, no HTTP 500 Internal Server Error. So I do another factory reset, and configure AP mode with a dynamic IP instead of a static one. It works fine that way too. My hypothesis is now that it's a problem with the firmware 4.6.14.3. So I install 4.6.14.3 on the RBR, configure AP mode with a dynamic IP address, and the HTTP 500 Internal Server Error is back. After more experimentation and exploration with more sophisticated command line tools (nmap, dig, curl), here's what I know.

The error is observed:

- using firmware 4.6.14.3 on an RBR850, but not using firmware 4.6.9.11

- configured in AP mode (doesn't matter whether you use a static IP or dynamic IP)

- access web interface using a hostname, not an IP address (obvs in AP mode the hostname has to be provided by something besides the RBR because in AP mode the RBR DNS server is off)

- when accessing either http://ap1.example.com or https://ap1.example.com ie the error occurs independent of whether the web connection is encrypted with TLS

- before the authentication prompt, ie the HTTP 500 Internal Server Error occurs before the RBR prompts for the administration credentials

- regardless of browser used. I have replicated the error using using Safari, Chrome, Firefox, and curl.

- whether there are RBS satellites connected or not

The error is not observed:

- in the Orbi app for iOS. The app seems to work fine in all configurations and firmware levels.

There are two workarounds:

1. access the web admin tools using the IP address, ie https://10.10.10.251 (or whatever the IP address you've given to your RBR, either statically or dynamically when enabling AP mode)

2. downgrade the firmware to 4.6.9.11.

My guess is that firmware version 4.6.14.3 for the RBR introduced an error in the web server configuration.

Thanks for your suggestions @FURRYe38 , but unless you can whisper in someone's ear and have them create a new version of the firmware, I don't think there is any way to fix this problem.

Mooose · ‎2023-01-04

I don't have a solution, but I do feel your pain. I spent the same amount of time that you probably did meticulously testing and documenting, three times.

The first time the solution was access to the beta firmware program, the second time there was actually a solution involving TFTP magic and the third time it was seemingly bricked forever. Someone from Netgear reached out here to offer a solution, but after I replied with all the requested details (multiple times) all I have heard is silence.

I know this is severely off-topic, it is just so frustrating. I don't think I have had this many seemingly randomish issues with any technology since I had to deal with a printer that randomly fell off the network in 1997, or perhaps that TiBook that would kernel panic for no good reason every two weeks in 2002.

https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi-Wi-Fi-5-AC-and-Orbi-with/Massive-packet-loss-over-Ethernet-bac...

https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi-Wi-Fi-5-AC-and-Orbi-with/RBR50-power-LED-blinking-green-now-ap...

https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi-Wi-Fi-5-AC-and-Orbi-with/RBR50-bricked-again-during-update-to-...

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-04

So what is the exact http URL your using when attempting to access the RBS web pages when this error appears?

You mentioned https://ap1.example.com < is this the exact url or just some sample for forum posting review?

To confirm same URL is working in v.4.6.9.11?

@kotfu wrote:

re RBS firmware updates: when I originally did the firmware upgrade, I did the RBS units one at a time, using their own web interface. After the first RBS has the new firmware and had restared and synced with the RBR, I went to the next RBS and repeated the procedure. After all RBS firmware was upgrade, I did the RBR firmware upgrade for the first time.

I followed the procedure you suggested:

- disconnect my RBR from my wired network and set it to router mode

- factory reset using the software tool in Admin/Backup

- configure RBR and RBS from scratch while all disconnected from my wired network

- I was successfully able to login to the web interface of the RBR using https://orbilogin.net

- reapplied the 4.6.14.3 firmware update to the RBR

- still can log in using https://orbilogin.net

- change configuration of RBR to access point mode using a different known unused static IP address (10.10.10.251)

- unplug power to RBR. While it sits for 1 minute, I connect RBR to my wired ethernet network using a cable

- plug power in to RBR and wait for it to boot

- verify I can ping the RBR new IP address 10.10.10.251

- update my internal DNS to point ap1.example.com to 10.10.10.251

- try to load https://ap1.example.com, get HTTP 500 Internal Server Error

- try to load https://10.10.10.251, which works fine.

Now I'm pissed off, and I'm determined to track down this problem. First I unplug power to all by RBS satellites and leave them unplugged to remove complexity in the target configuration. I disconnect the RBR from my wired network and do a factory reset. Reconfigure it from scratch using the procedure outlined above, same result.

Then I downgrade the firmware on the RBR to 4.6.9.11, do a factory reset, and set it to AP mode with a static IP 10.10.10.251. Everything works fine, no HTTP 500 Internal Server Error. So I do another factory reset, and configure AP mode with a dynamic IP instead of a static one. It works fine that way too. My hypothesis is now that it's a problem with the firmware 4.6.14.3. So I install 4.6.14.3 on the RBR, configure AP mode with a dynamic IP address, and the HTTP 500 Internal Server Error is back. After more experimentation and exploration with more sophisticated command line tools (nmap, dig, curl), here's what I know.

The error is observed:

- using firmware 4.6.14.3 on an RBR850, but not using firmware 4.6.9.11

- configured in AP mode (doesn't matter whether you use a static IP or dynamic IP)

- access web interface using a hostname, not an IP address (obvs in AP mode the hostname has to be provided by something besides the RBR because in AP mode the RBR DNS server is off)

- when accessing either http://ap1.example.com or https://ap1.example.com ie the error occurs independent of whether the web connection is encrypted with TLS

- before the authentication prompt, ie the HTTP 500 Internal Server Error occurs before the RBR prompts for the administration credentials

- regardless of browser used. I have replicated the error using using Safari, Chrome, Firefox, and curl.

- whether there are RBS satellites connected or not

The error is not observed:

- in the Orbi app for iOS. The app seems to work fine in all configurations and firmware levels.

There are two workarounds:

1. access the web admin tools using the IP address, ie https://10.10.10.251 (or whatever the IP address you've given to your RBR, either statically or dynamically when enabling AP mode)

2. downgrade the firmware to 4.6.9.11.

My guess is that firmware version 4.6.14.3 for the RBR introduced an error in the web server configuration.

Thanks for your suggestions @FURRYe38 , but unless you can whisper in someone's ear and have them create a new version of the firmware, I don't think there is any way to fix this problem.

kotfu · ‎2023-01-04

> So what is the exact http URL your using when attempting to access the RBS web pages when this error appears?

> You mentioned https://ap1.example.com < is this the exact url or just some sample for forum posting review?

I run my own dns resolver, with an authoritative zone for my internal network. The URL I actually use is https://ap1.kotfu.net.

> To confirm same URL is working in v.4.6.9.11?

Correct. https://ap1.kotfu.net works fine on firmware v4.6.9.11 on the RBR.

kotfu · ‎2023-01-04

@MoooseAppreciate the solidarity. Reviewing your issues, I feel lucky. I have an easy work around for mine. Unexplained intermittent packet loss..../me knocks on wood.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-04

Ok, I would open a support ticket regarding this if you can.

Will pass this on to NG for review as well.

@Blanca_O @KevinLiT

@kotfu wrote:

> So what is the exact http URL your using when attempting to access the RBS web pages when this error appears?

> You mentioned https://ap1.example.com < is this the exact url or just some sample for forum posting review?

I run my own dns resolver, with an authoritative zone for my internal network. The URL I actually use is https://ap1.kotfu.net.

> To confirm same URL is working in v.4.6.9.11?

Correct. https://ap1.kotfu.net works fine on firmware v4.6.9.11 on the RBR.

kotfu · ‎2023-01-04

Unfortunately the 90 day period of complimentary technical support for my devices expired many months ago. I have no interest in paying for a support contract in order to open a support ticket for this issue.

Will continue to monitor future firmware releases to see if this gets resolved.

Thanks again @FURRYe38 for your assistance.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-04

I guess keep what works for now.

Mooose · ‎2023-01-11

I was feeling frisky today and hit the "Update All" button. Everything has come back up in working order, it seems.

The guest network SSID was visible for a few minutes after boot, but it looks like it is gone now.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-11

Be sure to save off a back up configuration to file for safe keeping. Saves time if a reset is needed.
https://kb.netgear.com/000062080/How-do-I-back-up-the-configuration-settings-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-System
Enjoy. 📡

DM2604 · ‎2023-01-11

For weeks I am not able to update my Orbi system. First it told me that there are no updates and now it tells me for RBR that there is update but not for RBS.

I tried also a manual update but Orbi refused to update telling me that something is wrong with files. I downloaded them from the link supplied here.

I mean, after all, it is not big deal because my Orbi system works just fine, but it is strange what's going on ...

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-11

Did you try and bring the RBS to near or same room as the RBR then check again for FW updates?

What the distance between the RBR and RBS?

Try Firefox or Opera to manually download and install the FW files.

Be sure you update the RBS first then RBR lastly if you go this route.

@DM2604 wrote:

For weeks I am not able to update my Orbi system. First it told me that there are no updates and now it tells me for RBR that there is update but not for RBS.

I tried also a manual update but Orbi refused to update telling me that something is wrong with files. I downloaded them from the link supplied here.

I mean, after all, it is not big deal because my Orbi system works just fine, but it is strange what's going on ...

Mooose · ‎2023-01-12

I had the same issue yesterday, the RBS showed an available update, but the RBR did not. I turned both of them off, turned them back on again, and then logged into the web interface from a browser (Brave, in my case) that had never been logged into the Orbi. I am not sure if any of this made any difference, but in any case both showed available updates after this, and hitting the "Update All" button performed according to expectation.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-12

Be sure to save off a back up configuration to file for safe keeping. Saves time if a reset is needed.
https://kb.netgear.com/000062080/How-do-I-back-up-the-configuration-settings-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-System
Enjoy.

spewak · ‎2023-01-27

No issues to speak of here but something I have noticed regarding this latest firmware update:

Not as many issues as in the past. Noticed that this release only generated 3 pages of issues whereas prior recent releases generated quite a few more pages of complaints and issues.

Just a minor observation of mine.

Cheers!

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-01-27

Be sure to save off a back up configuration to file for safe keeping. Saves time if a reset is needed.
https://kb.netgear.com/000062080/How-do-I-back-up-the-configuration-settings-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-System
Enjoy.

George63 · ‎2023-02-05

I have the exact same problem with firmware V4.6.14.3: RBR850`s web interface is working only in LAN (https://192.168.X.X or http://192.168.X.X)... the web interface cannot be accessed from WAN (ex: external ip https://202.X.X.X or DNS https://X.com). I had to downgrade the firmware to V4.6.9.11 in order to fix this issue.

FURRYe38 · ‎2023-02-05

Be aware that WAN access or REMOTE Management (WAN) was removed for security reasons by NG. Only Orbi app and Anywhere Access thru Orbi app is supported from the WAN side.

https://kb.netgear.com/000062097/Remote-Management-is-now-Anywhere-Access-in-the-Nighthawk-and-Orbi-...

@George63 wrote:

I have the exact same problem with firmware V4.6.14.3: RBR850`s web interface is working only in LAN (https://192.168.X.X or http://192.168.X.X)... the web interface cannot be accessed from WAN (ex: external ip https://202.X.X.X or DNS https://X.com). I had to downgrade the firmware to V4.6.9.11 in order to fix this issue.

George63 · ‎2023-02-05

This is old news (Last Updated:08/10/2020 | Article ID: 000062097) Remote Management is now Anywhere Access ..

In this article is not mentioned that the router`s web interface access from WAN was removed.

Clearly, the new firmware V4.6.14.3 has issues and the router`s web page can only be accessed from LAN.

CrimpOn · ‎2023-02-05

@George63 wrote:

I had to downgrade the firmware to V4.6.9.11 in order to fix this issue.

Do I understand correctly that firmware v4.6.9.11 on the Orbi 850 allows customers to reach the web interface from the internet?

(i.e. using the public IP address or a Dynamic DNS name)

I have the original RBR50 Orbi and remain frustrated and disappointed that Netgear removed Remote Management from the router Advanced Settings, claiming that the Orbi app Anywhere Access was sufficient. (Which it definitely is not.) My understanding all this time has been that the "AX" Orbi systems have not had Remote Management included in any of the v4 firmware versions.