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Forum Discussion

ThomasNanninga's avatar
Jan 11, 2022

BR200 and OpenVpn questions/considerations

BR500/BR200 OpenVPN Client access limitations and considerations - follow up to the closed thread from April 2021 (Maufus/Schumaku)

What I understood so far:

1. BR500/200 will have no further development / firmware upgrades. BR200 is a stripped one already, so I had to change from Insight VPN to IPSec VPN with dedicated policies per VLAN. OpenVPN works but with several limitations.

 

2. Configuration options Windows TAP (for different groups of clients and authorizations): 
The client.ovpn TAP mode has just a DNS entry, port and refers to certificates and Windows TAP adapter which is all fixed by Netgear.

The NETGEAR-VPN TAP adapter has a properties view where I have specified 192.168.1.200+ (above DHCP range) addresses to different PCs, all manually defined. They don't get an immediate IP by DHCP which may be a Smartphone hotspot latency problem.

My understanding is that remote clients only stay in the router's management VLAN, so they can see all router, NAS, etc web gui pages (don't know the PW though but don't like it in general). To switch some of the remote clients into a 192.168.10.0 VLAN segment is impossible?

 

3. Configuration options Smartphones TUN

There seem to be even less configuration options, it takes the next network segment win this example 192.168.2.0. This should be free from other IPSec segments to avoid conflicts.

At least this should be working better that the Readynas app where we can't see our homefolders and no-one takes care for the last two years.

 

4. What would be the alternative?

Setting a Windows server 19 with all Remote access service, AD and Radius service? 

Is another device that runs 24/7, needs knowledge, admin, updates.....

I'm considering if that's worth the effort. On the other hand I don't see a new business-like VPN router successor announced by Netgear. They do concentrate more on Orbi, etc. stuff.

What would you think?

3 Replies

  • schumaku's avatar
    schumaku
    Guru - Experienced User

    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    2. Configuration options Windows TAP (for different groups of clients and authorizations): 

    The client.ovpn TAP mode has just a DNS entry, port and refers to certificates and Windows TAP adapter which is all fixed by Netgear.

    In my understanding, there is just one certificate, no control to allow the configuration for different access groups and multiple users. Note: This is not an OpenVPN limitation - this is how all these simple OpenVPN things are implemented, mainly for a single user to call back home (this is not limited to these routers, same on the popular other NAS vendor implementations. 

     


    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    The NETGEAR-VPN TAP adapter has a properties view where I have specified 192.168.1.200+ (above DHCP range) addresses to different PCs, all manually defined. They don't get an immediate IP by DHCP which may be a Smartphone hotspot latency problem.

    When you have OpenVPN client devices establishing an OpenVPN connection to the "home" network from random locations, Open WiFi, mobile routers and modems: Why on earth to you stick on this default LAN IP where about half of the networks are using? Nightmare predictable ....

     


    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    My understanding is that remote clients only stay in the router's management VLAN, so they can see all router, NAS, etc web gui pages (don't know the PW though but don't like it in general).

    Again, this is how the OpenVPN "server" part is implemented here. Not really an OpenVPN limitation.

     


    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    To switch some of the remote clients into a 192.168.10.0 VLAN segment is impossible?

    Technically anything is possible - however it requires design, implementation, user interface, and much mode. With what is in pace - no way.

     


    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    3. Configuration options Smartphones TUN

    There seem to be even less configuration options, it takes the next network segment win this example 192.168.2.0. This should be free from other IPSec segments to avoid conflicts.

    Complete wrong assumption. Also the commercial OpenVPN Access Server does make use of an intermediate transport network for the TUN devices. The subnet must be unique (in the complete data path, and on all devices of course) - however that subnet is never visible except on the OpenVPN connection "hop".  All these IP subnet addresses from your TUN VPN clients are Many-2-one NATed to the router primary LAN IP. These IP addresses are never becoming visible to your local network.

     

    Borrowed from the OpenVPN Server docs:

     

    ===
    By default OpenVPN Access Server works with Layer 3 routing mode. In this mode a private subnet is configured for the VPN client subnet. This private subnet must be different from other subnets used in your networks, and clients automatically get IP addresses assigned from this subnet when they log on. This is automated. Usually it goes in a sequential order until it reaches the end of the portion of the subnet available to the OpenVPN daemon you get connected to, and then it starts reusing older addresses. This acts a little bit like DHCP but technically we don't run a DHCP server in Access Server, just a sort of rough emulation to assign addresses automatically. The subnet that users get addresses from automatically is found in the Admin UI under VPN Settings, Dynamic IP Address Network.

    ===

     


    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    At least this should be working better that the Readynas app where we can't see our homefolders and no-one takes care for the last two years.

    ReadyNAS App? Probably talking of the ReadyCLOUD App? The trouble is that the "home" share server path is dynamic, and depends on the (single) authentication by username and password, specifically the username. What is relatively "simple" on a LAN and pure SAMBA, must be rebuilt and designed for all other access vectors. No idea by how far Netgear has implemented the home folders beyond of pure SAMBA, proably FTP, (yeah historical AFP), and the WebUI. 

     


    ThomasNanninga wrote:

    4. What would be the alternative?

     A complete commercial OpenVPN Access Server, or a fully and freely configurable OpenVPN on a generic Linux system could do what you want for example. At the end it depends if you already have some centralized acount and group management - like an Microsoft Directory, like some LDAP, just to name a few.

     

    Except that there is some plan for a Netgear DualWAN device, I have no idea what is going on, and what implementation depth can be expected. Unless they build on a capable open source or commercial business router platform ... it will be difficult to regain the business router market again.

     

    Grüsse

    -Kurt

    • Thanks for sharing thoughts.

      >>ReadyNAS App? Probably talking of the ReadyCLOUD App<< Yes, of course ReadyCloud

      Understood that all this is not an OpenVPN limitation but a rather simple implementation for the routers. 

       

      >>By default OpenVPN Access Server works with Layer 3 routing mode. In this mode a private subnet is configured for the VPN client subnet. This private subnet must be different from other subnets used in your networks, and clients automatically get IP addresses assigned from this subnet when they log on. This is automated. Usually it goes in a sequential order until it reaches the end of the portion of the subnet available<<

       

      Let me understand this clearly: 

      In my example I have the routers 192.168.1.0 basic segment which means that OpenVPN TUN (for smartphones) will use 192.168.2.0 addresses. Therefore, I need to keep it free from other addresses?

      In the TAP adapter I can define static IPs from the basic x.1.0 segment but not from any other "Guest-VLan" x.20.0? Not at all or not the easy way but with additional configuration?

       

      >>At the end it depends if you already have some centralized acount and group management - like an Microsoft Directory, like some LDAP, just to name a few.<<

      There is no Linux knowledge around here, so I need to rely on MS. Today everything is decentralized which in not a problem due to a small no. of users. However, an idea would be to link a MS Server into the Netgear environment for

      - Running a centralized Active directory for both NAS

      - Connect switches and Antennas to a radius server for WPA-Enterprise, means that people can forward the WLAN PW as they like but I keep access control.

      - Set a centralized phone book for the VoIP phones.

      - Last not least set an MS Remote Access service instead of BR500 Openvpn and people would not be able to call all Web GUIs any more

      Does that sound reasonable?

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