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Aspirant

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

@khad I am following these instructions to set separate ssids but get a login page when I enter the 192.168.1.1 address instead of the Orbi site. Firmware is up to date. The login says password is unencrypted. Is that normal?

Running Mac Catalina

Model: RBR50|Orbi AC3000 Tri-band WiFi Router
Message 526 of 739
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Guru

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

When enabling the debug mode for activating telnet access, the example shows http://192.168.1.1/debug.htm - mind you you have to repeat the same on all the Orbi satellites IP addresses - yes, these are not secure connections. Don't worry about it... accessing the router and the satellites by telnet is not encrypted either anyway. 

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Guide

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

This method doesn't work on the current firmware (well, it works, but only for about 5 mins - before the 5GHz SSID gets reset back to the 2.4GHz one).

 

Currently if you want to set the 5GHz SSID differently, the only way to do it is using either this method with older firmware - or use Voxel's custom version of this firmware, which does support it (using slightly different commands).

Message 528 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

I am afraid you are completely wrong in your assessment.

The solution to this problem has been posted many times, even recently.

Look back a couple of pages through the recent posts.

The changes work on the latest firmware as longs as you run ALL the commands that have been shared.
Message 529 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

Partially accepted; as there's a whole lot more going on in wifison-monitor than just forcing the two SSIDs to be the same - so it's a bit of a compromise.    Quite why they are enforcing this and going out of their way to stop SSID separation I have no idea.  Crazy.

 

However - the alternative (currently) is Voxel's firmware - which I'm currently having a bucket-load of issues with (client stability wise).  Will be trying another factory restart on this firmware and if that doesn't resolve it then I'll be going back to NG firmware and I'll have to accept the complete disabling of wifison-monitor.

 

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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@mrshades wrote:

Quite why they are enforcing this and going out of their way to stop SSID separation I have no idea.


Other major consumer mesh system vendors don't even think about offering an option to split nor for playing with the internals using a shell access. Why? Not required, worse customer experience, ... I'm still mising the "killer" argument to proof that doing it so wrong.

Message 531 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

@schumaku 

I have a pc sitting 15 inches away from the main Orbi that has been fine for a couple weeks; a simultaneous new installation of pcs and Orbis. Today when it restarted, thank you Windows for forcing that during the workday, it stopped being able to handle its network load, crashing the entire network. Repeatedly. Why the Orbi thinks this computer suddenly needs a 2.4gHz signal is a real mystery to me, but plugging the pc in fixed it; which is a poor solution for a wireless device.

 

I'm absolutely fine with the solution being a shared SSID and the ability to assign the proper band to devices as necessary from the advanced settings, but flexibility should be a core design principle for anyone not designing iPhones.

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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@Malatr wrote:

I have a pc sitting 15 inches away from the main Orbi that has been fine for a couple weeks; ... ... but plugging the pc in fixed it; which is a poor solution for a wireless device.


The never ending dream of putting everything on wireless - even if a wired connection reads very feasible. Beyond me (sorry).

 


@Malatr wrote:

Today when it restarted, thank you Windows for forcing that during the workday,


Windows 10 allows to define activity times where it does not install updates, and certainly won't enforce a reboot - certainly once it's set-up, configued, up and running.

 


@Malatr wrote:

it stopped being able to handle its network load, crashing the entire network. Repeatedly.


This sounds wrong (to bad) - I'm neither Netgear nor an Orbi engineer. @Christian_R  can you assist please? Orbi (or any other wireless system) going down - suspect caused by high load - is not acceptable.

 


@Malatr wrote:

Why the Orbi thinks this computer suddenly needs a 2.4gHz signal is a real mystery to me, but plugging the pc in fixed it; which is a poor solution for a wireless device.


Orbi does not think that - in the first iteration it's _always_ the client which does associate with the Wireless.

 


@Malatr wrote:

I'm absolutely fine with the solution being a shared SSID and the ability to assign the proper band to devices as necessary from the advanced settings, but flexibility should be a core design principle for anyone not designing iPhones.


Have never seen  Windows 10 wireless driver which allows to force the connection to a preferred band. This is not an iPhone feature - this is the industry standard - and neither Orbi's nor any other vendor Mesh system. Mesh and similar business class networks are run that way - the flexible and seamless roaming between the different bands and access points is key for the functionality.

 

 

Message 533 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@Malatr wrote:

@schumaku 

I have a pc sitting 15 inches away from the main Orbi that has been fine for a couple weeks; a simultaneous new installation of pcs and Orbis. Today when it restarted, thank you Windows for forcing that during the workday, it stopped being able to handle its network load, crashing the entire network. Repeatedly. Why the Orbi thinks this computer suddenly needs a 2.4gHz signal is a real mystery to me, but plugging the pc in fixed it; which is a poor solution for a wireless device.

 

I'm absolutely fine with the solution being a shared SSID and the ability to assign the proper band to devices as necessary from the advanced settings, but flexibility should be a core design principle for anyone not designing iPhones.


Turn off fast roaming if enabled. I had security cameras that would suddenly change from router to satellite for no reason. Once I turned this off the devices stuck to the nearest access point without any further issues.

 

...and again.. for the record...

 

I am running the latest firmware and have successfully separated the bands without any issue using the commands previously detailed in this thread. I've been running it for months with separate SSID's for 2.4Ghz and 5.0Ghz without any problems at all (other than switching between access points mentioned above, which disabling fast roaming fixed).

Message 534 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

Hi @dwood just about to buy a pair and this 2.4GHz issue seems to be a gnarly one. I saw that you said you had reliably configured yours to run separate 2.4 and 5GHz SSIDs using commands previosly detailed in this thread.

I've not trawled through the whole thread, there's now 22 pages of posts, but there seems to be several people offering commands. Are you referring to the details in the first post? They are still accurate and not superseded further into the thread?

Appreciate your help.

Message 535 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@PhilthyM wrote:

I've not trawled through the whole thread, there's now 22 pages of posts, but there seems to be several people offering commands. Are you referring to the details in the first post? They are still accurate and not superseded further into the thread?


Quite understandable, it has been running for a long time and is mostly repetitive.

 

The first thing you should ask yourself is "Why do I want to do this?"

 

For some people, the answer is "because I want to". Or, even worse, "because Netgear makes it difficult".

 

For many people, it turns out that they really do not need to separate the SSIDs. One common theme is that they want to do it to set up some IoT device that will only work on 2.4 GHz. In those cases, it is rarely necessary to separate SSIDs. There are other strategies.

 

So, ask yourself what you want to do, and then see if there are ways of achieving your ambition without breaking the whole point of Mesh technology.

 

This has all been said before, but your admission that you haven't read everything, and don't seem to have mentioned it in your earlier communications, means that you may have missed this aspect.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just another user.

My network DM200 -> R7800 -> GS316 -> PL1000 -> Orbi RBR40 -> Orbi RBS50Y -> RBS40V
Message 536 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@PhilthyM wrote:

Hi @dwood just about to buy a pair and this 2.4GHz issue seems to be a gnarly one. I saw that you said you had reliably configured yours to run separate 2.4 and 5GHz SSIDs using commands previosly detailed in this thread.

I've not trawled through the whole thread, there's now 22 pages of posts, but there seems to be several people offering commands. Are you referring to the details in the first post? They are still accurate and not superseded further into the thread?

Appreciate your help.


Here are alll the instructions again just for you Smiley Happy ... and please dont listen to those naysayers who question your judgement, and why you wish to separate the SSID's. There are plenty of reasons to do so, your personal preference and desire being foremost. You wouldnt buy a car with six gears and keep it in first all the time.

----------------------------------------

Apply all of the following commands to BOTH devices at the same time via telnet sessions. You can enable Telnet for each device by ticking the Telnet check box in the debug page for each unit. http://YOUR DEVICE IP ADDRESS GOES HERE /debug.htm

 

Before you try to change the SSIDS run the below command on each device. This turns off automatic merging of the two SSID's back in to one SSID after a reboot. (This is the most common issue on the latest firmware).

 

config set wifison-monitor_stop=1

config commit


(If you ever need to reverse this setting use the command > config set wifison-monitor_stop=0)

 

The commands below will then set the the 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz networks to the names you want:

config set wl_ssid="YOUR SSID 2.4Ghz NAME"
config set wla_ssid="YOUR SSID 5Ghz NAME"
config commit

The commands below check the SSID names have been set as required and apply a reboot when ready.

 

config get wl_ssid
config get wla_ssid
reboot

Only reboot the RBR50. Switch the satellite RBS50 off once you have issued the command and dont bring it back online until the RBR50 has fully rebooted and settled and you can see both SSIDS's

Again...  Make sure you have commited all of the commnds on both devices before issuing the reboot command to reboot the RBR50.

 

Once the RBR50 is back on line and both SSID's are availabel switch onthe sattelite RBS50 and let it settle. It will also begin advertising the new SSID's

Message 537 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@PhilthyM wrote:

Hi @dwood just about to buy a pair and this 2.4GHz issue seems to be a gnarly one.


Amazing - what issue please, and why? Almost all industry standard Mesh system don't have such an option, and offer no shell access to destroy the manufacturer design.

 

Splitting does cause more issues than what it does fix and stopping services most people here don't have an idea what other problems and shortcomings they are causing. It's like removing the four wheel drive and half of the batteries.

 

On your own - your system.


@michaelkenward is perfectly right with his question above.

Message 538 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

Thanks @dwood I went ahead and ordered, but now Australia is shutting everything down, so not sure if my purchase will go ahead anyway! I look forward to making this tweak if/when I get my delivery. Really appreciate your time and support.

@michaelkenwardand @schumaku thanks for your input. I have several reasons, not least of which is that all devices in my home are 5GHz and I don't want them dropping to the slower 2.4GHz needlessly. 2.4GHz is too slow for the many things I use my network for. If I'm paying A$500 for a network solution I want it my way. It doesn't seem too much to ask for the manufacturer to let me turn off 2.4GHz as many have done for years. We all have our own experiences and reasons for wanting to do things to suit ourselves, what's the harm in making that just a bit easier?

Message 539 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@PhilthyM wrote:


@michaelkenwardand @schumaku thanks for your input. I have several reasons, not least of which is that all devices in my home are 5GHz and I don't want them dropping to the slower 2.4GHz needlessly. 2.4GHz is too slow for the many things I use my network for.


That is down to your wifi clients. Not really an Orbi issue.

 

At least you have a valid reason for wantings separation. This is not true of many people who turn up here, which is why I asked.

 

Have you checked that a 5GHz wifi client that is struggling to maintain a link is actually faster than a solid 2.4 GHz connection? Remember, most wifi clients should do their best to maintain the most effective connection. Just because you have a 5 GHz link does not mean that it is delivering faster communication than a 2.4 GHz link with a better signal.

 

Perhaps Netgear should advise people not to buy Orbi systems if they don't want the advantages of Mesh technology.

Just another user.

My network DM200 -> R7800 -> GS316 -> PL1000 -> Orbi RBR40 -> Orbi RBS50Y -> RBS40V
Message 540 of 739
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Aspirant

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

Thanks @dwood !   Your input has been extremely helpful.  As a tech novice, I've struggled to get my RBR50 to stop dropping my wifi connections during work hours.  I hear these terms being thrown out like mesh and dynamic that apparently are meant to describe how the router and satelite do some type of workload balance of the devices using the wifi.  Unfortunately for me, nobody cares (but they do complain) when my work softphone and work Skype sessisions temporarely drop while the router/satelite rebalance or reset unexpectedly.  Whatever its called it creates a disruption for my work.   I've applied the steps that you reshared; and currently crossing my fingures that they stick/work.  Unfortunately the supplier I purchased the RBR50 from had a 15 day return policy and I'm about a 1.5 months into this ~$400 purchase.   

 

Lastly, after applying the instructions you provided, once completed, should I disable the Telnet which was required during the initial debug step? 

 

Thanks again and keep posting, everyones ideas are invaluable.      

Message 541 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

@michaelkenwardI'm kinda confused here, why are you so strongly opposed to people tweaking their own equipment that they have bought?

Yes it's down to my WiFi clients and I never once suggested it's an "Orbi issue", but that doesn't mean it might not be a problem that requires a solution. I don't even have them yet, so I don't know for sure that this will be an issue. However I have seen comments that suggest it does occur, and I have seen this on other WiFi networks too, so would like to know that I have options if I'm going to pay that kind of money. (I have paid now, so I'm committed!)

 

With regard to the 5GHz clients being faster etc, the whole point of buying this kit is that I am taking a leap of faith that the 5GHz network will be fast enough. I transfer a lot of data around the home so speed is king for me. If it weren't I would not be plonking down A$500 for high end consumer devices!

 

Lastly, your comment about Netgear advising people not to buy Orbi unless they want all the advantages of mesh seems a little churlish if you don't mind me saying! People buy consumer goods for any number of reasons, it doesn't mean thet have to use all features of that product. People buy convertable grand tourers and never put the roof up! In my case I want a single SSID for 5GHz with heaps of power and the dedicated back channel. The Orbi seems to be the best product that meets those needs. Sorry if I don't want 20 year old technology interfering with my simplistic requirements.

Message 542 of 739
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Apprentice

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

I'm firmly in the "I have to seperate my SSIDs for any WiFi network to work at my home", a huge part of this is around my IoT devices I have. When I have my SSIDs combined, either my devices will not connect, or I get an abismal speed that prevents them from working reliably.

The second (less important) reason for me is similar to you, I need much higher speeds v.s. what 2.4 gives me against my Fiber connection.

 

Having said that, if my issue was only with #2 (and I didn't have any 2.4 only devices like most my IoT devices sadly), then one approach you can take in advanced wireless settings is to disable your 2.4 Ghz Broadcast and/or drastically reduce it's "power threshhold".

NETGEAR_Router_Orbi.png

 

 

Message 543 of 739
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Apprentice

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

I had no idea that these mesh routers would be so hard to migrate from my netgear router.  With about 100 devices using separate SSID's AND separate passcodes on 2.4 and 5 bands, it took me over a day to get migrated to the RBR50.  And that's after I split the SSID's as described in this forum.  Then there's the firmware nightmare.  I'm using 1 RBS50 and 2 RBS40's.  All devices are on V2.3.5.30.  But now a new F/W has come out for the RBR/S50, but not for the 40's.  So, I need to keep all devices on V2.3.5.30... but the RBS50 wants to autoupdate to the new F/W, so I had to go into the configuration page for the RBS50 and downgrade the firmware back to V2.3.5.30.  And, of course, if I do upgrade the firmware in the RBR50, then, as has been pointed out here, you have to go back into the router and split the SSID's all over again.  If I had known all of this I would have found a better non-mesh solution.

1xRBR50 1xRBS50 2xRBS40
Model: RBR50|Orbi AC3000 Tri-band WiFi Router
Message 544 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@madhatter wrote:

With about 100 devices using separate SSID's AND separate passcodes on 2.4 and 5 bands, it took me over a day to get migrated to the RBR50. And that's after I split the SSID's as described in this forum.


What is so difficult to set the previously configured SSIDs and passphrases again? There was and is no reason - especially for the users insisting they have to split the SSIDs - to change anything on the clients.

 


@madhatter wrote:

Then there's the firmware nightmare.  I'm using 1 RBS50 and 2 RBS40's.  All devices are on V2.3.5.30.  But now a new F/W has come out for the RBR/S50, but not for the 40's.  So, I need to keep all devices on V2.3.5.30... but the RBS50 wants to autoupdate to the new F/W, so I had to go into the configuration page for the RBS50 and downgrade the firmware back to V2.3.5.30.


I'm fully with you - the firmware quality and consistency and continuity on Orbi is a single nightmare. But this is off-topic here.

 


@madhatter wrote:

And, of course, if I do upgrade the firmware in the RBR50, then, as has been pointed out here, you have to go back into the router and split the SSID's all over again.


Nobody from Netgear - except some people in several communities - insists that it can be done. Zero backing of this process or support by Netgear. It was always and is still a non-supported hack.

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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@soundersfc wrote:

Having said that, if my issue was only with #2 (and I didn't have any 2.4 only devices like most my IoT devices sadly), then one approach you can take in advanced wireless settings is to disable your 2.4 Ghz Broadcast and/or drastically reduce it's "power threshhold".


Interesting approach - this makes the 2.4 GHz much less "attractive" to the clients.

Message 546 of 739
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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

A third approach which I might have to try (but it has a ton of negative consequences for me) is to move all of my IoT devices to my Orbi "Guest" network and truly isolate that to 2.4ghz.

 

That's the killer here for me. The forms people are so mad that we customers need this seperation to work for the reality of all the wifi devices out there that make up our home, yet with guest mode (and this hack), the Orbi system absolutely can support this. The dream that band stearing works flawlessly for all old and new devices out there is completely flawed.

 

Anyhow.. rant over. I hope I've help people understand both;

1. Why Seperate SSIDs are needed for people like me

2. Work-around for how you could mostly solve this problem with the advanced settings and/or guest mode if you can't or would prefer not to do the seperation since it is not (very unfortunatly) supported by Orbi.

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Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi

Everyone is entitled to configure/tweak Orbi to suite the need, which is different for everyone.  One has to weight the pros and cons of doing so.  With the ability/tweak to assign unique SSID to each Satellite on Guest network and retain the signle SSID on Main network, I have the best of both worlds.

 

For example, I can force all the devices/IoTs to connect to the nearest Router or Satellite(s) via its uniquely assigned Guest SSID on the desired 2.4Ghz/5Ghz band all the time.  I don't have to worry which order to reboot my Router or Satellite(s).  I don't have to worry about changing the WiFi settings temporary to (re)connect those IoT devices or 5Ghz clients on a specific band.  The downside is that it's not a simple config/setup to maintain.

 

Is it supported by NG?

No.

 

Is it recommended?

No.

 

Is it doing what I want?

Yes.

 

Is it worth the trouble?

It's a personal decision.

 

Good luck and be safe!

Message 548 of 739
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Apprentice

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@schumaku wrote:

@madhatter wrote:

With about 100 devices using separate SSID's AND separate passcodes on 2.4 and 5 bands, it took me over a day to get migrated to the RBR50. And that's after I split the SSID's as described in this forum.


What is so difficult to set the previously configured SSIDs and passphrases again? There was and is no reason - especially for the users insisting they have to split the SSIDs - to change anything on the clients.

 

>> the reason it's so hard is that with my 2.4 IoT devices I had to go into their respective App, disconnect / reset the device and then reconnect with the new passphrase or SSID (you can choose to keep 1 the same, but not both)... and that just takes a lot of time.  Had I known that these mesh systems worked this way, I wouldn't have even considered it.

 


@madhatter wrote:

Then there's the firmware nightmare.  I'm using 1 RBS50 and 2 RBS40's.  All devices are on V2.3.5.30.  But now a new F/W has come out for the RBR/S50, but not for the 40's.  So, I need to keep all devices on V2.3.5.30... but the RBS50 wants to autoupdate to the new F/W, so I had to go into the configuration page for the RBS50 and downgrade the firmware back to V2.3.5.30.


I'm fully with you - the firmware quality and consistency and continuity on Orbi is a single nightmare. But this is off-topic here.

 


@madhatter wrote:

And, of course, if I do upgrade the firmware in the RBR50, then, as has been pointed out here, you have to go back into the router and split the SSID's all over again.


Nobody from Netgear - except some people in several communities - insists that it can be done. Zero backing of this process or support by Netgear. It was always and is still a non-supported hack.

>> yup, and I'm glad that I found this solution on here, otherwise this router would not have worked at all.


 

1xRBR50 1xRBS50 2xRBS40
Model: RBR50|Orbi AC3000 Tri-band WiFi Router
Message 549 of 739
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Prodigy

Re: How to set a separate SSID for the 5 GHz network on your Orbi


@SW_ wrote:

Everyone is entitled to configure/tweak Orbi to suite the need, which is different for everyone.  One has to weight the pros and cons of doing so.  With the ability/tweak to assign unique SSID to each Satellite on Guest network and retain the signle SSID on Main network, I have the best of both worlds.

 

For example, I can force all the devices/IoTs to connect to the nearest Router or Satellite(s) via its uniquely assigned Guest SSID on the desired 2.4Ghz/5Ghz band all the time.  I don't have to worry which order to reboot my Router or Satellite(s).  I don't have to worry about changing the WiFi settings temporary to (re)connect those IoT devices or 5Ghz clients on a specific band.  The downside is that it's not a simple config/setup to maintain.

 

Is it supported by NG?

No.

 

Is it recommended?

No.

 

Is it doing what I want?

Yes.

 

Is it worth the trouble?

It's a personal decision.

 

Good luck and be safe!


...the pros and cons?

 

Pros:

  • 3 different SSIDs for 2.4Ghz on Guest network
  • 3 different SSIDs for 5Ghz on Guest network
  • Retain single Mesh SSID for both 2.4Ghz/5Ghz on Main network

Cons:

  • Complicate to setup and maintain
  • Might not work accross FW upgrade

 

It's like having 6 separate Guest WiFi networks + one Mesh network all in one box.

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