RBS50 dropping internet connection for 2.4ghz devices but showing them as connected.

[dbtrade]

The current installed firmware is V2.7.4.24, but this has been going on for maybe a year or more through several firmware updates.

Everything will be running along fine, then after a few days items become invisible to the network.
Devices connected to the wired ports of the satellite remain fine.

The satellite and the main router connected devices report still shows them all as connected.
A power cycle on the satellite brings the 2.4 ghz items back.
A soft reboot via the satellite web interface does not.
I have two satellites and swapped their positions and the problem followed the satellite hardware.

It's a tough troubleshooting scenario because it often takes days or more before it happens. And often I just need the devices on to serve the urgency of the moment, so I power cycle the satellite. And then I am back to waiting for it to reappear.

My next thought would be to reset to some factory old firmware and then re-upgrade. 
Does that make sense? If so, what would be the procedure?

Thanks for any ideas.

[CrimpOn · Accepted solution]

Netgear chose an unfortunate term: Factory Reset.  The actual meaning is: "Remove all customer configuration and restart with the latest firmware that has been installed on the product."  The original "factory firmware" may be long gone.

When the satellite was off-line, devices that had been connected to it do not stop looking for WiFi.  When they find an access point with an SSID/password that they know that meets their minimum qualifications, they connect.  There appears to be a dramatic difference in the WiFi capabilities of different devices.  Things that are intended to be mobile (phones, tablets, laptops) often are programmed to constantly scan for "a better WiFi connection" and will change when they find one.  The 802.11r standard is designed to facilitate this.  Devices that are expected to remain in one place appear to stick with whatever WiFi access point they find (and quit looking).  If those devices do not switch from a "poor" connection to a "better" connection after the satellite has been in operation for a while, it might be worth attempting to restart those devices.  I recently discovered that two of my Wyze cameras were connected to an RBS40V that was clear across the house rather than one that was only 10 ft away.  Doing a restart, caused them to connect to the closer satellite.

If this situation has not been resolved, please comment again and people smarter than I may come up with a solution.

[FURRYe38]

What is the Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

What is the size of your home? Sq Ft?
What is the distance between the router and 📡 satellite(s)? 30 feet or more is recommended in between RBR and RBS📡 to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected.
https://kb.netgear.com/31029/Where-should-I-place-my-Orbi-satellite 📡

What channels are you using? Auto? Try Auto and 48 on 5Ghz. Or try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and 40 to 48 channel on 5Ghz.
Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Has a factory reset and setup from scratch been performed since last FW update? 

One User Experience/Configuration:
https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi/Most-Stable-Orbi-Configuration/m-p/1941087/highlight/true#M970...

[dbtrade]

I appreciate the quick response while I struggle to understand the quoting functions here: 
I can't seem to break up the quotes, so will insert my responses using italics

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@FURRYe38 wrote:

What is the Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

ARRIS TM3402A - I had not looked into this since the problem is isolated to one particular satellite

What is the size of your home? Sq Ft?
roughly 5000

What is the distance between the router and 📡 satellite(s)? 30 feet or more is recommended in between RBR and RBS📡 to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected.
https://kb.netgear.com/31029/Where-should-I-place-my-Orbi-satellite 📡

Am approximating 30 to 50 feet.  Remember that each satellite has occupied each other's location as I physically swapped satellites in my troubleshooting and the issue followed the physical satellite. In other words Sat A was at one end of the house and started showing the problem. Sat B was at the other end of the house and was fine. I physically put Sat B where Sat A was and vice-versa. The problem followed Sat A

What channels are you using? Auto? Try Auto and 48 on 5Ghz. Or try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and 40 to 48 channel on 5Ghz.

I have done WiFi surveys and set the 2.4ghz to the least trafficed channels. Again this all remained static while swapping the satellites.

Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Well yes, but they didn't move when I swapped satellites.  🙂

Has a factory reset and setup from scratch been performed since last FW update? 

This is a big part of what my question was. I have not done this and was looking for pointers and the current best practice for doing so. I would prefer to only perform this on the Satellite exhibiting the issues

One User Experience/Configuration:
https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi/Most-Stable-Orbi-Configuration/m-p/1941087/highlight/true#M970...

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Thanks again for the quick reply. I hope my answers lead to more possible solutions

[CrimpOn]

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@dbtrade wrote:

Everything will be running along fine, then after a few days items become invisible to the network.
Devices connected to the wired ports of the satellite remain fine.

The satellite and the main router connected devices report still shows them all as connected.

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Can you please explain more about "invisible to the network"? What sort of devices are they?

Do the devices show up as connected (a) on the Orbi app? (b) on the Orbi web administration Attached Devices display? or (c) both?

As the problem appears to follow the one satellite, my first step would be to perform a Factory Reset on that satellite. i.e. hold something in that tiny Reset hole on the back of the case next to the power LED until the power LED turns amber and then begins to flash.  (I unbend part of a paperclip.  This often takes 10-15 seconds).

[dbtrade]

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@CrimpOn wrote:

Can you please explain more about "invisible to the network"? What sort of devices are they?

Do the devices show up as connected (a) on the Orbi app? (b) on the Orbi web administration Attached Devices display? or (c) both?

As the problem appears to follow the one satellite, my first step would be to perform a Factory Reset on that satellite. i.e. hold something in that tiny Reset hole on the back of the case next to the power LED until the power LED turns amber and then begins to flash.  (I unbend part of a paperclip.  This often takes 10-15 seconds).

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Indeed a poor choice of words on my part. "invisible to the network" meant that other devices on the network could not ping them, yet they appear on the Orbi Web Administration page for both the satellite and the main router. I did not check using the app.
Seemed to be just devices, but not all on the 2.4ghz and one was a printer and the other a camera

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As the problem appears to follow the one satellite, my first step would be to perform a Factory Reset on that satellite. i.e. hold something in that tiny Reset hole on the back of the case next to the power LED until the power LED turns amber and then begins to flash.  (I unbend part of a paperclip.  This often takes 10-15 seconds).

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Thanks for the instruction, for some reason I thought it involved rolling back to some kind of base firmware.
I did the pin reset, then removed the satellite from the main router using the admin page. I then re-added the satellite using the orbi app.

Of course now many of the devices have attached to different access points, with most of the previously problematic devices having attached to the main router which is only slightly further from them as the satellite in question. But some devices are connected to the satellite. 
Nothing to do now but wait to see if the problem returns which would take at least a day in the previous circumstance.

I am hopeful that following your suggestions will clear the problem long term.

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[CrimpOn · Accepted solution]

Netgear chose an unfortunate term: Factory Reset.  The actual meaning is: "Remove all customer configuration and restart with the latest firmware that has been installed on the product."  The original "factory firmware" may be long gone.

When the satellite was off-line, devices that had been connected to it do not stop looking for WiFi.  When they find an access point with an SSID/password that they know that meets their minimum qualifications, they connect.  There appears to be a dramatic difference in the WiFi capabilities of different devices.  Things that are intended to be mobile (phones, tablets, laptops) often are programmed to constantly scan for "a better WiFi connection" and will change when they find one.  The 802.11r standard is designed to facilitate this.  Devices that are expected to remain in one place appear to stick with whatever WiFi access point they find (and quit looking).  If those devices do not switch from a "poor" connection to a "better" connection after the satellite has been in operation for a while, it might be worth attempting to restart those devices.  I recently discovered that two of my Wyze cameras were connected to an RBS40V that was clear across the house rather than one that was only 10 ft away.  Doing a restart, caused them to connect to the closer satellite.

If this situation has not been resolved, please comment again and people smarter than I may come up with a solution.

[dbtrade]

Thanks to all who contributed (just Crimpon really) 

It's been several days and the devices are all performing as expected. The factory reset process ( which involved more actions such as deleting the satellite device and re-adding it, which seemed to cause the other satellite to re-sync as well ) seems to have cured it for now. 

Will report back if it doesn't 'stick'