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Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

vajim
Master

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@junktrunk wrote:
Reverting to old firmware may resolve your issue but still exposes you to the same security issues NG decided were severe enough to warrant updating these products in the first place. It's not a good solution.

Instead, it seems like NG is acknowledging to some people that the issue is in Traffic Meter. So before anyone downgrades firmware, please start by just disabling Traffic Meter with the current firmware. That seems to be doing the trick for me.

or in my case...never upgraded in the first place....and the security is fine

Message 51 of 68
junktrunk
Star

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@vajim wrote:

@junktrunk wrote:
Reverting to old firmware may resolve your issue but still exposes you to the same security issues NG decided were severe enough to warrant updating these products in the first place. It's not a good solution.

Instead, it seems like NG is acknowledging to some people that the issue is in Traffic Meter. So before anyone downgrades firmware, please start by just disabling Traffic Meter with the current firmware. That seems to be doing the trick for me.

or in my case...never upgraded in the first place....and the security is fine


How do you know though? I find it very unlikely that NG would update firmware on consumer grade products unless there's a serious problem, and the only thing they said about this firmware release is that it's to address security issues, i.e. there were serious security problems that needed to be dealt with. 

 

Upon more digging, I was able to find this which tells us at least one of the changes that were applied to RBR20 in this v2.6.2.104 firmware update:

 

https://kb.netgear.com/000062883/Security-Advisory-for-Multiple-Vulnerabilities-on-Some-Routers-Sate...

 

Read some of the bulletins that go with those. "An attacker can leverage this vulnerability to execute arbitrary code in the context of root". Some of those vulnerabilities (here's just one) that were fixed have an 8.8 criticality, out of 10. That's pretty serious. I don't know why NG makes this so difficult to figure out what was changed but it's pretty clear to me now that everyone should be upgrading, especially if disabling the broken Traffic Meter is the workaround to keeping their network stable with the more secure firmware version. 

 

Message 52 of 68
vajim
Master

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@junktrunk wrote:


How do you know? I find it very unlikely that NG would update firmware on consumer grade products unless there's a serious problem, and the only thing they said about this firmware release is that it's to address security issues, i.e. there were serious security problems that needed to be dealt with. 

 

Upon more digging, I was able to find this which tells us at least one of the changes that were applied to RBR20 in this v2.6.2.104 firmware update:

 

https://kb.netgear.com/000062883/Security-Advisory-for-Multiple-Vulnerabilities-on-Some-Routers-Sate...

 

Read some of the bulletins that go with those. "An attacker can leverage this vulnerability to execute arbitrary code in the context of root". Some of those vulnerabilities (here's just one) that were fixed have an 8.8 criticality, out of 10. That's pretty serious. I don't know why NG makes this so difficult to figure out what was changed but it's pretty clear to me now that everyone should be upgrading, especially if disabling the broken Traffic Meter is the workaround to keeping their network stable with the more secure firmware version. 

 


well lets think about this....I've been on 2.5.2.4 since November 2020 with ZERO cyber attacks, yet 1000's have updated to the latest firmware version that is suppose to offer cyber protection but instead it has caused numerous disconnects and headaches.  The math speaks for itself.  Flame suit on.

Message 53 of 68
junktrunk
Star

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@vajim wrote:

well lets think about this....I've been on 2.5.2.4 since November 2020 with ZERO cyber attacks, yet 1000's have updated to the latest firmware version that is suppose to offer cyber protection but instead it has caused numerous disconnects and headaches.  The math speaks for itself.  Flame suit on.


How can you possibly know if you have had zero attacks though. That's the problem. There's not enough logging in the Orbi devices to my knowledge to independently assess whether any of the vulnerabilities reportedly fixed in this firmware were used in an attack on your router. If an attack does occur, the attacker could run arbitrary code on your router, which means they could be using it to attack other devices on your LAN. Whether that is something you'd then observe on those devices is a matter of how much protection and detection all your internal devices have, but let's face it, consumer networking devices are pretty lax here because they expect the router to do all the external attack protection. 

 

I understand what you're saying about not wanting to deal with the incredibly frustrating internet drop out bug or whatever other stuff is a problem in this firmware, but it's just not responsible to advise people to expose themselves to attacks like this. I'm assuming you've done this before, but if not, turn on the logs for "Known DoS attacks and Port Scans" and watch how many dozens of times a day your device is getting hit by some random bot out there. It would be naive to think that those bots aren't also attempting to use these vulnerabilities to do more than just a DoS, but Orbi has no way of reporting that kind of activity to us.

Message 54 of 68
vajim
Master

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@junktrunk wrote:

@vajim wrote:

well lets think about this....I've been on 2.5.2.4 since November 2020 with ZERO cyber attacks, yet 1000's have updated to the latest firmware version that is suppose to offer cyber protection but instead it has caused numerous disconnects and headaches.  The math speaks for itself.  Flame suit on.


How can you possibly know if you have had zero attacks though. That's the problem. There's not enough logging in the Orbi devices to my knowledge to independently assess whether any of the vulnerabilities reportedly fixed in this firmware were used in an attack on your router. If an attack does occur, the attacker could run arbitrary code on your router, which means they could be using it to attack other devices on your LAN. Whether that is something you'd then observe on those devices is a matter of how much protection and detection all your internal devices have, but let's face it, consumer networking devices are pretty lax here because they expect the router to do all the external attack protection. 

 

I understand what you're saying about not wanting to deal with the incredibly frustrating internet drop out bug or whatever other stuff is a problem in this firmware, but it's just not responsible to advise people to expose themselves to attacks like this. I'm assuming you've done this before, but if not, turn on the logs for "Known DoS attacks and Port Scans" and watch how many dozens of times a day your device is getting hit by some random bot out there. It would be naive to think that those bots aren't also attempting to use these vulnerabilities to do more than just a DoS, but Orbi has no way of reporting that kind of activity to us.


you're missing my point....I'm NOT advising anybody to do anything.  I am telling others what has worked for me.  People will hopefully make their own decisions.  All the discussion you point out about arbitrary code on my router can be simply reversed and ask the same question to you, but I won't.  My network works as well as my devices when I call upon them.  Furthermore what would a arbitrary code on any router look or feel like?  I don't care.  So it comes down to I'll enjoy the internet my way and you do the same.  

Message 55 of 68
junktrunk
Star

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@vajim wrote:

you're missing my point....I'm NOT advising anybody to do anything.  I am telling others what has worked for me.  People will hopefully make their own decisions. 

Except that you are:

 


@vajim wrote:

All the discussion you point out about arbitrary code on my router can be simply reversed and ask the same question to you, but I won't.  My network works as well as my devices when I call upon them.  Furthermore what would a arbitrary code on any router look or feel like?  I don't care.  So it comes down to I'll enjoy the internet my way and you do the same.  

I didn't follow the "can be simply reversed and ask the same question to you" part but if you're saying I can't be sure I was being attacked previously through these vulnerabilities, that's true, due to the same reason none of us can be sure we were or weren't being attacked, unless something observable happens. But it's pretty common for these port scanner packages to be updated to try to apply common and useful vulnerabilities. This is how people get access to IoT cameras showing baby monitoring and other personal images stored on computers or media devices within their home networks. That's the kind of thing that at attack might do. They might also install software on another insecure device on your home network to add that device to their DoS army (here's just a random article about that: https://blog.finjan.com/iot-dos-attacks/) -- obviously DoS is bad overall but it also impacts the infected device to slow it down or cause other problems when it's activated as part of a DoS attack on some other home.

 

So listen, the choice about whether to upgrade is up to everyone individually. You're of course free to do what you like also and I respect your frustration with NG's incredibly shoddy QA, as I'm also frustrated with it. I just am saying everyone should think very carefully about whether they want published vulnerabilities like these to remain unpatched on their network when we seem to have a viable workaround (disable Traffic Meter).

Message 56 of 68
vajim
Master

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@junktrunk wrote:

I just am saying everyone should think very carefully about whether they want published vulnerabilities like these to remain unpatched on their network when we seem to have a viable workaround (disable Traffic Meter).

 

...or....I just am saying everyone should think very carefully about whether they upgrade their Orbi firmware based on the 1000's of complaints that we read everytime a new firmware is released.  There are cases to which I've seen first hand where a firmware is released and within days 1000's are reporting problems.  Then fast forward several months later and that same firmware is flawless, yet the version numnber stayed the same.

 

 Still waiting to hear from those that did NOT upgrade and experienced those nasty vulnerabilities that you keep bringing up.

 

 

 

Message 57 of 68
junktrunk
Star

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

I've already explained this twice and I'm not sure why you're having such a hard time with it. People aren't going to even know they're being attacked, that's the point. And if by some chance they figure out that they have been attacked, there's pretty low odds they're going to stumble on this thread to report it's related to these vulnerabilities. Anyway do what you want with your own network. Just please stop downplaying the importance of staying up to date with security patches.
Message 58 of 68
vajim
Master

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@junktrunk wrote:
I've already explained this twice and I'm not sure why you're having such a hard time with it. People aren't going to even know they're being attacked, that's the point. And if by some chance they figure out that they have been attacked, there's pretty low odds they're going to stumble on this thread to report it's related to these vulnerabilities. Anyway do what you want with your own network. Just please stop downplaying the importance of staying up to date with security patches.

I've got a better idea (flame suit back on) and I saw this coming.....but whether you realize it or not you are not a member of the Netgear police force.  Protecting users from people like me.   But rather than worry about me, and what I say here (shame on it if something would actually take my advice) just go about your way and enjoy your orbi.  I'm not down playing anthing.  Once Netgear figures out how to release flawless firmware (may never happen) I'll be right there with you and all the others living on the edge.  Trust me, I've been doing this for a long time. 

Message 59 of 68
krishdhar
Tutor

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

I update this version today and my router has connection issues. Some device are running fine and some devices cannot find/connect to internet. I am looking to roll back. Any help is appreciated.

Message 60 of 68
junktrunk
Star

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@krishdhar wrote:

I update this version today and my router has connection issues. Some device are running fine and some devices cannot find/connect to internet. I am looking to roll back. Any help is appreciated.


Before rolling back, just try to disable the Traffic Meter in the current version. That did the trick for me and apparently many others.

Message 61 of 68
krishdhar
Tutor

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

Thanks for your reply. Turning off the meter didn't help. My macbbook always connects and has internet, but iPhone connects but cannot get internet. Many devices like that.

Message 62 of 68
junktrunk
Star

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@krishdhar wrote:

Thanks for your reply. Turning off the meter didn't help. My macbbook always connects and has internet, but iPhone connects but cannot get internet. Many devices like that.


Oh man, sorry to hear it. The behavior you're describing where some devices are fine and others aren't is what I was experiencing too. The Traffic Meter disable resolved it for me (been a couple weeks now). Probably worth saying but be sure you've also powered off all your router/satellites and let them come back up after that too. If it's still not working though, I wouldn't be able to help you with the rollback since I've not tried that but I'm pretty sure there were comments within this thread with instructions on how to do that. Good luck.

Message 63 of 68
krishdhar
Tutor

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

Found out that the problem was the connection between the satellites and the router with firmware V2.6.2.104. With all the router and 2 satellites updated to104, I saw that the satellites were complaining of having "NO INTERNET" and consequently any device connected to the satellites had no internet. If you go to firmware update and select manual update you will see "NO INTERNET" message in the table, next to each satellite. I rolled back my router to older version of the firmware V2.5.1.16 that was running yesterday and everything is working fine now. I didn't roll the satellite firmware back. They are still 104. As a precaution I am downloading and keeping all the versions of old and new software in my disk. Thanks to everybody for their help. Krish

Model: RBR20|Orbi AC2200 Tri-band WiFi Router
Message 64 of 68
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

Be sure to factory reset the RBR and RBS and setup from scratch. Power OFF the ISP modem/ONT for 30 seconds then back ON as well during the reset. 

Be sure both RBR and RBS are on same version of FW. 

 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX30 Mode Mode  | Wifi Router RBK963 and RBK853 Router mode | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX3/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, RAXE500, RAX120v2, RAX50v2, XR450/500/700/1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 65 of 68
vajim
Master

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App


@FURRYe38 wrote:

Be sure to factory reset the RBR and RBS and setup from scratch. Power OFF the ISP modem/ONT for 30 seconds then back ON as well during the reset. 

Be sure both RBR and RBS are on same version of FW. 

 


be sure to be sure

Message 66 of 68
dokjones
Aspirant

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

don't waste your time with resets etc. The .104 firmware version is buggy and the only fix that worked for me was to roll it back.  I assume it must be working for some people or it should have been pulled/an update released. Maybe it only affects specif versions of the RBR40 but this caused me no end of trouble for a few days especially since it looked connected but nothing was working.  My observation is that DNS resolution/DNS server hangs and stops working so you cannot reach any sites.


@vajim wrote:

@FURRYe38 wrote:

Be sure to factory reset the RBR and RBS and setup from scratch. Power OFF the ISP modem/ONT for 30 seconds then back ON as well during the reset. 

Be sure both RBR and RBS are on same version of FW. 

 


be sure to be sure


 

Message 67 of 68
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Firmware update V2.6.2.104 - Internet Freeze, No Internet, Buffering, OFFLINE Status on App

If the reset doesn't work as last resort, then by all means, revert back to what has worked for you. 

Resets have worked for others and is a valid troubleshooting step.

 

Good luck. 


@dokjones wrote:

don't waste your time with resets etc. The .104 firmware version is buggy and the only fix that worked for me was to roll it back.  I assume it must be working for some people or it should have been pulled/an update released. Maybe it only affects specif versions of the RBR40 but this caused me no end of trouble for a few days especially since it looked connected but nothing was working.  My observation is that DNS resolution/DNS server hangs and stops working so you cannot reach any sites.



 


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX30 Mode Mode  | Wifi Router RBK963 and RBK853 Router mode | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX3/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, RAXE500, RAX120v2, RAX50v2, XR450/500/700/1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 68 of 68
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