Extend Wifi to an outbuilding what hardware needed?

[rsm2000e]

Moving to a flat above the garage, about 50 feet from main house.  Have a 2-piece Orbi RBR20 unit, thinking I might need more hardware to boost the signal in my new apartment (a 2 room setup).  My existing Orbi RBR20 is FINE for my OLD apartment where I am connected to my XFinity Cable Modem (ARRIS) and the Orbi is an Access Point (main unit) and boosts the signal Tri-Band to the rest of my apartment (other bedroom and living room).  The satellite unit is in the living room, and the signal is VERY strong within my apartment!  BUT, when I move in a month or so, I will plug the Main Orbi unit into the landlord's existing Netgear Router (non Orbi) and my orbi will again be an access point.  My question is do I need to buy an "outdoors" orbi to boost the signal going from Landlord's upstairs bedroom the 50 or 75 feet to my little garage apartment?  Or should I buy One more satellite unit so my 2 bedroom place will have strong internet in both rooms?  Right now I can detect wi-fi in my new place with NO ORBI at all, but the signal is weak and the MBPS is WAY LOW (because of the weak signal).  Nominal is 300 MBPS, no kidding, I tested it myself!!  That's superb for wi-fi!  My goal is to get 300 Mbps in my new place with the proper Orbi equipment.  I believe 3 Orbi units is "max"?  Willing to buy more orbi units as needed, thanks in advance.

[FURRYe38]

Any chance the landlord would let you run a CAT6 LAN cable from the main router to the new apt? 

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[rsm2000e]

Sadly hard-wiring from his Netgear Cable Router to my 'granny flat' tiny apartment above his garage won't work it's 50 feet away from the main house (not attached).  Obviously it would be wonderful to have 300 mbps (my current xfinity apartment hardwire vs orbi is 179 mbps download the same on Orbi WiFi as it is on hardwried, so I'm a HUGE Orbi fan.

[CrimpOn]

At present you have an internet connection separate from the landlord. Will the internet service company relocate your service to the garage apartment?  They run cables all day, every day.  If they installed one in the house, surely they can install one in the garage.

If the Orbi is connected to the landlord's router, how close can it be located to the garage?  i.e. can it be placed (literally) against the outside wall of the house nearest to the garage?  If so, a satellite placed against the garage wall nearest to the house may get a strong enough signal to provide adequate service to the new apartment.  One satellite should provide enough WiFi coverage for two rooms.

[rsm2000e]

Thank you.  Yes, I'm going to try to run off the landlord's router so I am (hoping) your suggestion will work.  My question was if the signal for some reason is not robust enough to be reasonably fast (he is getting 300 Mbps ACTUAL on his wifi system inside his house, but the signal strength is nowhere near what it is in my (current) apartment using the magnificent ORBI 2-piece set I bought at Costco.  My thinking is possibly I might benefit from the outdoor Orbi piece added to my current equipment.  Also, if I plug my Orbi transmitter (main piece) into Landlord's router, I worry it might overpower his existing WiFi and cause a problem for him.  All of this to try to avoid my own Xfinity bill for $130 a month for TV and Internet.  Over time, let me tell you, that $100+ a month adds up to a BUNCH.  I am leaving my current digs after 13 years of Comcast bills.  I shudder at the thought.  And of course, there's NEVER anything on TV!  If they shut down Golf, the NFL and MLB, I could actually do without TV period.  Streaming off the web would be plan B, but Xfinity has all the rights to my local MLB team, so it would be radio or nothing, except the odd game on UHF.

Thank you for your suggestion, it is my current 'hope' that it will be enough.  The db signal strength presently is much too low without an Orbi booster to use landlord's wifi for my Internet.  Using the WiFi Analyzer app on my Android, the signal is very low, and the mbps is like 30 as opposed to 300 which is what he is getting inside the main (100 year old) house.  My add on is newer (about 20 years old).  His router is on his second floor.  Again, thank you for your help.

[rsm2000e]

Oh, if I didn't clarify, the new apartment is above the garage which is DETACHED from the main house entirely. 

There is a line of sight distance of about 75 feet from the room where his router is to my building.  It may be slightly further depending on where in the room he has his router sitting.  It is also Netgear though I don't know the model.  

[CrimpOn]

Will the landlord let you place your Orbi router "in the window" (literally, so there is not a brick wall for the signal to pass through)?

You can mitigate affecting his WiFi by setting yours to a channel with zero overlap with his.

You can also reduce the transmit power on your WiFi signal (on one of the Advanced menus)  Alas, I know of no way to affect the "user side" WiFi signal level of only the router.

My guess is that the "backhaul" radio signal is the critical factor.  There is a method using telnet to control the radio signal level:

https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi/Further-Reduce-the-Transmit-Power-in-Orbi/m-p/1672260

[rsm2000e]

Posts I have come across say while Orbi is 'fine' inside a contiguous structure, it is "less fine" when long distances between structures become involved.  To give an example, inside the landlords house using a regular Netgear cable modem, the signal strength from upstairs to downstairs is approximately -74db out of a possible -24db max this is about a 50% drop in signal strength for just downstairs vs upstairs where the router is.  Walk outside go into my apartment over the standalone garage and a 300 mbps signal drops to like 15 mbps because of the distance and the physical structures (windows closed).

Goal:  to avoid paying stupid money to Comcast (landlord is close personal relative and is willing to let me an 'extra room' on his comcast bill with my own UHD Comcast box ($10 a month).  That's great, but no Internet to speak of.

Running a Cat 6 cable could work well, but physically improbable as it woud be ugly hanging in space between the buildings.

Frustrated!

[FURRYe38]

Any chance of burying the LAN cable? 

Orbi can only do so much distances. 

Might be best to get your own internet...

[CrimpOn]

An gigabit ethernet cable can be up to 90m, which means it could take a "roundabout" path from house to garage and still be within specs.  There is outdoor rated Cat6.  Your observations about how 2.4G and 5G penetrate structures are correct.  A brief Google search turned up refererces to how 2.4G and 5G penetrate different materials: https://www.am1.us/wp-content/uploads/Documents/E10589_Propagation_Losses_2_and_5GHz.pdf

I skipped over all the formulas to the end where it appears that things like brick, wood, and stucco have several times the attenuation that glass does.

Are you able to mount things to the outside of these buildings?  Several community members have reported using Ubiquiti Nanostations to bridge between the main house and other structures.  There is one model that is powered over PoE, which means only the ethernet cable has to penetrate the building wall.  In essence, using a pair of wireless units create the same result as running an ethernet cable.  The electronics on each end have no idea that they are not talking over ethernet.

[rsm2000e]

My landlord is 80 yr old friend of a friend. I don't want to stress him out. The home routers do not provide phantom power for PoE. I would need a pricey switch for that no deal. I know about the type of solution you mention I will call a vendor who put in outdoor WiFi commercial boosters in our car dealership. It was quite pricey. I had a thought about Orbi but I think it's outside Orbi world.

[CrimpOn]

Here's the product page for Nanostations: https://www.ui.com/airmax/nanostationm/

I looked up one of them on Amazon, and people talked about installing them "indoors" instead of outdoors on a pole mount.  I guess if they will carry 10km, they will probably get through a wall or two and go 75ft.  A package of two, complete with PoE injectors is under $150US.  One end would plug into the landlord's router and the other end would plug into any old brand of Access Point.

[CrimpOn]

p.s. I am not "pushing" Ubiquiti.  Several community members have mentioned that product.  Amazon is happy to suggest lots of other brands.  And, a Google search might even turn up better alternatives.

[rsm2000e]

So the Ubiquiti units are not true 'wi-fi' yes?  They are acting as Ethernet "bridge" so I would plug the receiving side into my Orbi access point?

Thank you for taking the time and trouble to try to come up with a viable solution.  I imagine this 'issue' is fairly frequent as separate 'flats' or other outbuildings are becoming the norm in home construction as parents age.  When the parents pass on, then the outbuildings are a source of ongoing rental income and the benefit is the landlord is very much eyes-on his rental unit!

[CrimpOn]

Yes indeed.  These Ubiquiti (and similar) units have a three-way selector switch and "bridge" is one of them.  The maximum throughput on these particular units is 150mb.  Not equal to an Orbi backhaul, but possibly enough to get by.  And, it is interesting that they seem to have the same throughput no matter whether they are using 900MHz, 2.4G, or 5G.

If you decide to try a product like this, please post the results.  As you said, this is becomming a very common issue on the forum.