Re: Readycloud Replacement....again.... ReadyNAS212

steveTu · ‎2023-08-17

I was another user who didn't receive any notification that the Readycloud facility was going.

I see advice on setting up a VPN using OpenVPN - but I don't see that app on my list of available apps. I do see VPNServer - but if I try to install that it fails (I receive an EMail).

All I want is a simple way of sharing some files/directories with remote users - how can I now do this?

StephenB · ‎2023-08-17

@steveTu wrote:

I see advice on setting up a VPN using OpenVPN - but I don't see that app on my list of available apps.

That's because it's installed on your router. Not all routers include the feature - Netgear Nighthawk and Orbi routers have it, as do many similarly priced routers from other manufacturers.

What router brand and model do you own?

@steveTu wrote:

All I want is a simple way of sharing some files/directories with remote users - how can I now do this?

OpenVPN isn't the best service for that. It gives the remote users full access to your home network.

The simplest way is to use a cloud service, and copy files and folders you want to share to that. Google Drive, OneDrive, iCloud, Dropbox, etc.

While I generally recommend using a VPN, it is also possible to set up a secure FTP service on the NAS, and forward the needed ports in your router to the NAS.

steveTu · ‎2023-08-17

@StephenB

I bought the ReadyNas so I didn't have to use the cloud to share!

I know this is not your fault, but it's so frustrating when companies treat software/firmware as something they can just 'remove'. It's part of what people buy, and potentially why they decide to buy a specific brand or model - a bit like a company coming along and removing your air conditioning from a car and telling you you can always open the windows or use a fan. No.

StephenB · ‎2023-08-18

@steveTu wrote:
but it's so frustrating when companies treat software/firmware as something they can just 'remove'.

Agreed.

Though it is pretty clear that Netgear has been quiet-quitting their storage business for some years now.

The newest ReadyNAS platforms were introduced in 2017
All current ReadyNAS platforms are identified as end-of-life on the Netgear support pages
Users are finding it impossible to get paid Netgear support

So dropping ReadyCloud is part of the overall process (though it also affects routers).

As I said above, you can set up secure FTP on the NAS, and then use something like FileZilla to access files remotely. You would need to forward some ports in the router to the NAS (and I'd recommend using non-standard ports for that). And set up NAS user account(s) for the sharing instead of ReadyCloud accounts.

It is also possible to share folders/shares using https - accessing them in the browser. However, that can also be used to access the admin web ui, so that would only be protected by the admin password if you do that. So I don't recommend that approach.

ZeroTier can also be used - it is in some ways similar to OpenVPN, but you can set it up to limit remote access to just the NAS. But harder to deploy than secure FTP.

steveTu · ‎2023-08-18

@StephenB

Again, it's not your issue, but I'm not sure I like the 'but we're quitting that market' argument. If a company wants to leave a market - openly publish that fact and as soon as it's known. I don't think that this 'research all available products' bit works - maybe it worked when people shopped in shops and the shop expert would say '...I've heard that company will stop support of that in five years..' but people buy more online. The 'compare the market' type option is just becoming insane - as how do you know what questions to ask?

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to let me vent a little. I'll look at a secure FTP connection option.

Thanks Steve.

StephenB · ‎2023-08-18

@steveTu wrote:
Again, it's not your issue, but I'm not sure I like the 'but we're quitting that market' argument.

To be clear, I don't work for Netgear and don't represent them in any way.

Overall, there's been a long pattern of Netgear launching and then abandoning ReadyNAS services over many years. ReadyRemote, Photos, Photos II, Surveillance, Milestone Arcus, ...

ReadyCloud is just the latest (and last one) to fall. I tried it for a little while, but decided it wasn't something I could depend on. The service went down unexpectedly (sometimes for days) and speeds were inconsistent even when it was working. Also, I didn't think they were transparent enough on security. So I gave up on it.

steveTu · ‎2023-08-18

@StephenB

I think I knew from previous posts of mine that you weren't Netgear - but even if you were, it's not your problem per se eh? Corporates make these decisions. I think my frustration is in how software/firmware/tech is being used to attract customers without the thought of how that will; be supported in future. I have had 5 physical devices affected over the past few years by this. Smart Tv's OS is no longer supported, Smart Speaker's radio preset and connection feature dropped, Smart Radio's (two radios) no longer receive BBC streaming broadcasts and the latest Netgear NAS ReadyCloud stunt. All perfectly good kit that should last for years, stuffed by software/firmware/tech curtailments that totally affect their functionality.

But what can you do in this throw away society - just ditch the kit and buy something that suits again - until that has its own software/tech issues.

I'm no fan of the cloud either - as what happens when these services stop or become tooo expensive? Oh well, such is modern life.....

Sandshark · ‎2023-08-18

OwnCloud or NextCloud are good options for sharing content directly. There is no up-to-date version that can be installed directly on a ReadyNAS, but you could install it on an always-on PC and point to the NAS as external data.

While those require the extra step of getting a URL for your site (from NoIP, for example) that ReadyCloud didn't require, most similar solutions will also require that.

ZeroTier is another option, in that it gives access to just the device(s) on which it runs, not your whole network, and then you can use the ReadyNAS share permissions to control where on the NAS the users can access. See ZeroTier-as-a-ReadyCloud-replacement. Be sure to read the entire thread, as things have changes since it was started. If you try to do what it says in the first post, it'll fail.

steveTu · ‎2023-08-25

Thanks all for your help. I think I will just go the FTP route - although at the moment I'm having issues connecting to the proftp server provided (via external address) if I use my laptop and filezilla - it works fine from my phone and a couple of ftp based apps. That's not an issue for here though I don't think!

Thanks again.

JoVe34 · ‎2023-08-28

@steveTu Hello, steveTu, I completely agree with you because, like you, I am shocked (the word is weak!) to have never been openly informed of the situation of abandonment of "NAS" by Netgear: I canceled my iCloud subscriptions, after having invested, in April 2022, in a ReadyNAS424 system (4x10 TB in RAID5) because there was remote access (not local!) via ReadyCLOUD® and have just discovered with amazement few days ago (back from vacation), thanks to responses from the Netgear community, that ReadyCloud® was removed on July 1, 2023. I also learned that its "loss" was "announced" (but not by Netgear®!), and even worse, that the servers NAS have been at the “end of life” for several years already!!! I would have liked all the same to be informed directly by Netgear® of this removal of remote access to my server and above all, to be really guided (assisted!) to consider a favorable follow-up: what good is a NAS to which we can only access locally (USB, what a regression!!! Ah, no! There is now the Orbi Series 960: the Mesh WiFi 6E Quad-Band System...). Until now and for more than 40 years, I had admired the Netgear® company, but now I find it pitiful to have had so little regard from them! It's incomprehensible!

Please, could you explain a little bit more what for is your "move to the FTP route" and how you set up the "Filezilla" app on the laptop? Would this give remote (through the net) and selective access to the invited people?

Many thanks in advance,

Joseph

JoVe34 · ‎2023-08-28

@Sandshark and @StephenB

Congratulations to all of you, StephenB, Sandshark, and the others, for what you write on this Netgear users site: I read your "posts" very carefully (you are real gurus for me because I am really into the need !). Particularly, in the recent exchange with steveTu, with which I completely identify.
I feel that you know exactly what to do to "work around" the difficulty generated by the disappearance of ReadyCloud, however, I am a little bit scared by doing something wrong with my data on my ReadyNAS424 server. Before ReadyCloud disappeared, it was shared with around 100 people. What is the best way to recover this previous situation? I am ready to change my server for another system if it offered the same facilities as ReadyCloud. But how then to transfer the data there with the same sharing options?
Or, is there a way to "keep" the Netgear server and use NoIP® and/or Zero Tier®? Unfortunately, I am not familiar with these "services" and "applications"!
Many thanks for your kind response...

Joseph

StephenB · ‎2023-08-28

@JoVe34 wrote:

Please, could you explain a little bit more what for is your "move to the FTP route" and how you set up the "Filezilla" app on the laptop? Would this give remote (through the net) and selective access to the invited people?

One thing you should be aware of - this won't work with some internet service providers, because they don't allow (or cannot support) port forwarding. This includes broadband internet services, including hotspots. Some landline ISPs also use a technology called carrier-grade NAT - it won't work with them either.

On the NAS, you set up a local NAS account for each user.

Enable FTP for each share that you want them to access, and set it up something like this:

You want the passive ports to be in the range 49,152-65,535. Other choices often work, but this range is dedicated to private/dynamic ports. Generally I've found that 4 passive ports for each simultaneous user is a good value.

I generally set the main port to one less than the passive port range. This is a non-standard port value - slightly harder for an attacker, since they won't know for sure what service is behind the port. But the main reason is that it lets me forward all the ports to the NAS in the router in one setting. (50001-50025 in this case). Alternatively use the standard FTP port (which is 22).

In the router you will need to

reserve the NAS IP address so it always be assigned the same address
forward the passive and main ports to that IP address in the NAS
set up DDNS with a DDNS provider so you can reach the router using a name.

Most routers do have DDNS - Netgear routers include a free service from noip.com that uses *.mynetgear.com names.

After you've forwarded the ports, check that they are open. https://canyouseeme.org/ is one of several internet sites you can use to make that check.

In FileZilla, you set up the connection this way in the site manager:

NASusername is a placeholder for one ot the local NAS accounts you created above. XXXXXX.mynetgear.com is the hostname for your router that you created when you set up the DDNS service.

Then the user simply selects the NAS using the site manager, and it will connect to the NAS.

Sandshark · ‎2023-08-28

If you better describe your situation, maybe we can guide you to the best solution. You say you shared with 100 or so people via ReadyCloud, and want to give them "selective access" now that it's gone. Does that mean you just want to share a few files with each, or complete shares/directories? Do several share the same access level, or is each unique?

StephenB · ‎2023-08-29

@Sandshark wrote:

You say you shared with 100 or so people via ReadyCloud, and want to give them "selective access" now that it's gone.

@JoVe34 - I missed that number somehow. I agree it'd be good to get a bit more clarity on the scope of what you are sharing, and how selective you want it to be.

Did all these people have ReadyCloud accounts on your NAS? Was everything available to them in one share? When you say "selective" - did they all have the same access? Or was it different for different users. How did you set up the access controls? Did you set up multiple groups?

It'd also be useful to know how much data you are talking about. One option would be to switch to a cloud service (dropbox, google drive, etc), and sync that with what is on the NAS.

steveTu · ‎2023-08-29

Are there any known issues with proftpd and ssl from Linux over a BT Hom Hub 6 with ddns.net thrown in?

I have Filezilla / lftp on my laptop and AndFTP/FileMananger + on my phone.

From the phone I can connect to both the NAS's LAN and also via the port forwarded ddns.net WAN address. No issue.

If I try to connect to the ddns.net address from my laptop (Fedora core 36 and 38), it hangs - both Filezilla and lftp.

If I use the adresses at https://www.smartftp.com/en-us/support/kb/2779, I can connect to FTP/FTPS ok from both the phones and my laptop. The issue only appears to be the combination of my ddns.net address and Linux (ie my laptop) (although ftps.cs.brown.edu also hangs - but I think that server is down).

Is this a known 'thing'?

I have a firewall on my laptop, but I have tried disabling that and rebooting without a running firewall and still get the hanging issue on ddns.net.

StephenB · ‎2023-08-29

@steveTu wrote:

If I try to connect to the ddns.net address from my laptop (Fedora core 36 and 38), it hangs - both Filezilla and lftp.

If I use the adresses at https://www.smartftp.com/en-us/support/kb/2779, I can connect to FTP/FTPS ok from both the phones and my laptop. The issue only appears to be the combination of my ddns.net address and Linux (ie my laptop) (although ftps.cs.brown.edu also hangs - but I think that server is down).

ARe you seeing this both when the laptop is connected to your home network, and when it is not?

Do you have masquerading enabled on the NAS?

steveTu · ‎2023-08-29

I quickly tried my laptop from my daughter's home network and got the same '20 second' timeout in filezilla (lftp just seems to hang) - but it was a quick test, as I was doing other stuff. Typically my laptop stays here on my LAN.

No, masquerading isn't set in the FTP settings on the NAS.

StephenB · ‎2023-08-30

@steveTu wrote:

I quickly tried my laptop from my daughter's home network and got the same '20 second' timeout in filezilla (lftp just seems to hang) - but it was a quick test, as I was doing other stuff. Typically my laptop stays here on my LAN.

No, masquerading isn't set in the FTP settings on the NAS.

This is happening at login, not when doing a data transfer. So it is failing to connect to the FTP control port of the NAS, and not to the passive ports used for data.

Check that the control port is forwarded in your router to the NAS.

Then confirm that the control port you are using is actually open. You can use https://canyouseeme.org/ on your home network for this.

If it isn't actually open, then you might double-check that you aren't double-routing. (that's not the only possibility, but it is a common one).

If you are using port 22, then try using a different port in the private port range (49162-65535), and see if you get the same results.

If you have Enable Force FTPS enabled on the NAS, then you want to make sure you are using "use explicit TLS if available" in FileZilla. Implicit TLS will not work.

steveTu · ‎2023-08-30

The router would appear to be ok as the phone connects (two apps) - both using the ddns.net address and port 49999.

The only ports forwarded on the Home Hub are for Plex on 32400 and the NAS on 49999-50500. Port 49999 is open as shown by https://portchecker.co/.

proftpd is configured for both Enable FTPS and Enable Force FTPS - it has port 49999 and passive 50000-50500.

I'm not sure this is the right place for this, as I don't think it's a NAS issue - but I can't see where the issue is. It seems more likely so far to be my Fedora laptop - so outbound, but I can't see anything on there so far.