XBox network transfer

[GadgetVirtuoso2]

One Xbox One is wired and the other is wireless. The wired on can transfer from the wireless Xbox, but the wireless Xbox can't even see the wired Xbox. Both are on the same network (no VLANs). The wired Xbox is connected directly to the RBR50, and the wireless one is connected wireless to the same one. For security, I had turned off UPNP but even turning it back on made no difference. The wireless Xbox has no issues accessing the internet to download any games or any other media.

Not had issues with the Xbox on the network previously, anyone seen similar issues or have some info to point me in the right direction?

Obviously, the option is enabled on box machines.

[GadgetVirtuoso2 · Accepted solution]

I was able to resolve the issue by toggling the Network Transfer off and on both XBoxes. UPnP is turned off; this feature is only needed if you want the router to open ports to internal devices from the outside automatically and is not needed for any online gaming. It is still recommended by nearly all security professionals to turn off UPnP because of the security risks it presents.

Orbi like all consumer routers do not have a whitelist firewall, so it is not necessary to setup port forwarding or have UPnP enabled for these online services to work correctly. The default configuration is to pass all outbound traffic. You would have to actively block the XBox ports if you wanted to prevent this access.

[DavidUnboxed]

Eliminating UPnP works well with only one XBOXONEX behind the NAT.  Consider https://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/networking/network-ports-used-xbox-live.  To open the ports manually, you must specify an internal address to receive the traffic and you cannot do it to two or more at the same time.  To handle multiple, you either need multiple external addresses, to be able to convert a complete IPv6 solution (which gets rid of NAT), or use UPnP and accept the risks.  

I have two XBOXONEX devices attached by wire to a single satellite, with the Router running UPnP (also have many other UPnP enabled gaming consoles that are older.  (The older ones have challenges because many allow the developers of games to require additional ports and many use less robust methods to connect even when using UPnP).  I attached them to a single satellite because it is easy to do for me, as they are in the same room (other devices are not and are wireless).  This lets both talk to each other over wired switch and the wireless backbone when going out to the Internet.  Since the Oribi's backhaul performs better than the XBOXONEX built-in wireless this eliminated lag deaths on our coop Diable 3 rifts. 

I've been running this way for months, and only one time out of almost nightly play did I have less than NAT: Open on one device.   That NAT: moderate was fixed by going into the affected XBOXONEX and telling it to use an alternate NAT port (this seems to be a new feature as I have not seen it in the interface in the past.  You can see the UPnP in use in the Orbi's web management interface.  Note that with XBOXONEX I have noted it appears the UPnP registration may not happen on return from some low power saving modes (I saw the same with older devices).  So, make sure you understand the UPnP registration lifetime and how often the devices you use refresh themselves.  When changing a device's UPnP settings, if it does not fix the issue, restart that device fully (not quick restart) to make sure it has a chance to register.

[GadgetVirtuoso2]

UPnP should not be required for LAN services to work correctly. In fact, without UPNP I have had no issues with Xbox Live. I will try the alternate NAT port as you suggested, but I wouldn't expect that to matter since even both units use the same port it's on different IPs (or MAC address since it should just be L2 traffic).

[FURRYe38]

I have two xbox ones on my Orbi system, both reserved IP addreses ON the router, upnp enabled and NAT FIlter set to OPEN. 

OPEN NAT no both console dash boards and in game when playing same game. Works well for me. 

http://badmodems.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=21

[DavidUnboxed]

You are correct that UPnP would not come into play for a strictly LAN communication feature.  However, I am not convinced (without a code review, and I no longer have access to MSFT source code since I don't work there anymore) that any LAN feature does also depend upon XBOX live features if not just to enable sharing or some other integration...  If you think it is a LAN only issue, I would check to make sure guest isolation is not impacting the wireless client.  If that bears no fruit, you may need to check the network connectivity for the wireless XBOX from a PC attached to see if it can communicate using PING and perhaps the XBOX App for Windows 10.  Or substitute a PC with a static address on each end and run a more thorough test with network capture.  

So far, I've not seen a single 1:many NAT and port forwarding implementation that could simultaneously forward the same external ports from the same range of remote hosts to multiple internal addresses.  There may be some in the commercial device space intended to spread the load between incoming servers (if so, probably F5 devices, etc.) but that would certainly impact communication where devices expect 1 to 1 communication.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_address_translation.  Now, if you knew the exact XBOX Live server IP address each XBOX would talk to in advance, some NAT routers could set up a Port Forwarding rule separate for each.  But, due to high availability design for XBOX live, it's not possible to predict the exact one that will be used in advance and thus UPnP is needed to ensure each can traverse the NAT, hit any of a group of XBOX servers, and where features require, get a response back through the NAT to correct LAN address.  Perhaps XBOX live is working but in a limited manner such as Strict NAT?  https://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/networking/network-settings.  This is not the same as Open NAT and if the LAN feature does invoke any such calls to the XBOX live network they could be impeded.

[FURRYe38]

PF isn't needed for two or more game consoles. Just uPnP and set NAT Filter to OPEN. I set up IP address reservations for my consoles. 

[DavidUnboxed]

Of course, not, PF is not needed if UPnP is used, no even for one console.  PF is needed when UPnP is not used if you want the Open NAT type.  This is true with or without IP address reservations.

[FURRYe38]

OPEN NAT will be achiveved with uPnP and NAT FIlter for two or more consoles. Theres no need for any PF.

SIngle console, NAT filter can be left Secure with uPnP. 

However all of this shouldn't effect network transfers between two consoles on the same LAN side network 

[GadgetVirtuoso2 · Accepted solution]

I was able to resolve the issue by toggling the Network Transfer off and on both XBoxes. UPnP is turned off; this feature is only needed if you want the router to open ports to internal devices from the outside automatically and is not needed for any online gaming. It is still recommended by nearly all security professionals to turn off UPnP because of the security risks it presents.

Orbi like all consumer routers do not have a whitelist firewall, so it is not necessary to setup port forwarding or have UPnP enabled for these online services to work correctly. The default configuration is to pass all outbound traffic. You would have to actively block the XBox ports if you wanted to prevent this access.