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Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

DH27
Tutor

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@muniz_ri 

 

Unfortunately not, however I don't think it is a problem of IP renewal as my hypothesis that I am experiencing reboots everyday at 11 p.m. turned out to be wrong. Neither on Sunday nor yesterday have I experienced a reboot, even though I didn't change my configuration at all. 

 

@FURRYe38 

 

I am going to wait around a couple of days to see if I still get random reboots, if that's the case, I will try out the beta FW

Message 276 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Ok.


@DH27 wrote:

 

I am going to wait around a couple of days to see if I still get random reboots, if that's the case, I will try out the beta FW


 


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 277 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

No luck with the beta fw...even after I performed a reset and set up the router from scratch.

 

I have just about given up on this router but for what will likely be my last experiement, I pulled out my old LinksysEA7500 which, although the wifi range isn't as strong, is rock solid stable.

 

I re-connected the Linksys to my modem and turned off it's wifi radios. I connected the RAX120 via ethernet cable to the Linksys router and set the RAX120 into AP mode. I suspect the RAX120 was having difficulties when the isp lease renewed and just curious to see what happens while in AP mode.

Message 278 of 675
_NDS_
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

UPDATE: After a month (!) without a single reboot my RAX120 V2 rebooted itself two days ago and now is back to roughly one-two random reboots a day. This is with the European power adapter ADS-65MIA-19. Interestingly, it even reboots overnight where there is no WiFi or wired Internet traffic, if the fan is left in the default operational state. I have observed how the thing rebooted itself at 6AM in the morning when I just woke up! It was quite warm to touch.

 

This makes me think that the root cause of reboots is external to the router and its either this constant trouble with this strange DDoS attacks that keep appearing in the log or the power fluctuations still. It is definitely not the temperature of air in the room. The router was steady during the UK heatwave when temperatures were nearing 27 deg C inside the house. Putting the fan permanently on right now prevents the frequent rebooting, but I am not holding my breath, given everyone else's experience.

 

Has someone tried to disconnect the internet modem and see if their unit reboots without internet connection?

Message 279 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@_NDS_ 

 

That's interesting but along the lines of a theory that I am exploring. I noticed that the reboots, for me, seemed to often coincide with the router's ip address lease expiration. So I wonder if the router may have issues with how it handles the lease expiration when connected to certain modems.

 

Also,  I reinstalled my old Linksys router as my main router and connected the RAX120 to it in AP mode. I then set the lease expiration time in the Linksys router to 10 mins and checked the RAX120 logs an hour later. Every 10 mins the logs showed that the RAX120 disconnected from the internet then reconnected a few seconds later, but I didn't actually lose internet connection.

 

I then set a static IP (outside of the DHCP range) for the RAX120 and the disconnects and reconnects stopped appearing in the log. The RAX120 appeared rock solid thereafter with no issues so far (albeit it has only been one day).

 

I don't know enough to form any conclusions, yet. But I have an old TP Link modem that I may install and reinstall the RAX120 in router mode to test.

Message 280 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

What is the Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?
Be sure your using a good quality LAN cable between the modem and router. CAT6 is recommended. 

What all devices do you have connected to the router? 

 

What channels are you using? Auto? Try Auto and 48 on 5Ghz. Or try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and 40 to 48 channel on 5Ghz.
Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?


@muniz_ri wrote:

No luck with the beta fw...even after I performed a reset and set up the router from scratch.

 

I have just about given up on this router but for what will likely be my last experiement, I pulled out my old LinksysEA7500 which, although the wifi range isn't as strong, is rock solid stable.

 

I re-connected the Linksys to my modem and turned off it's wifi radios. I connected the RAX120 via ethernet cable to the Linksys router and set the RAX120 into AP mode. I suspect the RAX120 was having difficulties when the isp lease renewed and just curious to see what happens while in AP mode.


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 281 of 675
Topology
Luminary

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@_NDS_, are you running NETGEAR Armor on your RAX120v2? It might help with the DoS/DDosS issue and, maybe, thereby help with the reboot problem….

Message 282 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

***Update***

My RAX120 continues to run with no issues using my current setup, i.e. as a client in AP mode to my LinksysEA7500 router with a static ip assigned to the RAX120. The RAX120 log is completely clean with no issues so far.

 

It seems the LinksysEA7500 has no problem renewing the DHCP lease from my ISP (Cox) whereas the RAX120 does which leads me to believe that their is a bug in the RAX120 fw. For reference...I am using a Motorola MB8611 modem.

 

I will update again if I experience any more reboots and if not I will report that also in about 1 month. 

 

 

Message 283 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@muniz_ri Would you be willing to return the RAX back to router mode with your ISP modem and enabled debug logging long enough to see this reboot happen and then capture the debug logs? 


@muniz_ri wrote:

***Update***

My RAX120 continues to run with no issues using my current setup, i.e. as a client in AP mode to my LinksysEA7500 router with a static ip assigned to the RAX120. The RAX120 log is completely clean with no issues so far.

 

It seems the LinksysEA7500 has no problem renewing the DHCP lease from my ISP (Cox) whereas the RAX120 does which leads me to believe that their is a bug in the RAX120 fw. For reference...I am using a Motorola MB8611 modem.

 

I will update again if I experience any more reboots and if not I will report that also in about 1 month. 

 

 


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 284 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@FURRYe38 

 

Yes, I will do that this weekend. I had not thought about doing that but now that you mention it, I am also curious to see those results.

Message 285 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Thank you. I guess also enable WAN/LAN debug as well. Lets give them all they can get. 

Thank you for your time. 


@muniz_ri wrote:

@FURRYe38 

 

Yes, I will do that this weekend. I had not thought about doing that but now that you mention it, I am also curious to see those results.


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 286 of 675
_NDS_
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@beachmiles 

I found this post of yours dated April 1st 2022 where you said that a pure sine UPS has solved the problem with random reboots

 

UPS devices with PFC/APC / Line-Interactive should correct any power fluctuations on the fly without going to the battery but if you have a crummy power source in a large condo building like mine that UPS will need to switch to DC a couple times a day. How gracefully this power correction or switch to DC happens varies by APC UPS model number seems to matter quite a bit to this particular router.

https://blog.tripplite.com/line-interactive-vs-on-line-ups-systems

 

This is the PFC/APC UPS device I previously was using which I thought was a pure sine wave but in fact was a modified sine wave which was causing my RAX120v2 to randomly rebooted 8 times a day if I left 2.4GHZ WMM Enabled. With 2.4GHZ WMM Disabled the router was much more stable but I think it still rebooted like once a week?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06VY12HW4

 

This PFC/APC UPS I switched to is pure sine wave and let my router run 20+ days in a row with the 2.4GHZ WMM Enabled. I had a cable internet issue at one point where Spectrum internet was down in LA one day so I did a manual router reset and the system has stayed strong again with no random reboots so it sure seems like this was the root problem for my router.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00429N19M

 

Could you please let us know if you still have your RAX120 and the problem with random reboots is gone for good?

 

Message 287 of 675
beachmiles
Star

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Unfortunately the random rebooting problem returned after like 20 days of uptime with like one every other day for a week and then I will get 10 days good, etc. Very strange. I re-disabled the WMM for the 2.4Ghz and get roughly the same reboot schedule.

So its extremely hard to troubleshoot. I tried the beta firmware a week ago and I still am getting about the same amount of random reboots.

 

I even added a beefy fan underneath the router as some people claim that helped remove the reboots but that also did not help with the random reboots for me.

Message 288 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Would you be willing to return the RAX back to router mode with your ISP modem and enabled debug logging long enough to see this reboot happen and then capture the debug logs? 


@beachmiles wrote:

Unfortunately the random rebooting problem returned after like 20 days of uptime with like one every other day for a week and then I will get 10 days good, etc. Very strange. I re-disabled the WMM for the 2.4Ghz and get roughly the same reboot schedule.

So its extremely hard to troubleshoot. I tried the beta firmware a week ago and I still am getting about the same amount of random reboots.

 

I even added a beefy fan underneath the router as some people claim that helped remove the reboots but that also did not help with the random reboots for me.


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 289 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@FURRYe38 

 

I just pm'd you my debug log. The reboot occurred at about 9:30am PST this morning. Please let us know what NG has to say once they review. Thank you!

Message 290 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Thank you for the logs. Passed them on. I'll keep on it.


@muniz_ri wrote:

I just pm'd you my debug log. The reboot occurred at about 9:30am PST this morning. Please let us know what NG has to say once they review. Thank you!


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 291 of 675
_NDS_
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

I do not want this thread and the issue to go away.

@FURRYe38  what was the outcome of the investigation of the @muniz_ri logs by NG? Please update us.

 

So far in this community it was established that:

  1. changing power adapter stops the RAX120V2 from rebooting for prolonged periods of time - 30 days in my case, 18 days with @beachmiles, but then reboots come back
  2. changing the router default IP address seems to help by extending the interval between reboots. Is it true @muniz_ri?
  3. cooling the router by permanently enabling the Thermal Fan through debug settings and adding external cooling extends the interval between reboots
  4. disabling 2.4GhHz WiFi WMM extends the intervals between reboots
  5. The beta fiirmware provided by NG via @DarrenM  does not seem to help. Do we know how many different versions there are?

In July 2021 @mariosuper47 posted the following in the RAX120V2 random reboots thread of the time (now closed):

The RAX200 worked OK for the first few weeks with random reboots.   I tried many troubleshooting steps and then I ran out of my return windows.   Random reboots got worse!  Basically the router failed! Contacted Netgear which was absolutely no help.

My experience with RAX200 was remarkably similar to the initial poster on this thread. I tried everything and finally gave up and bought a new ASUS router.   I configured the ASUS and everything worked as represented.  I put the RAX200 in a box hoping for miracles, but not expecting one. 2 months later I viewed a video where some guy took apart his Netgear router and fixed some kind of random issue.   I did learn how Netgear puts devices together and how to take them apart.   So I decided to take a day and see what the RAX200 looked like inside since it had no value to me as it was.

I do not RECOMMEND anyone try this but I thought that I would SHARE my discovery!

I discovered that the Power Adapter plug that powered the router seemed outsized and that it did not seem to fully insert into the socket on the router mother board .  I also found the socket on the router mother board was not properly soldered and secured to the mother board (ie.  it moved around - up and down).   I could not fix the solder joints but I had the idea to put a non-conductive spacer between the MB and the socket module preventing it from moving up and down.  It took me several hours to get this done and get everything back together because I am very much an amateur.  Aftert this bit of "jury rigging", I found that the power plug would fully insert into the socket which wasn't possible before.

I decided to try the RAX200 in its former place of honor which had been taken over by an ASUS.    Wow!   It worked perfectly.   The power adapter plug fit fully into the socket and it have been running for 2 months without a reboot.  I have multi-gig internet and numerous peripherals that now work perfectly.   I realize that my amatuer fix may fail at some point but I feel quite satisfied that I have gotten something out of my $500 investment and that I can once again experience network excellence.

It seems to me that quality control at Netgear has not been up to its, heretofore, high standards.   Perhaps, my story of disappointment and discovery can lead to a return to quality control that has made Netgear's reputation what it is.

 

@mariosuper47, could you please confirm that you described a problem with RAX200 and not RAX120? RAX200 does not appear to have the random reboot issue.

 

In Sep 2021 @mkhanshaw  posted the following:

Alright - With the help of these posts and my experience - I think I see the problem (literally see it).

So my rebooting started happening whenever additional load (anything over nominal compute) was happening...aka streaming (Video calls, Netflix vs Roku, etc). The additional load was creating heat. That, combined with a loosely mounted power port for the ac adapter appears to be the cause of the reboot. The loose power port also prevents you from firmly inserting the male connector...and I could FEEL the heat around this area on mine.

...

Although I did not take the time to disassemble my Router in an attempt to fix with a soldering iron (because my intent was just to return to amazon and be done), I DID relocate the router to a cold tile floor, add fan to conduct heat away from it...and what do you know....kept connection.

 

I concur that the power connector on my RAX120 is loose and does not appear to fully go in to the power socket. I imagine that when the router gets hot the connectivity may get lost just purely due to loss of electrical contact due to expansion of loose parts with heat.

 

@FURRYe38has NG ever investigated the loose power socket issue? I can literally cause the router to reboot if I shake the cable from the power adapter.

 

Message 292 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@_NDS_ 

 

Changing the default IP address helped to eliminate the DoS entries in the log but did not help with the reboots.

 

But what has helped as has the potential to be a workaround is running the RAX120 in AP mode plugged into my old Linksys router. I have had this setup all weekend with no reboots so far.

 

Message 293 of 675
Topology
Luminary

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Perhaps the experience of @JFZoidberg on the use of the model AD2003F10 power adapter (see this thread) will be an encouraging solution to the RAX120v2 router reboot problem?  Time will tell....

Message 294 of 675
_NDS_
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Hi @Topology

 

After @DH27 posted his experience with RAX120V2 rebooting even when powered through the ADS-65MIA-19 I am not holding my breath!

 

After these two months I support the hypothesis that heat is causing the substandard power connector to lose contact eventually.

Otherwise I can't explain how changing the power adapter in my case removed the problem for 30 days, but not rectified it.

 

The heat may come from new (vs V1) Qualcomm chip and could be caused by different reasons - like excessive 2.4GHz traffic with WMM enabled, prevention of DDoS attacks that the router logs all the time, lots of 2.4Ghz clients, poor positioning etc. There is no common pattern of what people have been reporting otherwise.

 

The silence from NG on this topic, however, is puzzling. The problem has been reported since V2 release in Dec 2020 and we do not know if they were even able to reproduce the issue! Someone in the NG engineering division should step up to this challenge and find the root cause.

 

I have retired my RAX120V2 to its box for now, but may consider using it as an AP for my garden if the issue is not resolved. 😉

 

 

 

Message 295 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

**Update**

I noticed that the fan was not running this morning. I checked the log and confirmed that the router rebooted overnight. There goes my hope for AP mode as a workaround.

Message 296 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Had you enabled the Thermal Fan under the debug page?


@muniz_ri wrote:

**Update**

I noticed that the fan was not running this morning. I checked the log and confirmed that the router rebooted overnight. There goes my hope for AP mode as a workaround.


 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 297 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@FURRYe38 

 

Correct

 

Message 298 of 675
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

Ok so tells me that the fan was working but the router rebooted. The thermal fan check box doesn't persist thru a reboot so it will default to disable during a reboot. 

 

I'll put this in as well. 

Was WMM disabled on the 2.4Ghz radio? 

Was this with the beta FW installed as well? 

My Setup ISP SparkLight | Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Modem Mode |  Wifi Router MK83+ (Router Mode) | and RBK853 (Router Mode) | Switches NG GS105/8, GS308v3, GS110MX and XS505M | Additional NG HW: C7800/CAX80/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi: CBK40, CBK752, RBK50, RBK853, RBK752, RBK953, SXK30 | NightHawk: MK63, MR6150, R7000, R7800, R7960P, R8000, R8500, R9000, RAXE500, RAX50, XR450, XR1000, EX7500/EX7700

Message 299 of 675
muniz_ri
Apprentice

Re: RAX120 V2 Constant Random Reboots

@FURRYe38 

 

WMM was enabled and yes, I am still on the BETA fw. 

Message 300 of 675
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