Re: Intermittent DNS Errors and WiFi Issues

SeaRefractor · ‎2021-05-06

So it's still Circle? And Circle has not come to the AX series of Orbi's yet? Wow, just wow.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-06

@energie wrote:
I am now using my old Asus N66U router (with custom firmware) as router and the Orbi AX as access point. Up until now I am not seeing any DNS errors (which is to be expected). But I did gain a lot more fine grained options in return. I am not sure how (and if) this set-up will impact the overall performance of my network. The wired devices are still connected to the primary Orbi AX router (= now access point).

Mine got better, with the caveat that my servic is only 100mpbs, so wan - lan throughput isn't an issue where most of any bottlenecking would occur depending on the processor/memory of the router (I am using an RT-AC86U).

Where mine significantly improved was in bufferbloat using Asus' QOS settings. Orbi, with it's dumbed down WMM could not control enough of the bufferbloat that was occuring. Using the Asus as router, I set the QOS priority along with a download limit of 120 (go figure), and upload limit of 5.4 (my 'rated' upload limit is 5), and I went from a C/D for bufferbloat to A/A+. My wife no longer has stuttering problems with the Zoom meetings for work.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-06

@energie wrote:
Yeah, I guess it could have something to do with Armor or its implementation. In any case, the only thing we really do know is that the DNS resolving mechanism on the Orbi AX is defective. My best guess on this is that Netgear doesn't want to put resources/butget in to fixing the firmware anymore. The only focus seems to be easy to resolve security updates or indeed things like Armor. Which provide an additional income for Netgear. It is frustrating. But this has been the case since last year for this product and I don't think this will change.

And even it will change. What does it say about Netgear taking 1 year to resolve a problem like this.I think this is simply the business model. It happened to me years ago aswell with a Netgear router I had back then. I said never again Netgear. And guess what. Nothing changed.

I still PERSONALLY think the underlying issue is that they mucked up dnsmasque and THAT is what they're using to mine for IP data (versus only mining for data through paying customers with Armor). Fixing dnsmasque s/b fairly straightforward, yet they can't do it. They diabled telnet because some were going in and fixing/altering dnsmasque themselves.

They can't figure out how to fix dnsmasque and still have it snatch the data from all the users.

No, I do not also believe there is a sub species of aliens disguised as humans that will one day rise and take over civilization.

FURRYe38 · ‎2021-05-06

I believe no. I think the core feature is NGs code but NG uses the Cicle app as the interface and configuration for it.

NG said in the next few months from what one of the forum moderators said. If I remember it took NG same time frame to get Circle on there Orbi AC systems. May have been there CBR40 that took a bit to get going. Not the first time.

@SeaRefractor wrote:
So it's still Circle? And Circle has not come to the AX series of Orbi's yet? Wow, just wow.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-06

Asus Router / Orbi AP (or just use Asus) = FREE parental controls (and free IP protection).

Dicslaimer - I do NOT work or know anyone/is related to anyone working for Asus. I just REALLY like Asus after experiencing what Orbi can (and mostly can't) do.

FURRYe38 · ‎2021-05-06

I wish I could agree with you on ASUS. There at least have some problems on FW. Though they at least have Merlin to help with 3rd party FW. There support is at least if not even worse than NGs. My friend who has a GT-AX1100 router as I do, is on his 4th unit in only a few months. We both notice that when we contact ASUS support regarding a problem, we are handed off by several different support reps just for one support ticket. My one ticket agains the GT router still hasn't been addressed fully and have not heard back from then in almost 3 months. I do like there HW and mostly there FW is ok. Merlins makes corrections where he can for the models he supports. He just picked up the GT router as well. ASUS is not that stellar though IMO.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-06

@FURRYe38 wrote:
I wish I could agree with you on ASUS. There at least have some problems on FW. Though they at least have Merlin to help with 3rd party FW. There support is at least if not even worse than NGs. My friend who has a GT-AX1100 router as I do, is on his 4th unit in only a few months. We both notice that when we contact ASUS support regarding a problem, we are handed off by several different support reps just for one support ticket. My one ticket agains the GT router still hasn't been addressed fully and have not heard back from then in almost 3 months. I do like there HW and mostly there FW is ok. Merlins makes corrections where he can for the models he supports. He just picked up the GT router as well. ASUS is not that stellar though IMO.

You can disagree with me based on you and your friend's experience, and I can disagree based on my personal experience with Asus. What cannot be disputed is that this has been an ongoing problem for the Orbi line that NG has not been able to resolve (or chooses not to). And I can personally tell you that I have not have had any DNS problems with my Asus as router and Orbi as AP, and others have had the same positive results with other router brands using Orbi as an AP.

I can also tell you that Orbi's QOS ability s*cks compared to Orbi (the main reason I switched back to routing with the Asus), and can provide data to show it. I can also state with certainty that Asus routers include features for free that Netgear charges for.

I can also state that the reason I switched from an AC Orbi to AX Orbi was paritally because of speed problems I was seeing with the AC that I THOUGHT was a localization problem, only to find out later that the REAL problem is that Orbi's FIRMWARE is faulty and falls back to 2.4ghz backhaul even when there is sufficient 5ghz signal.

I do not claim Asus to be any kind of Godsend (although with Merlin it's pretty close), and perusal of my other posts will show that I clearly state that EVERY brand has issues/problems of some kind, and even firmware problems at times.

FURRYe38 · ‎2021-05-06

Well all I can say is that for those of you who are effect by this issue, users and NG need to make contact and keep on them about it. Nothing we can do here in the forums to help you out aside from whats already been discussed and alternative solutions mentioned.

Merlin is one reason why sometimes I'll use ASUS. Otherwise, there limited use for me. Seen other ASUS users in there forums with similar problems that seem to plague this industry. Its a shame it's like this. Seems to be more focused on the money and "fabrique en chine" than quality

Good Luck.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

I'm so glad it looks like a ton of other people are having this issue. Guess I need to dig through these 22 pages and hopefully find a solution.

Edit: Sounds like this issue will never get resolved and I am better off returning the ORBI and getting a different brand of Mesh network.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-14

@RockGuitarist1 wrote:
I'm so glad it looks like a ton of other people are having this issue. Guess I need to dig through these 22 pages and hopefully find a solution.

Edit: Sounds like this issue will never get resolved and I am better off returning the ORBI and getting a different brand of Mesh network.

The only resolution right now (and likely forever) is to use another router with Orbi as AP. If you're in the return window, return it and get something else.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

Any recommendations? I am still within the return window. I need something a little stronger than a single Nighthawk router.

energie · ‎2021-05-14

Indeed, as access points the Orbi AX, at least for me, performs very good (best wifi I experienced up to date). However you need another router - not Netgear - as router - in front of the Orbi AX.

Orbi AX as router = no go / return it / use it as paper weight - the DNS issue is simply annoying.
Orbi AX as access point w/ another router = good.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

Any suggestions on mesh networks that aren't plagued with issues? I'm returning the RBR750 as we speak.

energie · ‎2021-05-14

I have also the Asus XT8. Bought it after becoming to frustrated with the DNS issue that the Orbi AX has.The XT8 is faster, has way more configuration options. However, the wifi signal is less and the XT8 also doesn't manage devices moving between satellites well. I had instances that devices would connect to the 2,4 Ghz band for example, and because the 2,4 Ghz range is greater would stick to the particular satellite, instead of it connecting to the much faster 5 Ghz band. So overall this caused the wifi experience - speed - to be much lower. Later on I experienced random connectivity issues. Asus with their AI Mesh is not up to par with the wifi experience you with Netgear.

So I opted once again to reinstate my Orbi AX, this time as access point, and use an old Asus N66U router as the main router. Best of both worlds.

If it is within your price range you could check out the Orbi AX pro. They fixed the DNS issue over a year ago for this device. However, I can imagine you also being frustrated with this issue and not wanting anything to do anymore with Netgear.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

Sheesh. Is there really no Netgear mesh network out there on WiFi 6 that is working and not $700+?

energie · ‎2021-05-14

No, there isn't. And yes the prices are ridiculous. Which makes it even more ridiculous that Netgear doesn't fix the issue for the Orbi AX. You need to check what your total cost would be with the RBK752 + additional router (you might be able to use the one from your ISP - just disable the wifi) versus the Orbi AX pro.

Just understand and acknowledge that Netgear really doesn't care when making this decision. This statement has been made before by others well over a year ago, based upon the same findings/conclusion. It is what it is.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

I have the RBR750 and an old Nighthawk laying around that this Orbi was supposed to replace. Should I just run the Orbi in AP mode even though I am still on my return window or should I return it and buy something worse?

energie · ‎2021-05-14

If you are within the return window you can try some other brand. I unfortunately was way paste my return window. Just know that the Orbi AX as access point work pretty good - that I can recommend - if you can ignore Netgear just don't giving a **** about its customers. I am unable to recommend something better. I thought the Asus XT8 would be, but that was overall just a disappointment.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-14

I run my Orbi as AP after my old Asus RT-AC68U, and it works great for me, but my incoming is only 100mbps. I don't know what the WAN to LAN throughput is on the 68U, so I don't know how it would work if you have gig service.

I can also say that the controls and QOS with the Asus is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY better than the Orbi (the reason why I switched to AP. The Orbi UI is REEEEEEAAAAAAAALLY dumbed down compared to Asus.

In addition, AiProtection (equivalent to NG Armor) is free for life with Asus, and if you need parental controls, that's free with Asus as well.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

Sounds like no matter what I choose it will never be nearly as good as just running the Orbi alone.

energie · ‎2021-05-14

Well, using a single Asus router - as router - and the Orbi AX as access point actually gives you way more options. The Orbi AX is really limited in terms of configuration and options. The Asus is king in that department, it just fails in mesh networking. Just just need to make sure that the router is capable in handling good speeds over the lan ports (wan-lan throughput). But this would be the same case for the Orbi AX.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-14

No - Orbi alone is the s*ckiest solution. If you're going to keep the Orbi, only use it as an AP. For routing, I don't thinks I've used anything worse. As an AP to a more capable router, it works great, as it's better than most for wifi capability.

I personally recommend an Asus router, because it has a great combo of routing ability, controls, features, coupled with a great UI.

When I move on (probably in a couple years), I'm going back to Asus. Either whatever their mesh system is at that point, or AiMesh, which is actually VERY good as well, but I got suckered in to trying Orbi.

I'm personally never going with Netgear in the future.

@RockGuitarist1 wrote:
Sounds like no matter what I choose it will never be nearly as good as just running the Orbi alone.

RockGuitarist1 · ‎2021-05-14

I'm not sure what to do at this point. Using it as an AP just makes it a very expensive AP. I'd much rather just have a working mesh network instead of having a more advanced configuration.

energie · ‎2021-05-14

Yeah, that is exactly what the Orbi AX is. A very expensive AP. I personally would also stay away from Netgear if there would be a better solution. I feel it is very bad of Netgear to ignore its customers and this problem, which is pretty much affecting everyone. I just think the majority isn't aware. Meanwhile the support department is busy keeping customers busy by resetting their routers / or pointing the problem to something else - blaming the ISP router/modem is also a populair thing / and swapping (RMA) the device until the 90 day support window runs out. Meanwhile the main issue is with the Netgear firmware. For this reason alone I would skip Netgear and all of its products - and just blacklist this entire company.

So you can try out some other brand. Just know that as an AP the Orbi AX works pretty good.

tak1313 · ‎2021-05-14

If you're taking cost into consideration, go wifi 5 because there actually isn't much use for a wifi 6 system - yet, unless you have a lot of clients to connect.

https://dongknows.com/best-wi-fi-5-mesh-systems/

If you want wifi 6

https://dongknows.com/best-wi-fi-6-mesh-systems/

Ignore the Orbis on the list now you know the problems.

Another reason to possibly skip wifi 6 for now is that 6E is coming soon. But, again, there's actually not many client products that truly take advantage of ax yet.