I'm running RBR50 in router mode (with 2 RBS50's) behind a Virgin Media (UK) cable modem.
My question is: should Orbi be running as DHCP server or should I be leaving the cable router to act as the DHCP server?
I've never noticed that it's setup like this until now, so, is probably not an issue as am not aware of any issues per-se. but curiosity got the better of me as to what's good practice.
> [...] behind a Virgin Media (UK) cable modem. [...]
> [...] leaving the cable router [...]
Make up your mind? Is your (unspecified) Virgin gizmo a modem or a modem+router? An actual maker and model number might be more helpful than a vague non-description.
> [...] what's good practice.
Good practice normally is to have one NAT router, not more than one.
Do you have any client devices connected (wired or wireless) directly to your (unspecified) Virgin gizmo, or is the RBR50 the only thing which is connected to it? If devices connect directly to it (whatever it is), then it includes a NAT router, and you'd probably want to configure the RBR50 as a wireless access point.
If all your client devices are connected to the RBR50 (or its friends), and if you can configure your (unspecified) Virgin gizmo as a modem-only, then you might want to do that, and make the RBR50 your router.
I'm running RBR50 in router mode (with 2 RBS50's) behind a Virgin Media (UK) cable modem.
Virgin, and most ISPs in the UK, supply a modem/router. Adding the RBR50 means you have two routers.
Two routers on your network can cause headaches. For example, you can end up with local address problems. Among other things, the other router can misdirect addresses that the Netgear router usually handles, such as routerlogin.net or the usual IP address for a router, 192.168.1.1.
It may be possible to put the modem/router into modem only (bridge) mode and then to use the second device as the router. Sometimes it is easier to put the second router into AP mode. But that has its own drawbacks:
A lot of people use an Orbi system in AP mode, especially if they have a decent router in front of it. Only you know which of your two routers provides the best features for your needs.
You have posted your message in the section of this community given over to General WiFi Routers (Non-Nighthawk & Non-Orbi). (This is easily done, given Netgear's complicated community structure.)
Many questions apply to different types of device, so there may be useful responses here, but you might get more help, and find earlier questions and answers specific to your device, in the appropriate section for your hardware. That's probably here:
Thanks for your really helpful response and for getting my post moved to the right category - it is a rather complicated structure!
So, we do have things operating as two routers. Orbi was rather unstable early on (this was years ago), so I separated certain network items off to sit on the ISP supplied device (Ring Doorbell/security cameras/home alarm system) so they would not be interupted if/when Orbi had a meltdown and, the wife could hop onto the alternate WiFi whilst I rebooted everything. This might not be needed these days, since Orbi is much more stable.
I've always been reluctant to use the Orbi in AP mode as it reduces functionality and the Virgin router is, shall we say, lacking..but is necessary as it's a cable ISP. We use the Guest network, Circle, Access Control that are not available on the other router.
Both routers use their own IP range, Orbi 192.168.1.. and the Virgin router 192.168.0... so, I've always assumed they would be fine.
Having reviewed the links you shared, gaming works through Orbi (my son is surgically attached to the PS5), though, interestingly, when speed testing, I don't get the same network speeds on the PS5 when wired directly to Orbi than I do if we wire directly to the Virgin box (150-250mbps through Orbi (RBR not RBS), >800mbps on Virgin) - could this be a sign of an issue as a result of the use of two routers? It's the only thing that I can see, when wired, that is significantly slower on the Orbi, compared to what I'd expect (for example, my MacMini which is wired generally gets >800mbps). Ok, in the grand scheme of things, 250mbps is flying however you look at it, but it's puzzling why it's not closer to the max speed that other devices get.
Anyhow, thanks again and hopefully this all makes sense.
Just had another thought on this, having been doing a bit of research (ok, a little bit of knowledge can be dangerous!).
Given the double nat situation that I seem to have, rather than putting the Virgin router into Modem mode and losing the extra Wifi (wihch is always handy for if/when Orbi has a meltdown), I could use the DMZ functionality that comes with the VM box to just pass the Orbi traffic straight out.
Not sure if this deals with the PS5 speed question (seems I'm not alone in having that issue reading the community a bit) - I might need to get the family to go out for a bit so I can play about with the different options and note any issues that occur..
> [...] could this be a sign of an issue as a result of the use of two > routers? [...]
Perhaps. If I wanted to be sure, then I might run the experiment, and configure the RBR50 as a wireless access point.
Saving the RBR50 settings/configuration file first might make reversion easier later, if desired.
> [...] I could use the DMZ functionality that comes with the VM box to > just pass the Orbi traffic straight out. [...]
The relevant section in the Orbi User Manual is called "Set up a default DMZ _server_" for a reason. It affects _incoming_ connections. You could try it, but my expectations would be low in this case. But, as with WAP mode, why trust me when the experiment is so easy to run, and would be much more reliable?
> [...] I can play about with the different options [...]
That's what I'd do.
> [...] I might need to get the family to go out for a bit [...]
Stage a catastrophic failure, and diligently "work" on a "solution"? Everyone might leave spontaneously, and you could be a hero.
Doesn't happen so much now, just went through a phase of being really unreliable a few years back, so I built in the fallback of the other wifi and it's just been left as it is. Ordinarily, Orbi is far superior and has the coverage that we need across the house that the Virgin box simply doesn't.
The two routers are close together, but, I've got them on different channels, there are differnet wifi names and checked what other channels are being used by other local wifi to minimise the possiblility of interference.
Suspect I just need to bite the bullet and move the Virgin box to being Modem only and see how it plays out for a while - it just needs a bit of effort to get the Ring etc onto Orbi. I may have some time tomorrow when the family are out..
Am still intrigued about why the PS5 doesn't work as well on Orbi as it does on the Virgin box, but will see how it is after I change to Modem mode.
Suspect I just need to bite the bullet and move the Virgin box to being Modem only and see how it plays out for a while
Have you tracked down the instructions on how to do that?
Some of these ISP boxes – think BT – go out of there way to frustrate "modem only" operation. That's why I have three BT modem/routers sitting in their original shrinkwrap.
it just needs a bit of effort to get the Ring etc onto Orbi.
THere is a lot of huffing and puffing abut the inability to separate 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz on the Orbi. In reality, it is rarely necessary. But some makers of what the wits call "Internet of Trash" devices are incompetent when it comes to their setup apps. Connect your mobile device to 5GHz and they throw a wobbly because the device they manage works only on 2.4 GHz.
If your IoT stuff is talking to the Virgin box, in your shows I would investigate the switch to the Orbi before I played around with the modem. Then you will have the kit working before you pull the plug on the modem/router.
To be fair to VM, thier boxes are fairly straightforward (if limited in functionality), at least in tracking down the settings (BT, I recall were pretty shocking and I don't blame you for leaving them in their wrappers. Sadly don't have that choice with cable, I don't think). Am pretty sure we had the previous VM hub running in Modem only mode for a while - I got the shiny new 1g upgrade late last year, so have never tried it on the Hub4, but the navigation is the same.
That's a great suggestion of moving everything to Orbi first, thanks. I'd probably have done it the other way round and had everything offline for longer.
I've got a few things that only work on 2.4ghz but it's never seemed to be too much of an issue when setting things up previously. Ring is defo one, the Arlo cameras/lights are the other - and Arlo throws a massive hissy fit, putting loads of warnings in the app about not working on 5ghz network trying to set them up, but they then work anyhow because there is 2.4ghz network available.
the Arlo cameras/lights are the other - and Arlo throws a massive hissy fit, putting loads of warnings in the app about not working on 5ghz network trying to set them up, but they then work anyhow because there is 2.4ghz network available.
Been there, done that, many times. I beta stuff for Arlo and have been down that road. Sounds scarier than it turns out to be.
So, I've done the deed, moved the VM box to modem mode and it wasn't that difficult. Got all the other,stuff moved to Orbi first. PlayStation speeds still slow.
Then, after a few hours, I noticed a few iOS apps were really sluggish, at best, which was puzzling (Facebook media were just grey blocks, BBC sport app not showing any news stories). Was getting great speed test results and pop iPhone onto cellular and problems went away..
Next, thought, well, I'm up early, let's do a factory reset. Had read a few posts here about QoS issues with Orbi and the built in Speedtest causing issues.
So, reset and got the 2 satellites registered and everything back online. App issues then disappeared and Orbi admin navigation is much less sluggish.
But, still PS5 speed is slow.
Anyone got any views on the QoS point with Orbi and use of the Speedtest functionality, which I read drove some kind of dynamic QoS? I've not run a Speedtest in Orbi since the reset, wasn't sure if I should..
Anyone got any views on the QoS point with Orbi and use of the Speedtest functionality, which I read drove some kind of dynamic QoS? I've not run a Speedtest in Orbi since the reset, wasn't sure if I should..
The reasoning behind slowness with QoS enabled is that anything that requires the router's processor to work on the traffic eats processing power that would otherwise go into moving traffic around.
The notion is that you avoid that if you turn off QoS, traffic metering, parental controls and so on.
I have no idea if there is a different take on this in Orbi devices.
I would try to get help with that in the section where most Orbi users hang out.
