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XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E MGig AP

kevinfor2014
Guide

XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E MGig AP

 We own 3 Netgear MGig switches XS724EM / M4200-10MG-POE+ and MS510TXPP with any of these Switches if we attempt to plug in a Cisco Meraki MR53E AP (Supports MGig 2.5) the switch will show a 2.5G 'up" but it can't connect to the Network...  Meraki has suggested we manually force the switches to 1Gbps while they research the issue  (if we plug the MR53E into a 1G on the MS510TXPP it works with no issues - if we set one of the 2.5/5G ports to 1G it won't connect)

 

for the XS724EM - under "system management" "port status" select a port... under "Speed" the only settings are Auto, Disable or 100M Full - is there any way to manually force 1G on ports?

 

for the M4200-10MG-POE+ under "switching" "ports" "port configuration" under "speed" - no options if we just typing "1000" does that set the port to 1G?    Any ideas?

Message 1 of 9

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schumaku
Guru

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Again for the records: There is nothing that stops the switch vendors from implementing a switch port from limiting the announced speed capabilities. Still, there must be autonegotiation handshake taking place - this is IEEE 802.3 mandatory for Gb and up. The IEEE person won't change this for Meraki. Configuring a MultiGig port to GbE (or only 2.5G or only 5G or only 10 G for the sake of it) is not similar to setting a MultiGig or Gb port to a fixed 100 or 10 Mb rate.

 

As the messenger here I understand you look for a solution - however it should be up to Meraki to properly work with standards compliant MultiGig ports on their AP product in question. Netgear does look into changing the specs and updating the switch firmware - but I doubt there is a high priority. That's the problem with vendors like Meraki (ref. MultiGig negotiation) or Ubiquity (ref. non-standard PoE, another pain) coming from a "closed" world.

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Message 9 of 9

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ElaineP
NETGEAR Expert

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Hi kevinfor2014

 

Welcome to Netgear Community!

 

For the XS724EM,speed contain Auto/Disable/100M, cannot force 1G speed. Switch will auto negotiate speed for 1000M/2.5G.

1G.png

 

If connect M4200-10MG-POE+(2.5G port) to XS724EM, the speed will link up with 2.5G.

If connect M4200-10MG-POE+(5G port) to XS724EM, the speed will link up with 5G.

 

Regards,

NETGEAR Employee.

Message 2 of 9
schumaku
Guru

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

The thing is that the IEEE standards does not allow to set a fixed speed - certainly on 1G, and most likely on the higher rates of 2.5G/5G/10G/ff, too. Even if "fixing" a port to 1G (ie. on a XS748T/XS728T), there is an auto negotiation mandatory - it's just that the port does only announce the 1G capability, and nothing else.

Indeed, Netgear has a little inconsistency in the UI controls over various switch model lines, I've just dropped an email to the product managers. Some other models indeed don't have a UI (or CLI) control to "fix" a GbE port to 1G.

Message 3 of 9
shuennh
Aspirant

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Hi Kevin,

1. Can you go into M4200 web page, 'Maintenance->Export' page, and export the tech-support file and posted it on the community? 

2. What is the cable type used to connect from M4200 to MR53? Cat6? Straight? And length?

Message 4 of 9
kevinfor2014
Guide

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Here is the Tech File from the M4200 - as you can see we manually set Speed to "1000"  but it shows a 2.5 connection UP - shouldn't changing the "speed" cause this specific  port to act like a 1G port on the switch (or to any device plugged into that port)

 

the cable is 6FT Cat 6A (We have tested multiple cables)  - does the M4200 technically support "N-Base-T" (Cisco Pre-standard) "MGig" (was this a competing "pre-standard" to N-Base-T) or  IEEE 802.11bz and does Netgear has it's extension of the standard called "5 speed port"  - is there a way to capture all traffic on port-5 from the point of the Meraki device being plugged into the switch  so I can see what is happening on the wire  (possible mirror port 5 to say port 7 - that has a laptop running wireshark) or suggest another method..   

 

I couldn't attach a txt file.. (group only accepts jpg, png or pdf & can't paste over 20,000 character limit.. so finally converted to PDF to attach to this message (might have spacing issues - message me if another way to post it.)

Message 5 of 9
schumaku
Guru

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M


@kevinfor2014wrote:

Here is the Tech File from the M4200 - as you can see we manually set Speed to "1000"  but it shows a 2.5 connection UP - shouldn't changing the "speed" cause this specific  port to act like a 1G port on the switch (or to any device plugged into that port)

 


Don't be misguided by the classic speed setting experience we had in networking up to 100BASE-T - there is fixing speed possible. Starting from 1000BASE-T, auto negotiation for speed and duplex is mandatory. That's the logic implemented on ie. the XS724EM and most Smart Managed Pro switches - either the ability to select 100M or auto. 

 

Can only speak for the MS510TX extensively compatibility tested on the MultiGig ports where any slower speeds can be set, ie. on a 10 Gb port to 5/2.5/1/100M - except of the 100M, the config does change the maximum speed announced with the auto negotiation. And this worked during early deployment tests and still works accordingly with various MultiGig equipment I had at hand back then.  

Netgear promised to review and harmonize the behaviour and the Web UI in a customer friendly way. Adding the 1G Full Duplex setting to the current XS and MX switch models is intended (following NX-OX btw.), too. Of course, such a change does take time, and is unlikely done in a rush.  

Message 6 of 9
shuennh
Aspirant

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Hi Kevin,

You should not need to configure any particular speed on MR53 or M4200 (or other switch), our switch support MGBaseT that it should automatically negotiated with highest speed between the switch and AP. However, looks like the firmware used in your M4200 is not the latest, can you update to the newest 12.0.2.20 that is available from our web site: https://www.netgear.com/support/product/M4200-10MG-PoE-Plus#download

? After the upgrade, please make sure both MR53 and switch does not have fixed speed configued on the port. 

Message 7 of 9
kevinfor2014
Guide

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Just to recap - This is a Confirmed bug with how the Cisco Meraki MR53E AP handles MGig..(it doesn't work unless plugged into a 1G port)

 

 I've upgraded the M4200 to the lastest firmware.. what I need is to "Force" Netgear to "1G" on a specific MGig port..  I also need to capture all the traffic on the M4200 from this specific port from the time the AP is physically plugged in (before it gets an IP) to look at the traffic (I assume Mirroring port#1 to port#2 with a PC running Wireshark - if you have specific instructions/suggestions - that would be helpful

 

 

Meraki is saying I need to "Force" the port to 1G on the Netgear switch - others are saying this isn't allowed per IEEE 802.3bz standard.. I've contacted the IEEE Chairperson of one of the 802.3 Working groups (who happens to work at Cisco) that is asking me to quote "chapter & verse" where it isn't allowed for a switch vendor to manually set speeds on MGig ports and Netgear should offer a firmware update to allow this.. and their MGig device will work at 1G..  (the AP works at 1G if plugged into a 1G switch)Then in "3-6 months" they will upgrade the AP Firmware to allow 2.5G MGig..  I'm pushing this gets fixed "in a few days" as a Sev1/Pri-1 bug...  any help you can offer would be appreciated.. 

Message 8 of 9
schumaku
Guru

Re: XS724EM/M4200-10MG-POE+ & MS510TXPP - Can't Force 1GB on MGig Ports for incompatible MR53E M

Again for the records: There is nothing that stops the switch vendors from implementing a switch port from limiting the announced speed capabilities. Still, there must be autonegotiation handshake taking place - this is IEEE 802.3 mandatory for Gb and up. The IEEE person won't change this for Meraki. Configuring a MultiGig port to GbE (or only 2.5G or only 5G or only 10 G for the sake of it) is not similar to setting a MultiGig or Gb port to a fixed 100 or 10 Mb rate.

 

As the messenger here I understand you look for a solution - however it should be up to Meraki to properly work with standards compliant MultiGig ports on their AP product in question. Netgear does look into changing the specs and updating the switch firmware - but I doubt there is a high priority. That's the problem with vendors like Meraki (ref. MultiGig negotiation) or Ubiquity (ref. non-standard PoE, another pain) coming from a "closed" world.

Message 9 of 9
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