Announcements

Top Contributors
Reply
Highlighted
Virtuoso

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@TechnologyGuy wrote:

I really wanted the Orbi but due to the Nest issues I decided to go with Google WiFi instead.  It's been great so far and there are no issues what-so-ever with the Nest/Dropcam camera.

 


It's unfortunate that you were scared away from even trying Orbi just because of this and other problem reports in this forum.  To reiterate, virtually everyone has no issues with Nest/Dropcam cameras as long as "implicit beamforming" is disabled.  I have 2 Dropcams and 3 Nest cameras and had zero issues what-so-ever after setting this option off.  I've read a very small number of people reporting camera disconnect problems even after making this change, but the vast majority are fine after this workaround.  The implicit beamforming feature was enabled by default in the first firmware versions but the default has since changed.

 

Also, I personally did not notice any noticeable performance differences with implicit beamforming on (I've tried switching it back on after each firmware release, but switched back) so I don't really care that it's off.  Therefore it doesn't bother me that the feature is not available to me right now and nor do I worry that I paid $X for this router and can't enable this feature.  What really matters to me is that overall wireless performance in my house and the Orbi has been terrific so far, i.e., much better than the many previous top-of-the-line wireless routers I've tried over the years.  Orbi and the other competitive "mesh" routers are a great improvement!

 

 

Message 126 of 246
Highlighted

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

 

 

>>  To reiterate, virtually everyone has no issues with Nest/Dropcam cameras as long as "implicit beamforming" is disabled.

 

But I don't want to disable Implicit Beamforming.  If you're okay with disabling it then that's great for you (sincerely) but I personally would rather not have to turn it off.

 

 

>>  What really matters to me is that overall wireless performance in my house and the Orbi has been terrific so far, i.e., much better than the many previous top-of-the-line wireless routers I've tried over the years.

 

Absolutely, overall wireless performance is what really matters.  Luckily for me, the Google WiFi product has also been terrific so far, and also much better than the many previous top-of-the-line wireless routers I've tried over the years.  The fact that I saved $100 over the Orbi makes me feel good about my purchase, and not having to disable Implicit Beamforming makes me feel even better.

 

 

 

Message 127 of 246
Highlighted
Star

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

"It's unfortunate that you were scared away from even trying Orbi just because of this and other problem reports in this forum."

 

I wasn't scared to try it. I bought it as soon as it was in stock with Best Buy. I experienced the problems with my Nest cameras right away. I did turn off beamforming, but my performance with other devices wasn't as good. I went through one firmware update and obviously it didn't fix the problem. I ended up returning it.

 

That's great that you're ok with turning off beamforming, but just like TechnologyGuy, I wasn't ok with turning off beamforming. I also bought the Google Wifi 3 pack. Zero drops with my Nest cams. Performance has been great. And I won't complain about saving $100.

 

Another plus for me is that Google Wifi is much smaller. The Orbi has a beatiful design, but it's pretty big. The Google Wifi receivers blend into my house much better.

Message 128 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

I have to agree with Technology Guy. I do get the sense that the Orbi was not fully developed/sorted out when it was put on the market. This seems quite odd and I feel that I payed a high price for an inferior product. I recently ordered a Synology Rt2600AC. This router is amazing! MU-MIMO works, Beamforming works and for the price there is so much more. Performance is notably different than the Orbi and I have no fluctuations in speed. I noticed the fluctuations even with just the Orbi router connected, no satellites and with beamforming and MU-MIMO on and off. I also noted the disconnects with Apple products. Why is there no response from Netgear? I can really not advise anyone to buy this product in the current situation.

Message 129 of 246
Highlighted
Guide

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

Does the Google WiFi have Implicit beamforming?

 

I wasn't able to measure any difference between having it on and off on Orbi. Implicit beamforming is for older N devices. Explicit, which works fine on Orbi, is for new ac devices. So, having it off is no great loss for me.

 

I don't intend that as a defense of the Orbi product.  I stuck with it because I didn’t want to take performance hit of multi-hop mesh. I regret that decision now and I’m out of the return window. Orbi is just too flaky, I should have gone with stability over performance. A coworker has been debating between Orbi and Google WiFi, I told him to skip the Orbi.

Message 130 of 246
Highlighted
Guide

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

How do you know MU-MIMO is working?

 

I run my Orbi with MU-MIMO on and implict beamforming off.  The only device I have problems with is my Harmony Hub.

Message 131 of 246
Highlighted
Star

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@Skrymir wrote:

Does the Google WiFi have Implicit beamforming?

 

 


 

It has "TX Beamforming" according to their specs.

 

https://support.google.com/wifi/answer/6280668

Message 132 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

I just don't see the same issues with the Synology that I see with the Orbi. I have a NAS connected to the main router. The fluctuations in speed is quite evident in transferring files wirelessly. With settings mentioned above on or off. With different firmware. No similar problems noted with the Synology, ASUS, TP link, Airport extreme. The Synology and ASUS has MU-MIMO. Whether the problem lies with implicit or explicit beamforming or MU-MIMO is irrelevant to me as I am not a very techy person. I just bought a device that is marketed with certain functions and it obviously does not work properly. Did my money not pay properly for the device??

Message 133 of 246
Highlighted
Guide

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

The Synology Rt2600AC is a different type of product.  It is just a single access point so doesn't really compare to Orbi or Google WiFi. If you can get away with a single AP that's great, gives you a ton of options.

 

I have a fair amount of square footage to cover, a single AP just won't do it.

Message 134 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

Agreed, but the point I wanted to make just as an example, is that the Synology product is well developed and doing what it is marketed for. Seems like some people have the same experience with Google WiFi and are quite happy with the product. Sadly not the case with the Orbi...

Message 135 of 246
Highlighted

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

>>  I have a fair amount of square footage to cover, a single AP just won't do it.

 

If it helps, I've got a 3500+ square foot house which had great coverage in some areas and lousy coverage in others.  With the Google WiFi 3 pack we now have total coverage in every area of the house -- plus in the backyard -- plus in the garage -- plus on the driveway...

Message 136 of 246
Highlighted

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@Guytech wrote:

Agreed, but the point I wanted to make just as an example, is that the Synology product is well developed and doing what it is marketed for. Seems like some people have the same experience with Google WiFi and are quite happy with the product. Sadly not the case with the Orbi...


 

in your case perhaps not but in lots of cases the orbi does exactly what it says it does and provides whole home wifi , if you are not getting this and yet havnt tried the google wifi in the same location you cant say if the google wifi wiould be any better or the same or otherwise , you may also consider other factors like you have a faulty unit or other enviornmental factors at work , oh and if you bother to skip over to the google wifi forums there are issues over there for certain users and setups , oh and dont forget the lack of features it has

Message 137 of 246
Highlighted
Star

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@peteytesting wrote:


in your case perhaps not but in lots of cases the orbi does exactly what it says it does and provides whole home wifi , if you are not getting this and yet havnt tried the google wifi in the same location you cant say if the google wifi wiould be any better or the same or otherwise , you may also consider other factors like you have a faulty unit or other enviornmental factors at work , oh and if you bother to skip over to the google wifi forums there are issues over there for certain users and setups , oh and dont forget the lack of features it has


 

I don't mean to start a flame war, but come on, saying that maybe Guytech had a faulty unit when the Orbi issues are well documented seems to me like you are a Netgear apologist.

 

As for your other point, I have actually tried the Google Wifi and the Orbi in the same location. Google Wifi works period. I got great signal with the Orbi and beamforming, but then my Nest Cams would drop all the time. Or I could turn off beam forming and the Nest Cams would be ok, but I would experience slower performance with other devices.

Message 138 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

Thanks Verdugan, well said.

Just to make it clear, I never intended to start an argument, but other customers should be aware of these potential problems. I appreciate the feedback from people that tried other similar products in the same situation. Maybe I would have bought the Google WiFi if I had some money left!

Message 139 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

"oh and dont forget the lack of features it has"

Like the Orbi app??

Message 140 of 246
Highlighted

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@Guytech wrote:

"oh and dont forget the lack of features it has"

Like the Orbi app??


 

features of the router and firewall etc im talking about , not to mention the need to be connected to the internet at all times to have connectivity which the google wifi needs and the orbi doesnt , sorry buy google wifi is like apple gear in that it traps you into its system to have functionality , smart on google's behalf but horrible as a user

 

 

Message 141 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

I installed Orbi 2-unit connected AP mode to my FiOS router and LAN switch. I noticed 2 times that web pages didn't load.... did a quick ping check and when it happens I cannot ping the FiOS router/gateway. Then maybe 20-30 seconds or so it comes back.

 

I watched an entire 1 hour show on my Apple TV connected to the Satellite unit and never had a blip, not even one buffering episode. Not sure what can be causing this. Orbi router is connected using static IP to the LAN.

Message 142 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@gfrey wrote:

I considered waiting for the Google Mesh system but chose to give Orbi a try while I waited.  Google's mesh system is the best mesh out there for the price.  There is no doubt.  But the performance will not compete with the Orbi system from other floors or long distances.  That is why I stuck with the Orbi.  Yes, I have a bunch of Nest products that were constantly going offline and turning off Beamforming fixed it.  I did a lot of testing around my house and found no big hits in performance or quality due to turning it off.  So I am happy with Orbi even with Beamforming turned off.  Just do a quick Google about Beamforming.  To me it is definitely nice to have in a single AP system but not necessary for the Orbi due to it's dedicated backbone system.  Just my 2 cents.


Besides GoogleWifi does not support bridge mode in mesh and is hard coded to 192.168.86.x IP 

Message 143 of 246
Highlighted

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

I got my Orbi setup yesterday and thanks to this thread, I've got at least the first 24 hrs with zero problems. 15 devices connected via wifi at full WAN speed everywhere inside my house and 75% of full 235mbps connection in my backyard. Very happy about that.

Mu-mimo ON for multiple ROKU streams

Implicit beamforming OFF, thereby relying on only the Explicit beamforming that is enabled by default

Laptops, phones, rokus, Harmonys, Tempurpedic, Mak pellet smoker all connected continuously. Happy camper here, I don't plan on turning on Implicit beamforming as all my devices are working fast and flawless without it. This is better in my house than the R8500 and EX7300 extender. It's like having 2 great access points hardwired together without worrying about running LAN cable.

Message 144 of 246
Highlighted
Star

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

Linksys came out with the Velop Tri-Band. Sounds very similar to the Orbi. It is offered in packages of 3, 2, and 1 nodes.

 

it's more expensive at $500 for the 3 node, but if two nodes are enough it's $349.

 

I've been happy with Google Wifi, but I'm going to give the Velop a try. I'll report back in a few days.

Message 145 of 246
Highlighted

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

I ran a 3 pack Velop for 1 day and returned it. I was only getting 30-75% of my WAN speeds wirelessly. Really odd, I chalk it up to immature firmware but YMMV.
Message 146 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@verdugan wrote:

Linksys came out with the Velop Tri-Band. Sounds very similar to the Orbi. It is offered in packages of 3, 2, and 1 nodes.

 

it's more expensive at $500 for the 3 node, but if two nodes are enough it's $349.

 

I've been happy with Google Wifi, but I'm going to give the Velop a try. I'll report back in a few days.


Check the reviews for the Velop (smallnetbuilder).... not ready for primetime

Message 147 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

Have given up now and returned mine to Amazon. Could not live with constant iOS disconnections. It's a Shame as I really wanted to like this product but I had to make a decision quickly to return due to amazon returns policy running out. Have given netgear months to fix and they should have come up with a solution by now. When I spoke to tech support didn't appear to offer any timescale other than to say our engineers are looking at it? Good luck to others that persivere With the system and hopefully they iron out the bugs in time. 

Message 148 of 246
Highlighted
Star

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?


@verdugan wrote:

Linksys came out with the Velop Tri-Band. Sounds very similar to the Orbi. It is offered in packages of 3, 2, and 1 nodes.

 

it's more expensive at $500 for the 3 node, but if two nodes are enough it's $349.

 

I've been happy with Google Wifi, but I'm going to give the Velop a try. I'll report back in a few days.


 

I tried the Velop. Spoiler alert: I returned it.

 

Installation: It was smoother than the Orbi, but the Linksys app is not as good as Google Wifi's. 

 

Performance: It was good for my laptop, phones, BUT I experienced the same 10- or 15- minute disconnect with one Nest cam as I did with Orbi. What's interesting is that it was only one Nest cam that was disconnecting and it was 5 feet away from one Velop Node. The other ones didn't disconnect.

 

Another Issue: I set it Thursday night and everything was fine. When I came home from work on Friday, I noticed that one of the nodes had disconnected (flashing red light.) The app didn't notify me at all. No biggie, I'll just reconnect it. I tried 4 times and it wouldnt' reconnect.

 

I'm sticking with Google Wifi.

Message 149 of 246
Highlighted
Apprentice

Re: Intermittent internet connectivity outage with Orbi?

I could have saved you the headache. I returned my google wifi for the Velop. Hugh mistake. I have now returned the Velop and I'm using my Orbi till my new Google wifi gets delivered. Then the Orbi will go back on the closet.
Message 150 of 246