RBRe960 versus RBR860

[Beantowm111]

My trusted RBR 850 failed. I am trying to decide whether to replace with an RBR860 versus RBRe960. I have 3 rbs850 satellites (probably overkill for my house 4500 square feet but needed Ethernet ports access in different spots). I bought both routers and 1 960 satellite. Both work fine and pair with my existing rbs850 satellites (if I go 960 will need only 2 satellites). But I can’t tell a noticeable difference in performance (xfinity fastest speed internet).

Is the 960 though more $$ better bet for future proofing then 860? Appreciated thoughts.

[Beantowm111 · Accepted solution]

Figured it out! Bad Ethernet cable.

I really appreciate your assistance.

One last question - why if the RBR960 and RBR860 both can take up to 10gb download from router and I have an internet speed of 1400 Mbps according to Orbi app (xfinity feed) do I not see more than 850 Mbps on my iPhone (with Wi-Fi 6) even when in same room as router?

[CrimpOn]

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@Beantowm111 wrote:
Is the 960 though more $$ better bet for future proofing then 860? Appreciated thoughts.

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The 960 product differs from the 860 in two areas:

• It supports WiFi6E (the 6GHz frequency band).  WiFi6E devices do not compete for WiFi capacity with existing WiFi5 and WiFi6 devices which use the 5GHz frequency band.  WiFi6E has (a) higher theoretical bandwidth, but (b) is affected more by distance and building materials.  When (or if) you have devices which support WiFi6E, those devices will perform better with the 960 than the 860.
• The 960 features a 2.5GB Ethernet LAN port, which can be used to provide higher speed to wired devices.  For example, a 2.5GB Ethernet switch can be connected to that port and 960 satellites can be wired to the router at 2.5GB speed.  You could buy a 2.5GB Ethernet card for a PC (or NAS?) and thus provide faster speed to such devices.  Until you have a device (or devices) capable of 2.5GB Ethernet, this port provides no added benefit.

Unless I read Xfinity's web page incorrectly, the maximum speed offered by Xfinity is 1.2GB.

https://www.xfinity.com/gig   The 860's 10GB WAN port already supports that speed.  Thus, the only advantage of the 960 in terms of Xfinity is the ability to get 20% faster speed out the 2.5GB Ethernet port. Is it worth spending all that money (and upgrading device Ethernet cards) to get 20% more speed? 

I certainly would not be in any hurry to buy a 960 router.

[Beantowm111]

Thank you - the one thing I notice is that the 960 satellite appears to provide better speed (non wired when going through floors and plaster walls over a distance. Interestingly it does worse when going through more solid structures (center of my house). In idea why that would be.

[Beantowm111]

I missed you point about 6e and building materials. That explains it. Thanks! You

[CrimpOn]

WiFi speeds are impacted by many factors.  The product data sheets describe the 860 and 960 satellite radios the same for the user facing 5G band:

860 - 2400Mbps, 2x2 MIMO and:

960 - 2400Mbps, 2x2 MIMO and

I have found that measuring WiFi speed can be affected by the orientation of devices (i.e. when I walk around the house holding a tablet to create a WiFi Heat Map, it depends on how I hold the tablet.  Should I hold it vertically? Horizontally? pointed at which access point (I am measuring 4 at the same time.)  I have also never seen any sort of "Antenna Pattern" description of the Orbi WiFi radios.  It is clear from the FCC submissions that the pairs of user facing antennas (2x2 MIMO requires two antennas) are mounted vertically.  Does it matter if the user device is "flat on" to the antennas, or "sideways"? My gut tells me, "heck yes", but official literature would be more satisfying.

There also could be things "hidden" in the walls that affect speed in one location but not another.  a 3" iron sewer pipe may not seem like much, but might create quite a WiFi "shadow" in terms of a smartphone that is only 3" wide.  HVAC ductwork is often galvanized steel.

Honestly, I'm surprised to hear that the results are strikingly different.  Satellites are portable.  Does the difference persist if they are swapped around?

[Beantowm111]

Moving the 960 satellite so it route to the router was through floors rather than walls improved it immensely. But I think you have made great points about value. While I got a discount on the 960 pair it still more than twice as much as just getting 860 and I am not seeing 2x improvements. And while my 850s satellites seem to work fine with the 960, I know if a problem occurs there will be no support. So I think I will hold with 860 and wait for Wi-Fi 7 for next big jump. Thank you so much.

[Beantowm111]

Turns out the Orbi 850 satellite is also not officially supported for 860 router so now back to wondering if 960 is better option. With discounts 960 router and 1 satellite is a little over twice as expensive as 860 alone but then am assured at least 1 satellite with “supported” compatibility. Anyone faced same choice?

[FURRYe38]

I know un-officially the 750, 850 RBS are compatible with the 9 series. I believe the 860 series may not have any support. This 860 series came out just last year I believe as doesn't fully support older model RBS. We've tested 7 and 850 series RBS with a 960 series system and they work. No official word from NG if they are going to support this or not. 

[Beantowm111]

Thanks - the 860 router found my 850 satellites no problem and paired though having some issues with wired versus unwired recognition.

I had assumed as both 860 and 850 are Wi-Fi 6 there would be no issue in compatibility so was surprised to find they are not officially supported.

[FURRYe38]

Did you first sync them wirelessly to the RBR then ethernet connect them? 

I would first test one RBS while in same room with the RBR and see if by using a different ethernet cable, can you get them to show a wired connection directy connected behind the RBR. After the connection is made, should switch over to wired on the RBRs web page with in 1 minute. 
CAT6 is recommended. 

[Beantowm111 · Accepted solution]

Figured it out! Bad Ethernet cable.

I really appreciate your assistance.

One last question - why if the RBR960 and RBR860 both can take up to 10gb download from router and I have an internet speed of 1400 Mbps according to Orbi app (xfinity feed) do I not see more than 850 Mbps on my iPhone (with Wi-Fi 6) even when in same room as router?

[FURRYe38]

Most iPhone only max out at around 700Mbps due to 2x2 MIMO support. 4x4 MIMO support can see 900Mpbs and over. 

Glad you got it working. Please mark your thread as solved so others will know. Be sure to save off a back up configuration to file for safe keeping. Saves time if a reset is needed.
https://kb.netgear.com/000062080/How-do-I-back-up-the-configuration-settings-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-System
Enjoy. 📡