Orbi RBR20 repeatedly loses wifi. Netgear Support no help

[ChefJeff]

Hi,

I have seen several posts on losing wifi signal, but nothing seems to be exactly related to my case.  The wife wants me to get rid of the Orbi "POS" and get something that works.  I'm hoping that a community expert may be able to help me figure out what is wrong so I don't have to throw out what is an exceptional router when it works.

Here are some details.  RBR20 base with 2 RBW30 satellites.  

Wifi drops several times a day.

Turning router off and on does nothing.  I have to go into routerlogin and re-apply the settings to get it to work, even though it appears the settings are correct.

Been on the phone with Netgear support at least 8 times (average 1 1/2 hours each).

Support has tried several things including:

1.  Static IP and DNS servers

2.  Cloning my laptop MAC address

3.  Changing channels

4.  Changing preamble mode to "Long Preamble"

5.  Having me reboot the system (tried this several times)

6.  Disconnecting the satellites.

My ISP is fiber optic.  That means no modem - instead it has an optical network terminal.  I consistently have internet with a wired LAN connection to my laptop.

Don't know if this is significant, but if I use the ethernet port on the Orbi, I lose wired internet when the Orbi loses wifi.  Didn't think that was supposed to happen.

ISP provider has watched when I powered on the Orbi.  They can see the router, see it request a connection, see their system provide a connection, and then the Orbi disconnects.  Other times, the Orbi does not even request a connection, and the magenta light eventually comes on.

Firmware is version V2.3.5.26 for the RBR20 and V2.3.5.6 for the RBW30 satellites.  According to the webstie, those are both latest version.

Any suggestions on what to try next?  If the consensus is get rid of the Orbi, any suggestions on a good (preferably NOT NetGear) router for covering a 4500 sq foot house?  

When this thing works, it is great.  I am getting upload and download speeds at around 295 Mbps anywhere in the house!  

Thanks,

Jeff

[ChefJeff · Accepted solution]

After losing connection at least another dozen times in three days, one more call to Netgear support resulted in my Orbi totally locked up to where i can no longer even access it through routerlogin(even after a factory reset).  Based on that NetGear finally gave me an RMA. 

I can't afford to be without intgernet for however long it takes to get a repalcement Orbi, so I found a used Velop AC4400 system for $140.  Problem solved!  Not only that, but setting up the Velop was really simple, and the app works better than the Orbi app.  Best of all is that, rather than a router and satellite like the Orbi, each Velop unit is an actual router.  So if the router goes bad in the future, I can just swap it with the one I am currently using as the satellite, and at least still have internet.

I'll send the Orbi back for replacement, and may keep it around for a back-up, but I have lost all confidence in NetGear products.  

[CrimpOn]

How about one more call to Netgear.  "Eight attempts and  no solution.  It's time for an RMA on this box.  Send me a new one."

One description was unclear to me:

---

@ChefJeff wrote:

My ISP is fiber optic.  That means no modem - instead it has an optical network terminal.  I consistently have internet with a wired LAN connection to my laptop.

---

Does this mean that the laptop is connected to the ONT and remains working at the same time that the Orbi loses connection?  Or, does this mean that a laptop connected to the ONT remains connected for longer than the Orbi typically does?

Has anyone suggested looking at the DHCP lease the Orbi receives from the ISP?  On the Orbi web interface, the Advanced Tab, click on "Connection Status".  For example, Spectrum gives me a 1 day lease, and the Orbi typically renews it when half done (12 hours). We had a post recently where the Orbi would lose internet when the DHCP lease expired, indicating that something was going wrong with the lease renewal process.

[ChefJeff]

"Does this mean that the laptop is connected to the ONT and remains working at the same time that the Orbi loses connection?  Or, does this mean that a laptop connected to the ONT remains connected for longer than the Orbi typically does?"

No, I have to disconnect the Orbi from the ISP jack and plug in a LAN cable from the ISP jack to my laptop.

"On the Orbi web interface, the Advanced Tab, click on "Connection Status""

On the advanced tab, I don't see a connection status.  Closest thing is "Advanced Home", "Setup", "Security", "Administration", and "Advanced Setup". Seraching all of those, all I see is DHCP Server is "ON".

My ISP has mentioned that they use about a four hour lease period.  If something is wrong with lease renewal, would it be on my end or on their end?

[FURRYe38]

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too?

What is the size of your home? Sq Ft?
What is the distance between the router and satellite(s)? 30 feet is recommended in between them to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected.

What channels are you using? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.
Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Try enabling Beamforming and MIMO(MIMO may or maynot be needed) and WMM. Under Advanced Tab/Advanced Settings/Wireless Settings

Try disabling the following and see:
Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

---

@ChefJeff wrote:

Hi,

I have seen several posts on losing wifi signal, but nothing seems to be exactly related to my case.  The wife wants me to get rid of the Orbi "POS" and get something that works.  I'm hoping that a community expert may be able to help me figure out what is wrong so I don't have to throw out what is an exceptional router when it works.

Here are some details.  RBR20 base with 2 RBW30 satellites.  

Wifi drops several times a day.

Turning router off and on does nothing.  I have to go into routerlogin and re-apply the settings to get it to work, even though it appears the settings are correct.

Been on the phone with Netgear support at least 8 times (average 1 1/2 hours each).

Support has tried several things including:

1.  Static IP and DNS servers

2.  Cloning my laptop MAC address

3.  Changing channels

4.  Changing preamble mode to "Long Preamble"

5.  Having me reboot the system (tried this several times)

6.  Disconnecting the satellites.

My ISP is fiber optic.  That means no modem - instead it has an optical network terminal.  I consistently have internet with a wired LAN connection to my laptop.

Don't know if this is significant, but if I use the ethernet port on the Orbi, I lose wired internet when the Orbi loses wifi.  Didn't think that was supposed to happen.

ISP provider has watched when I powered on the Orbi.  They can see the router, see it request a connection, see their system provide a connection, and then the Orbi disconnects.  Other times, the Orbi does not even request a connection, and the magenta light eventually comes on.

Firmware is version V2.3.5.26 for the RBR20 and V2.3.5.6 for the RBW30 satellites.  According to the webstie, those are both latest version.

Any suggestions on what to try next?  If the consensus is get rid of the Orbi, any suggestions on a good (preferably NOT NetGear) router for covering a 4500 sq foot house?  

When this thing works, it is great.  I am getting upload and download speeds at around 295 Mbps anywhere in the house!  

Thanks,

Jeff

---

[ChefJeff]

As I mentioned, there is no ISP modem.  This is a fiber optic system.  Instead of a modem, there is an optical network terminal.  

Have already tried all of the channels you suggested.  Support has changed those setting several times.  Currently manually set to channels 1 and 48.

Nearest wifi neighbor is 300 feet away.  My daughter's boyfriend does have a wifi hotspot on his phone. Don't know if that is related, but we lose wifi whether he is here or not.

I'll try your recommended settings, reboot, and let you know what happens (although it may be several hours before I see any difference.

[ChefJeff]

House is about 4500 sq ft (single story with basement).  Satellites are about twenty feet from the router.  

[CrimpOn]

Sorry I was not clear. Connection status is on the Advanced home page, in the top right box. A 4 hour lease should mean that the Orbi begins to renew at 2 hours, and goes into a panic at hour 4. The Wikipedia article on DHCP explains the process.

[FURRYe38]

20 feet would be too close for the RBWs with the RBR. 30 feet is recommended in between them to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected.

---

@ChefJeff wrote:

House is about 4500 sq ft (single story with basement).  Satellites are about twenty feet from the router.  

---

[CrimpOn]

Just a suggestion:  with a DHCP lease of 4 hours, I would go to the debug page, http://<ip of Orbi>/debug.htm, and "Enable the LAN/WAN packet capture", then "Start Capture".  When the Orbi loses internet, "Stop Capture" and save the debug file.  This produces a zip file that includes every packet seen on the LAN side of the Orbi and on the WAN side of the Orbi.  There should be evidence on the WAN side of the Orbi asking to renew the DHCP lease when 1/2 of the 4 hour lease has expired.  Nothing from Orbi?  Orbi is at fault.  No response from the ISP?  ISP is at fault.

If you do not have experience with a packet capture program, such as Wireshark, offer to send the file to Netgear support.  (Maybe put upload it to a Dropbox, Google, Microsoft, etc. file and send them a link.)

[ChefJeff · Accepted solution]

After losing connection at least another dozen times in three days, one more call to Netgear support resulted in my Orbi totally locked up to where i can no longer even access it through routerlogin(even after a factory reset).  Based on that NetGear finally gave me an RMA. 

I can't afford to be without intgernet for however long it takes to get a repalcement Orbi, so I found a used Velop AC4400 system for $140.  Problem solved!  Not only that, but setting up the Velop was really simple, and the app works better than the Orbi app.  Best of all is that, rather than a router and satellite like the Orbi, each Velop unit is an actual router.  So if the router goes bad in the future, I can just swap it with the one I am currently using as the satellite, and at least still have internet.

I'll send the Orbi back for replacement, and may keep it around for a back-up, but I have lost all confidence in NetGear products.