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Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

ChrizK
Tutor

Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

Hi,

 

Firstly, I apologies if my network terminology is incorrect.

I switched broadband provider in the UK.  My old router DHCP provided 192.168.1 addresses, the new cannot be re-configured, and only allows 192.168.0 addresses.

I have attached my Orbi with DHCP enabled, providing 192.168.1 addresses.  This allows me to continue using all devices with static IP.  My new router still has DHCP providing 192.168.0 addresses, however, I have very few devices connected.

 

Should I refer to my Orbi as a Bridge, or perhaps a Gateway, in this configuration?

 

I can attach a device to Orbi, and I can reach my NAS on the other network (192.168.0).

Should I refer to these as 'subnets', or are they just 'seperate networks'?

 

The problem is, I cannot reach devices on the Orbi network (.1) from the new network (.0)

If I attempt a traceroute from the new (.0) network, it appears that it is 'correctly' attempting to route via the Orbi, but fails at that point (as expected, a PING completely fails).

This makes me think the Orbi is blocking the other network, but I cannot find any function (firewall?) that is doing this.

 

I would be very grateful for any help the community can provide.

(are there any logs showing firewall activity?  I coudn't spot anything under Administration>Logs.)

Many thanks

 

Trace Statistics: traceroute to 192.168.1.22, 30 hops max, 38 byte packets
1 *
2 192.168.1.1 (192.168.1.1) 2 ms

 

PING 192.168.1.22: 64 data bytes
--- 192.168.1.22 ping statistics ---
3 packets transmitted, 0 packets received, 100% packet loss round-trip min/avg/max = 0.000/0.000/0.000 ms

Model: RBR50|Orbi AC3000 Tri-band WiFi Router
Message 1 of 9

Accepted Solutions
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

You can try #2 first and see if this helps, if not, try #3 on Orbi. 

View solution in original post

Message 7 of 9

All Replies
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

What Firmware version is currently loaded?
What is the Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

IF the ISP Modem has a built in router, This would be a double NAT (two router) condition which isn't recommended. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT
https://kb.netgear.com/30187/How-to-fix-issues-with-Double-NAT
Couple of options,
1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop 

 

Be sure all of your devices are connected to the Orbi system and not the ISP router. 

Message 2 of 9
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?


@ChrizK wrote:

Should I refer to my Orbi as a Bridge, or perhaps a Gateway, in this configuration?


In this configuration, the Orbi is a router supporting a private network that is hidden from the ISP router network. The Orbi router's IP address on the ISP network will be 192.168.0.(something). The ISP network will have no idea where to find 192.168.1.(anything)  As @FURRYe38 points out, this is a classic "Double NAT" situation. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT  Devices on the Orbi network can reach the NAS because they know "192.168.0 is not on the subnet with me, it must be out the gateway somewhere." The Orbi router knows "anything 192.168.0.x is on my WAN subnet."

 

In itself, a Double NAT is not usually harmful, although it does make certain network activities very difficult (or even impossible, as described in the article).

 

A "quick fix" is to attach all of your devices to the Orbi. They will all have 192.168.1.x addresses and will all be able to find each other.

 

A better solution is to use one of the three method to eliminate the Double NAT.

Message 3 of 9
ChrizK
Tutor

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

Thank you for the quick reply, although I will have to think carefully how to proceed, given that you are saying what I am trying to do is not recommended 😞

 

Hardware Version   RBR50
 
Firmware Version   V2.7.3.22

 

I'm afraid I can't see who makes the Virgin Media Hub 4.  My googles just refer to it being their own.

(but it is a router with Wifi capability)

 

Doing what you suggest, I would have to move the Orbi from its current position, which has my Hive and Ring hubs wired directly, plus other devices.  This means I would have to find more power and space in the area in which the Hub4 is located, which is full of other devices (tv, satellite receiver, virgin tv, amplifier etc etc etc).  This is something I was trying to avoid, as the area is 'rammed'.

 

I will have to read (and digest) what you have sent.

 

Thanks for all your help, it is much appreciated

Message 4 of 9
ChrizK
Tutor

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

Thank you for the additional information.  I will try and get my head around double NATting, but fear I will end up with power extention leads and boxes sitting on top of each other overheating a corner of the room Smiley Sad

Message 5 of 9
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?


@ChrizK wrote:

Thank you for the additional information.  I will try and get my head around double NATting, but fear I will end up with power extention leads and boxes sitting on top of each other overheating a corner of the room Smiley Sad


I made an invalid assumption (sorry).  Because the Orbi router must be connected to the ISP device with an ethernet cable, most customers locate the Orbi router right next to the ISP device.  With both in the same location, moving the NAS from one to the other is trivial.  With the Orbi located elsewhere, the situation is more complicated.

 

If the Orbi is placed in Access Point (AP) mode, then the 192.168.1.x subnet will disappear.  All devices will get IP addresses from the ISP router in the 192.168.0.x subnet.  All will have internet access.  All will be able to communicate with each other. That requires no movement of equipment.

 

Do all these devices have truly "Static IP addresses" (defined on the devices themselves), or are they assigned IP addresses in router tables?

 

It might be worthwhile to identify how many devices on the 192.168.0.x network need to reach devices on the 192.168.1.x network.  I assumed (once again - assume) that it was only the NAS.  If that is the only one, then just move the NAS.  Or, does the NAS need to communicate with devices on both networks (i.e. a media server).

Message 6 of 9
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

You can try #2 first and see if this helps, if not, try #3 on Orbi. 

Message 7 of 9
ChrizK
Tutor

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

Hi @CrimpOn 

 

It was a fair assumption, and 'correct', in that the ethernet is connected into a powerline adapter.  This allows me to place the Orbi in a corner of the house (room), and the Satallite upstairs/otherside, giving fairly reasonable wifi coverage.

 

Ultimately, you are also correct to question the number of devices.  Given the challenges, it would be more sensible to simply 'bite the bullet' and reconfigure using '.0'.

 

As I will reconfigure, it is not relevant, but ... the Synology NAS communicates with IP cameras, having static IP, as well as being a media server.  I also found I lost https from '.1', as the ceritificate is tied to a domain associated with the ISP router IP (as provided by Synology) ...TBH I still haven't worked out how it resolves the address, allowing me to access the NAS from the .0 network using the URL.  I thought it must (inefficiently) route via the internet, but I guess it must use something other than DNS as I don't have port forwarding configured...Smiley Frustrated

 

I was hoping to learn a bit more about networking and firewalls, but I concede I was over complicating the situation and should stop hassling you guys Smiley Happy

 

Although I am likely to reconfigure as per your suggestion, I will accept @FURRYe38 as the answer to the initial question (which I still need to sit down and fully understand!).

 

Thanks again for your time, it is much appreciated.

 

Message 8 of 9
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Is there a Firewall blocking my other network?

👍

Message 9 of 9
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