Orbi QoS does not work.. What's up?

Well I got the firmware to update after doing a second factory reset on the satellite, so that's fine.

However, now that I see I'm an idiot and somehow missed that the QoS on this is only WMM, none of this matters.  There is no QoS for upstream or wired connections at all.  Dead end.  Apparently uploading pictures to Facebook and playing video games are "advanced" activities not to be engaged in by the "target audience" for Orbi, whoever that is.

Man, do I feel like a fool.  Can't believe I spent $300 on literally the least functional router I've ever seen.  My wife's gonna have a field day with this one.

Have you tried using the new FW with FB and gaming? I have two game consoles connected with a DISH Hopper system streaming both DISH and netflix while gaming. Also 3 cameras and 2 NESTs and phones. I don't see any problems while gaming. I'm currnently waching a movie thru my Hopper while roomate is on xbox gaming. PUBG.

Right, but the issue is you're not uploading anything significant.  Your 200Mbs downstream isn't going to be taxed by any of that activity.  I can have four devices streaming and play games OK too.  However, it's easy to tap out a 10Mb upstream with any sort of file transfer like uploading pictures or doing a file backup.  This is where the QoS is needed.  Games don't need much upstream bandwidth, but they need their packets to be prioritized to ensure fast response times.

I will test it again at some point, but unless they've added some new form of QoS, it won't matter.  This thing isn't even TRYING to prioritize upstream traffic.  It will simply allow my wife's picture uploads to saturate the upstream link, causing response times to skyrocket, exactly as it has done since the day I plugged it in.  Inexcusable lack of basic functionality.  I can't believe they've been given a pass on this in reviews.  

You happen to still have your prior router by chance? 

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joshv wrote:

Right, but the issue is you're not uploading anything significant.  Your 200Mbs downstream isn't going to be taxed by any of that activity.  I can have four devices streaming and play games OK too.  However, it's easy to tap out a 10Mb upstream with any sort of file transfer like uploading pictures or doing a file backup.  This is where the QoS is needed.  Games don't need much upstream bandwidth, but they need their packets to be prioritized to ensure fast response times.

 

I will test it again at some point, but unless they've added some new form of QoS, it won't matter.  This thing isn't even TRYING to prioritize upstream traffic.  It will simply allow my wife's picture uploads to saturate the upstream link, causing response times to skyrocket, exactly as it has done since the day I plugged it in.  Inexcusable lack of basic functionality.  I can't believe they've been given a pass on this in reviews.  

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How do you conclude the router is WMM only?  Did you read my post about Dynamic QoS?  This is separate from WMM.

Did you run the built-in speed test?  This would be required to activate Dynamic QoS.  Dynamic QoS works on a NETGEAR R7800 I have, and the only setting reqruied is to run the speed test--just like Orbi.  

Note that I can't confirm whether Dynamic QoS works on Orbi, because I use my Orbi in AP mode with a Mikrotik router, which does the QoS.

1. I do have my old router, but I don't want to go back to it.  My old Buffalo had started to lock up from time to time and needed to be reset every couple of weeks.  That and wanting to improve wifi coverage on the far side of the house are what got me shopping.  If I need to replace this, I'll just go ahead and buy something new.

2. I concluded it only had WMM based on Case850's post above stating such, which was a surprise to me, but when I googled it I did find several other reviews mentioning "QoS is limited to WMM at this time", although in hindsight I suppose it's possible they were referring to the settings available in the menu rather than overall functionality.

3. Yes, definitely interested in recommendations for a better router.  Despite their obnoxious asthetics, I may even consider one of those "gaming" routers just so I know I'll get some easy set & forget QoS that will keep my pings from spiking to 500 when somebody uses Facebook.  My wife is not at all happy with the current "check with me and wait until I'm finished with my stupid game before you upload any pictures" arrangement.  That's not what she expected when I convinced her spending $350 on a new router was a good idea.  Of course, I do need to manually run some tests with the new firmware first to make sure the situation hasn't been fixed.  Should have time to do that this weekend.

Thanks to all you for your assistance and suggestions.

Run the speed test with the router and ALL other devices disconnected from the router. Just your wired PC/Laptop with the router and modem. This will make sure the speed test is done accurately. After it's done, save setting then reboot. Then reconnect your devices during the reboot. 

Test and see how your upload processes are then. Again, I've seen no issues either download or upload while doing either process. I would have noticed this a long time ago if I did. 

I also have the NG R7800 and have zero issues with QOS on it. It's not running XR500 FW now. Hehe. 

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joshv wrote:

1. I do have my old router, but I don't want to go back to it.  My old Buffalo had started to lock up from time to time and needed to be reset every couple of weeks.  That and wanting to improve wifi coverage on the far side of the house are what got me shopping.  If I need to replace this, I'll just go ahead and buy something new.

 

2. I concluded it only had WMM based on Case850's post above stating such, which was a surprise to me, but when I googled it I did find several other reviews mentioning "QoS is limited to WMM at this time", although in hindsight I suppose it's possible they were referring to the settings available in the menu rather than overall functionality.

 

3. Yes, definitely interested in recommendations for a better router.  Despite their obnoxious asthetics, I may even consider one of those "gaming" routers just so I know I'll get some easy set & forget QoS that will keep my pings from spiking to 500 when somebody uses Facebook.  My wife is not at all happy with the current "check with me and wait until I'm finished with my stupid game before you upload any pictures" arrangement.  That's not what she expected when I convinced her spending $350 on a new router was a good idea.  Of course, I do need to manually run some tests with the new firmware first to make sure the situation hasn't been fixed.  Should have time to do that this weekend.

 

Thanks to all you for your assistance and suggestions.

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Outside of WMM the Orbi does zero QoS.  I initially bought mine to replace my single Asus AC-87U.  This router worked fantastic however i had a few dead zones and poor reception outside on my deck... hence the Orbi pruchase.  The lack of QoS made this router unuseable in a multi-user household.  I ended up disabling wireless and putting my Asus back in just to get QoS back.  Curerntly my Orbi are running in AP mode.   The other issues with ORbi firmware (breaking homekit) i'm considering buying another Asus and using the mesh mode features that were recently released in their current firmware.

Just wanted to follow up some more after a bit of testing.

It appears that the QoS does something, just not very well.  Saurating my upstream with a file transfer to Google Docs, I would see ping times jump 20-40ms to the 400-600ms range before running the QoS Speed Test.   After running the Speed Test to enable QoS, ping times would only spike to the 200-300ms range.  I did this several times, factory resetting the Orbi each time and the results were consistent.

So it appears to successfully reduce the impact, just not enough to actually be useful for real-time applications.  I started poking around at some router reviews, and it's mind boggling that even supposed tech sites only seem to test QoS on routers they review by saturating their downstream.  This is bizarre considering the average household is FAR more likely to saturate their upstream with 50/5 100/10 200/10 being common tiers for major US providers, especially with digital camera makers hell bent on slapping 20MP+ sensors on their $5 optics so people can obliviously upload their 20MB low quality photos to Facebook for shrinking.

Router shopping again.  These are a couple expensive APs I guess.

If you want a router with full QoS, the ability to throttle bandwidth by individual IP address, prioritize traffic by type, etc., then go spend $60 on a Mikrotik RB750Gr3.  Plug the Orbi into it and use Orbi as an access point.  Plan to give yourself a few weeks to learn how to use the router though.

Spent several hours with tech support in India regarding the problems mentioned in this post.  At NO time was it relayed to me that this doesn't have REAL QoS.  Tech support was unknowledgeable and unhelpful and did not respond to the ticket opened.

It WAS relayed to me that my old router Netgear R7000 is actually faster than this Orbi.  So I feel for OP as this is a complete waste of money.  Fortunately, I got it at a very reduced price ($185) but that doesn't make it any easier to swallow.

Lesson learned!  Any posts I see regarding Netgear products on the Internet will receive a copied and pasted review from me cautioning prospective buyers of what I have experienced and learned.  Negear products will NOT be purchased in the future for my home and I had always chosen Netgear.

Your products and support are INFERIOR.  Good-bye!

This is the first real problem I've had with this router but now it's a big one. Netgear, I don't remember if QoS was advertised in the box when I bought this, but if it was, shame on you for not having this feature working.