Orbi WiFi 7 RBE973
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Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

emorikawa
Aspirant

Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

My RBK852 with 1 satellite (RBR850 and RBS850) disconnect every few minutes. I have done extensive diagnostics explained in depth here. Can @FURRYe38  or any other expert help me.

 

Setup:

  • RBK852 with 1 Satellite (RBR850 and RBS850) ordered Jan 25, 2021 on Firmware 3.2.16.6
  • Testing from MacBook Pro 16” 2020 and MacBook Pro 13” 2020 model. Both BigSur 11.2.3. Same results. Additional testing from iPhone 12 and iPad Air 2020.
  • AT&T Gigabit Fiber Internet into a Humax BGW320-500 Broadband Gateway
  • Satellite is 35 feet from the base station on the same floor separated by ~2 plaster & lath walls. -55dB signal.
  • All devices removed from the network. All applications & background processes on computer closed. Location services off.

Primary Experiment and Symptoms:
tl;dr; Wifi disconnects for 3 seconds every few min. It gets better if you get closer. Ethernet to the base station is perfect. Ethernet to satellite has same problem.

 

When on WiFi, and ~16ft away from the base station with line-of-sight, the network will disconnect then reconnect over the span of 3 seconds. This happens very consistently every 2 to 3 minutes.

 

The following screenshots using a ping utility called prettyping. I am pinging the base station at 10.0.0.1 on the left. I am pinging the satellite at 10.0.0.2 on the right. Link if photo is broken.

Prettyping Main WiFi in Dining Room.png

You can see the network will drop with red exclamation points intermittently, then I’ll get a “no route to host” message. When this message happens the wifi icon on my computer blinks temporarily, then re-connectsion.

 

When one of the blips happens, I get the following on /var/log/wifi.log

 

Mon Apr 12 16:22:31.415 Apple80211Set:9930 Processing APPLE80211_IOC_ROAM
Mon Apr 12 16:22:31.416 Apple80211Set:9944 Processing APPLE80211_IOC_ROAM dataRef:0x7ff4e65ffdc0
Mon Apr 12 16:22:31.416 Apple80211Set:9965 CFType is CFData
Mon Apr 12 16:35:10.731 <kernel> postMessage::1412 APPLE80211_M_BSSID_CHANGED received
Mon Apr 12 16:35:10.732 Mon Apr 12 16:35:11.666 <kernel> AppleBCMWLANCore::getSSIDData(): Get failure: APPLE80211_IOC_SSID: -528342013
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.107 <kernel> postMessage::1412 APPLE80211_M_BSSID_CHANGED received
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.107 <kernel> postMessage::1412 APPLE80211_M_BSSID_CHANGED received
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.107 Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.229 <airport[12626]> ERROR: rapportd (587) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.229 <airport[12626]> ERROR: sharingd (742) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.273 <airport[12626]> ERROR: rapportd (587) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.274 <airport[12626]> ERROR: sharingd (742) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.277 <airport[12626]> ERROR: rapportd (587) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.278 <airport[12626]> ERROR: sharingd (742) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.281 <airport[12626]> ERROR: rapportd (587) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request
Mon Apr 12 16:35:13.282 <airport[12626]> ERROR: sharingd (742) is not entitled for com.apple.wifi.join_history, will not allow request


From this particular test setup the WiFi normally has the following stats. These were gathered through /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/Apple80211.framework/Versions/Current/Resources/airport utility:

 

agrCtlRSSI: -53
agrExtRSSI: 0
agrCtlNoise: -91
agrExtNoise: 0
state: running
op mode: station
lastTxRate: 780
maxRate: 217
lastAssocStatus: 0
802.11 auth: open
link auth: wpa2-psk
BSSID: <<REDACTED BASE STATION MAC ADDRESS>>
SSID: <<REDACTED>>
MCS: 8
channel: 48,80


You can see that the signal strength at -53dB should be plenty strong. When one of the blips happens, I’ll see the state move from running, to init, to scanning, to running again.


Additional Experiments:
Moving Closer to Base Station:
When you move closer to the base station, the dropping becomes less frequent. See the screenshot here.

It’s still there but much more intermittent and seemingly random. Link if photo is broken

Prettyping Main WiFi in Living Room.png

 

WiFi From Satellite:
When I’m connected via wifi to the satellite the problem becomes worse. See screenshot below. Link if photo is broken

Prettyping Satellite WiFi.png

 

Ethernet to Base Station:
When I’m connected via ethernet to the base station, the problem goes away. Internet is perfect. See screenshot below. Link if photo is broken

Perettyping Wired Base Station.png

 

Ethernet to Satellite:
When I’m connected via ethernet to the satellite, the problem persists. There are 3-second drops every 10-15 minutes or so. See the screenshot below Link if photo is broken

Prettyping Satellite Ethernet 2.jpeg

 

Things I’ve tried:
Factory reset & Regular Reboots
I tried a full factory reset and rebooted the base station and satellite multiple times. Everything restored fine but there was no effect.

 

Firmware changes
I tried upgrading to 3.2.17.12 and downgrading to 3.2.15.32. There was no effect. All symptoms remain the same. It appears that the satellite ethernet problems went away on 3.2.15.32, but returned when the auto updater forced me back to 3.2.16.6

 

Disconnect all devices:
I have about a dozen devices in my home. I manually unplugged all WiFi devices except for the testing, pinging laptop. This had no effect.

 

Try from different devices:
I tried from MacBook Pro 16” 2020 and MacBook Pro 13” 2020 model. Both BigSur 11.2.3. Both have the same results.

I additionally downloaded pinging software onto an iPhone 12 and iPad Air 2020. While it’s considerably more stable from the iPhone and iPad, I still have ping drops in line with what I’m seeing from my computer.

 

Tone Down 2.4GHz Network:
I saw forum threads hypothesizing that things could be fixed by splitting the 2.4GHz and 5GHz networks. Unfortunately the RBK850 with current firmware does not appear to able to do this via telnet. I was unable to telnet to the device nor was able to activate telnet.

I tried disabling the 2.4GHz network; however, that didn’t work. The option was disabled, the router rebooted, and the network was still there.

I was able to decrease the 2.4GHz signal strength to 25% on the theory that if the 5GHz network were strong enough it wouldn’t get confused. This had no effect.

 

OSX Upgrades and Other Mac Issues:
I’m on Big Sur 11.2.3 (the latest). I get the same results when zero applications and daemons are running, as when lots of activity is on the network and I’m on a video call. I had a prior WiFi issue that was fixed by disabling location services. This had no effect on this problem. I’ve also done PRAM and SMC resets to no avail.

 

Moving the Base Station:
I’ve tried moving things around. This has no effect. While, as described above, things get slightly better when physically close to the base station, the dropouts still exist.

 

Check for Interference and Manually Adjust Channels:
I used Wifi Explorer to analyze signal strength. You can see results here. Our router is by far the most powerful. I have also manually adjusted the 5GHz and 2.4GHz channels to the one with the least noise. This had no effect.

 

Current Theories and Other Thoughts
First of all, none of these issues were present from purchase in Jan 2021 until about mid March 2021. This started happening Mid March. This is a very suspicious part about this issue. As far as I can tell; however, no changes were introduced around then. This is why I tried firmware changes, reboots, removed devices, and checked osx upgrade histories to isolate anything that might have changed around then. All have come up with no results.

 

From LOTS of Googling, I wish I could try separating the 2.4GHz and 5GHz networks. This doesn’t seem possible with the RBK850. Reducing strength of 2.4GHz had no effect.

 

The Apple WiFi logs, particularly the APPLE80211_IOC_ROAM and APPLE80211_M_BSSID_CHANGED messages are actually quite common. I think that’s a bit of a red herring that is a downstream effect of the computer getting kicked off the network.

 

The fact that the internet is 100% perfect when on base-station ethernet (this holds true when I connect ethernet directly to the modem), to me strongly implies that this is exclusively a wifi problem (as opposed to other router hardware, packet congestion, etc).

Message 1 of 11
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

What mode is your modem working in? Router or Bridged? 

 

Does this happend still if your turn OFF the RBS? 

 

What happens if you turn down the power on the RBR from 100% to say 50%?

Message 2 of 11
emorikawa
Aspirant

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

First of all, @FURRYe38  thank you SO much for super quickly helping me out here. I can't tell you how much a sigh of relief seeing your responses all over the community board made me feel about the possibility of getting to the root of all of this.

 

It's in Router mode.

 

Turning off the RBS was a good idea. I just unplugged it. Unfortunately, preliminary results would still indicate I'm getting these intermittent droppings. Here's the latest from my test location: (left ping is base station 10.0.0.1, right ping is Google): Link if image is broken:

 

Prettyping RBS Off.png

 

I'll now try and plug the RBS back in and turn the RBR power down to 50% and update here when I have results. That being said, if your theory is interference problems between the router and base station, it's concerning that the version with no RBS still shows the intermittent drops.

Message 3 of 11
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

Is the modems wifi enabled or fully disabled? It should be fully disabled.

Your in double NAT condition however that should both the Orbi Wifi.

 

You might try the RBR in AP mode with the modem in router mode to see if you still see these items.

 

Also your picture up on dropbox is no longer there:

"This item was deleted

You might be able to find it in your deleted files. If it's not there, try asking the person who shared it with you."
 
Has a factory reset and setup from scratch after the FW was updated on the RBR and RBS? 

 

 

Message 4 of 11
emorikawa
Aspirant

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

Yes, the Modem WiFi is fully disabled. I'll try the Modem in router mode and the Orbi in AP mode next and let you know how that goes.

 

Dropbox link fixed. This one should work. I also edited the reply above.

 

I updated the firmware to 3.2.17.12 first on the RBS and then RBR and the problem persisted. I then did a factory reset and setup from scratch from there to no avail.

Message 5 of 11
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

And the same thing happens on v3.2.15.32 as well with PrettyPing results?

Message 6 of 11
emorikawa
Aspirant

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

Unfortunately the router on AP mode did not help. See image

 

Note, that I did try downgrading 3.2.15.32 and still had issues. However, that was with the satellite and in Router mode.

 

Let me try downgrading 3.2.15.32 in this configuration. So the next experiment will be:

 

1. AP Mode

2. Firmware 3.2.15.32
3. No Satellite

Message 7 of 11
emorikawa
Aspirant

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

Unfortunately the 3.2.15.32 did not improve things. In fact it actually made things a bit worse upstream. While pinging the RBR850 directly had the same effect with intermittent dropping connections (left on image), pinging google.com went up to a mean of 65ms instead of 10ms before the firmware update. See image here

Message 8 of 11
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

I would contact NG support and reference this forum thread.

Message 9 of 11
emorikawa
Aspirant

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

Okay, thank you for your help.

Message 10 of 11
oliase33
Aspirant

Re: Orbi RBK852 Disconnects Every Few Minutes [Extensive Diagnostic Thread]

In point to point mode it takes 2. one at each end. You'd still need the 2 satellites in the guest house but it'd provide a better backhaul than trying to reach that far with standard satellites.

Message 11 of 11
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