Re: RBR40 losing internet connectivity every 12 hours or so

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

Hi,

My Orbi RBR40 (model name doens't list in the pull down) wifi router with 2 sattelites is losing internet connecivity every ~12 hours or so. Wifi connection to the Orbi is maintained and I can reach the admin services on the wifi router but can't get beyond that to my cable modem.

The cable modem is an Arris supplied by Spectrum / ATT.

-- Dermot

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-04-06

What Firmware version is currently loaded?
What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

What channels are you using? Auto? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.
Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

>> What Firmware version is currently loaded?

2.3.5.34 (upgraded manually from 2.3.5.32)

>> What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

Arris TG1672G

>> What channels are you using? Auto?

>> Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.

2.4GHz : Channel 11

5GHz : Channel 48

>> Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Not many. This is a replacement for a cheapo router I had before. Little did I know the cheapo was rock solid!

One more thing, there's no seeming issues on the wifi side of the router. It's the connection being dropped from router to modem. I can access the 192.168.1.1 on the router from all devices but can't get to the modem 192.16.0.x during an outage.

thanks, D

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-04-06

Arris TG1672G is a modem and router.

If the modem is running in router mode, This would be a double NAT condition which isn't recommended. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT
https://kb.netgear.com/30187/How-to-fix-issues-with-Double-NAT
Couple of options,
1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop
https://kb.netgear.com/26765/Disabled-Features-on-the-Router-when-set-to-AP-Mode

I would try option 1. I believe this model modem has a bridge funtion. Make contact with the MFr or ISP to help you with this.

CrimpOn · ‎2020-04-06

@DOD-March wrote:
One more thing, there's no seeming issues on the wifi side of the router. It's the connection being dropped from router to modem. I can access the 192.168.1.1 on the router from all devices but can't get to the modem 192.16.0.x during an outage.

I suspect the "192.16" is a typo, which should read "192.168", correct?
This indicates that @FURRYe38 is correct and you have "two routers".
The most obvious way to address this issue is to place the Orbi in Access Point (AP) mode, using the Orbi web interface.
On the Advanced Tab, Advanced Settings, Router/AP mode.
Before doing anything, can you please humor an "Old Guy" and report the times from the Advanced Tab Home Page, click on "Connection Status" in the Internet Port box.
What does it show for Lease Obtained and Lease Expires?

Thanks

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

First off, appreciate the response here - thanks! Quick questions:

My old wifi router didn't seem to need this bridging?

Why does the problem only occur once every 12+ hours or so - if it was a fundamental issue wouldn't if flake out more often?

Does this bridging expose me further to the nastiness of the internet?

>>

Double NAT is when you connect your router behind another router creating two different private networks. For example, connecting your NETGEAR router behind a modem/router provided by your ISP. Double NAT does not prevent your devices access to the internet but may cause problems with playing online games, opening a specific service port, connecting to a VPN tunnel, or visiting secure sites with SSL. Also, the devices connected to the first private network may not be able to communicate to the devices connected to the other private network.

>>

thanks again,

D.

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

Looks like my last response got lost.

Yes 192.168.xxx for both modem and router:

Modem : 192.168.0.1

Router : 192.168.1.1

If I switch to AP mode won't I lose the direct IP address for the router?

D.

IP Address	192.168.0.2
Subnet Mask	255.255.255.0
Default Gateway	192.168.0.1
DHCP Server	192.168.0.1
DNS Server	209.18.47.62 209.18.47.63
Lease Obtained	0 Days, 1 Hours, 0 Minutes
Lease Expires	0 Days, 0 Hours, 54 Minutes

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-04-06

No, you get a new IP address to connect to the RBR when in AP Mode to connect to or continue to use orbilogin.net.

CrimpOn · ‎2020-04-06

@DOD-March wrote:

If I switch to AP mode won't I lose the direct IP address for the router?

IP Address 192.168.0.2
Subnet Mask 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway 192.168.0.1
DHCP Server 192.168.0.1
DNS Server 209.18.47.62
209.18.47.63
Lease Obtained 0 Days, 1 Hours, 0 Minutes
Lease Expires 0 Days, 0 Hours, 54 Minutes

This is correct. In AP mode, the primary router assigns IP addresses to every device. The IP subnet 192.168.1.x no longer will exist. So, the Orbi mostl likely will be 192.168.0.2, and every remaining device in the house will be 192.168.0.<something>

This is one consideration in choosing which of the two routers "needs to go". If you have gone to a lot of effort to manage the 192.168.1.1 subnet (assigning IP's to devices, for example. managing the DHCP pool.), then many people would try to put the base router into "bridge" or "passthrough" mode and preserve their efforts. On the other hand, if the Orbi is just "running itself", you have little to lose.

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

@CrimpOn thanks for this. I'm not attached to using the Orbi as a router , just a couple more questions:

a) Does bridging through the modem expose my network to potential hackers?

b) Why does this problem only occur intermittently - i.e. 12 hours+ a day it all works ok.

D.

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-04-06

If you bridge the modem, then you can run the RBR in router mode and use the RBRs built in firewall for protection from the WAN side. This works. If you use AP Mode on the RBR, then you'll need to keep the ISP modem in router mode to use it's firewall for protection from the WAN side.

CrimpOn · ‎2020-04-06

@DOD-March wrote:
a) Does bridging through the modem expose my network to potential hackers?
b) Why does this problem only occur intermittently - i.e. 12 hours+ a day it all works ok.

a) The Arris web User Guide indicates that this router has basically the same sort of firewall as the Orbi:

https://arris.my.salesforce.com/sfc/dist/version/download?operationContext=DELIVERY&ids=068a0000004g...

It also shows how to disable the Arris WiFi network so that those radios do not interfere with the Orbi.

b) Why? This is indeed the "$64 Question". For some Orbi users, this never happens. My Orbi has never once had to be restarted because it no longer connected to the modem. (If this were a common phenomenon, my feeling is the "Blog-o-Sphere" would be in flames with complaints.) I have a personal theory that somehow the DHCP coordination between the Orbi and DHCP server fails and the Orbi concludes that it may no longer communicate. The upstream server thinks everything is "just fine", and (if it had a brain) might wonder why this particular customer simply doesn't send any packets.

I believe that rather than reboot the Orbi, some users have found that they can open the Orbi web interface Basic Tab, Internet Menu, and click on the "Test" button at the top and the Orbi internet link is restored. Once again, my personal theory is that this forces the Orbi to send packets to the upstream server and this time the protocol works.

If I could reproduce the problem, I would be devoting considerable effort to diagnosing it, but alas I cannot.

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

Cool, thanks - I'll test the bridge NAT mode and see what happens.

D.

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-06

Hopefully, the last question on this. With the new setup, my RBR40 is still at 192.168.1.1 but (As predicted) my Arris modem is no longer at 192.168.0.1 - how do I connect to it over the network?

D.

CrimpOn · ‎2020-04-06

@DOD-March wrote:
Hopefully, the last question on this. With the new setup, my RBR40 is still at 192.168.1.1 but (As predicted) my Arris modem is no longer at 192.168.0.1 - how do I connect to it over the network?

When the Arris is put into "bridge" mode, it no longer has an IP address. It has become "only a modem", no longer performing ANY router or WiFi functions. The Orbi now has the "public" IP address that the Arris had before. You can no longer reach the Arris device using a web browser.

But, wait. What if this was a horrible mistake and you want to "go back"? Simple. Locate a tiny "Reset" hole somewhere on the Arris case and stick the end of a paperclip into it for a while until the lights flash. That will do the same thing to the Arris that it does to every other electronic device (including the Orbi). A settings revert to their "Factory Defaults". In the case of the Arris, it will go back to being a modem/router/WiFi device.

tomschmidt · ‎2020-04-06

I have a Surfboard cable modem, it is not a router. My Orbi router is at 192.168.1.1 and my modem is at 192.168.100.1 so you might ping that IP to see if your Arris modem answers at that IP. As others have stated, there should be a pinhole reset on the modem/router as well to revert it back to factory settings.

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-04-07

The modem may default to a 192.168.100.1 address after it's bridged. Something to still access it's own web page. Review the user manual for the modem to see what IP address it uses as default when in bridge mode.

@DOD-March wrote:
Hopefully, the last question on this. With the new setup, my RBR40 is still at 192.168.1.1 but (As predicted) my Arris modem is no longer at 192.168.0.1 - how do I connect to it over the network?

D.

DOD-March · ‎2020-04-07

Yes, http://192.186.100.1:8080 seems to be the new IP address for the modem.

No outages in 12 hours or so.. fingers crossed..

D.

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-04-07

Good to hear. Come back and let us know after a few days.

You might save off a backup configuration to file on the RBR for safe keeping. Saves time if a reset is needed.

@DOD-March wrote:
Yes, http://192.186.100.1:8080 seems to be the new IP address for the modem.

No outages in 12 hours or so.. fingers crossed..

D.