×

Introducing the Orbi 970 Series Mesh System with WiFi 7(BE) technology. For more information visit the NETGEAR Press Room.

Orbi WiFi 7 RBE973
Reply

A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

CanyonMonkey
Tutor

A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

 

I've just set-up my Orbi RBK23 system. Having done an RF survey of the house and garden I determined the best 2.4Ghz channels for each device. Based on the survey I went to assign cetrain devices to channel 1, 6 and 11 and discover Orbi wants all the devices on the same channel?!

 

Where can I find the option to manually set the channel number for each device? I guess I'm more likely to get a 5Ghz connection around my property with the Orbi system but it's disappoint that 2.4Ghz settings aren't easily changed.

Message 1 of 25

Accepted Solutions
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

For anyone finding this thread with the same issue I think I've resolved it for the 2.4Ghz band. I haven't yet tried for 5Ghz.

Most of the replies have been less than helpful so I hope this will work for people finding this thread.

Note: I'm using the system in access point mode so can't confirm this works when using the Orbi as a router.

1) Setup Orbi system. All devices will be on the same WiFi channel, in my case ch1.

2) Change the router 2.4Ghz channel to ch6. The satellites will remain on the original channel.

3) Hard reset one of the satellites and set it up as if it were a new addition to the network. It should connect and use ch6, which the router is using.

4) Change the wifi channel number of the router to ch11. You will then have each device on a separate channel.

It's unbelievably weird that Netgear doesn't provide settings to make this process simple but I guess Orbi is targeted at people with limited radio frequency and WiFi knowledge.

Next will come experiments with the 5Ghz settings.

View solution in original post

Message 22 of 25

All Replies
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Also, using a wifi analyser it looks like my 2.4Ghz signals are covering 6 channels. Is this something to do with the MIMO settings? I feel like I'm missing something and not understanding this Orbi system! 🙂

Message 2 of 25
plemans
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Welcome to the world of wireless channels!

The router can only use 1 channel at a time. not multiple. And they overlap. Which is why 1-6-11 is recommended. to prevent the overlap.

https://www.metageek.com/training/resources/why-channels-1-6-11.html

Nice thing about orbi is it does band steering. So if a device is needing more bandwidth, the orbi can switch them to 5ghz if they support it. 5ghz is significantly faster than 2.4ghz. 

Message 3 of 25
Retired_Member
Not applicable

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Leave your WiFi channel selection set to auto

 

your neighbors may be reading this 

Message 4 of 25
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

You'll be fine using manual channels 1, 6 or 11. It's recommended if you have many close nighborss. 

You can also turn down the power output of the wifi radios as well. Under Advanced Tab/Advanced Settings/Wireless Settings


@CanyonMonkey wrote:

 

I've just set-up my Orbi RBK23 system. Having done an RF survey of the house and garden I determined the best 2.4Ghz channels for each device. Based on the survey I went to assign cetrain devices to channel 1, 6 and 11 and discover Orbi wants all the devices on the same channel?!

 

Where can I find the option to manually set the channel number for each device? I guess I'm more likely to get a 5Ghz connection around my property with the Orbi system but it's disappoint that 2.4Ghz settings aren't easily changed.


 

Message 5 of 25
Retired_Member
Not applicable

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Chasing channels and reducing power at the WiFi source is another waste of time and money you spent on your orbi. 

Message 6 of 25
BoilerPlate
Apprentice

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

It's why the features are included. And valid steps to try. No trying the features would be waste of time. Like your doing. Please stop. Your not helpful what so ever. 


@Retired_Member wrote:

Chasing channels and reducing power at the WiFi source is another waste of time and money you spent on your orbi. 


 

Message 7 of 25
Retired_Member
Not applicable

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???


@BoilerPlate wrote:

It's why the features are included. And valid steps to try. No trying the features would be waste of time. Like your doing. Please stop. Your not helpful what so ever. 


@Retired_Member wrote:

Chasing channels and reducing power at the WiFi source is another waste of time and money you spent on your orbi. 


 


And you pointing out your displeasure in my posts is helpful?

Message 8 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

I can't find an option to change the 2.4Ghz channel number of the Satellittes, unless I've missed it somewhere? (Using the RBK23)

 

The 5Ghz channels also appear to be set to the same value. I guess this is less of a problem as 5Ghz signals won't penetrate through the building as far, but it doesn't seem ideal. 

 

If I could manually set channel numbers I could improve my own and my neighbours wifi. Seems like a basic functional requirement of a home wifi system. 

 

I still don't understand why I'm seeing my SSID spreading across 6 channels in the band, isn't 4 channels the norm? 

Message 9 of 25
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Channels are only set on the RBR using a web browser. The RBS follow and will use the same channel as what is set on the RBR. This is how they work. You cant' change any channels on the RBS. Basic function of changing channels has been around since wifi routers first came out. Still present. 

 


@CanyonMonkey wrote:

I can't find an option to change the 2.4Ghz channel number of the Satellittes, unless I've missed it somewhere? (Using the RBK23)

 

The 5Ghz channels also appear to be set to the same value. I guess this is less of a problem as 5Ghz signals won't penetrate through the building as far, but it doesn't seem ideal. 

 

If I could manually set channel numbers I could improve my own and my neighbours wifi. Seems like a basic functional requirement of a home wifi system. 

 

I still don't understand why I'm seeing my SSID spreading across 6 channels in the band, isn't 4 channels the norm? 


 

Message 10 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???


@CanyonMonkey wrote:

Also, using a wifi analyser it looks like my 2.4Ghz signals are covering 6 channels. Is this something to do with the MIMO settings? I feel like I'm missing something and not understanding this Orbi system! 🙂


Could you take a screen shot of this information?  The Orbi router and satellite should be broadcasting both the primary and guest SSID's on exactly one 2.4G channel.  They are all on the same channel, and there is no method to have them use more than one channel at the same time.

Message 11 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

 

Wow... You tell me that changing the wifi channel of a router is a basic function that's been available forever but then tell me the satellites can't change their channel?? Why? Unless I get a proper, considered, intelligent response from some who sounds like they understand radio frequency interactions and interference I'm going to have to consider returning system. 

 

 

Message 12 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

I turned off the guest Wifi. this channel graph I'm sharing is pretty much 'car crash' stuff for 2.4Ghz wifi. I can't do that to my neighbours.... Interestingly, it seems that one of my devices has moved to ch11, with the other two on ch8. 

 

 

WiFiAnalyzer.jpg

Message 13 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

There appear to be several concepts being discussed at one time:

  • Whether it is better to allow the Orbi to select which channels to use ("Auto"), or better to manually select a channel.
    There is a spirited debate on the merits of each position, with some strong opinions.
    There is no debate about whether the user can force a WiFi router to use a specific WiFi channel.  They can.
  • Whether the Orbi router and satellites will all be on the same channel, regardless of how the channel is selected.
    And the answer to this is, "Yes.  The router and satellites will broadcast on the same channel.  All of them."
    There is no method to force a satellite to use a specific WiFi channel.  The router sets the channel and every satellite also uses it.

I would be fascinated to learn of any WiFi mesh system which does either of these things:

  • Have some access points broacast an SSID on one WiFi channel and others broadcast the same SSID on different channels.
  • Have the same SSID being broadcast on more than one channel by the same access point.

I do not think this situation is unique to Netgear Orbi, or Netgear in general.

Message 14 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???


@CanyonMonkey wrote:

I turned off the guest Wifi. this channel graph I'm sharing is pretty much 'car crash' stuff for 2.4Ghz wifi. I can't do that to my neighbours.... Interestingly, it seems that one of my devices has moved to ch11, with the other two on ch8. 


Oh, darn.  It appears that embedded images do not show up until a forum moderator approves them.  Maybe if you "Attach" it?

Message 15 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Here's the image again, uploaded through the photo button? Is there any other way? 

 

Regardless, I've bought a wireless product that sells it's self as having a dedicated backhaul connection for speed but then allows interference between every device connected to every AP. It makes no sense. It's not marketed as mesh wifi, the implication is that it's more than that. I'm not very impressed and it's probably going back to the store. 

 

I want each AP to to be able to be managed independently, based on the RF survey I've done on my property.  

Message 16 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

I think the way to attach an image (that avoids waiting for moderator processing) is to click on the "Browse" button at the bottom left.

 


@CanyonMonkey wrote:

I want each AP to to be able to be managed independently, based on the RF survey I've done on my property.  


I have a strong suspicion that you are destined to be unsatisfied with any mesh product on the market from any vendor. (Google, Linksys, etc. etc.)

 

It is technically possible to "roll your own" WiFi system, but (a) it will not be "integrated", and (b) it will require connecting everything with ethernet cables.  i.e.:

  • Begin with any WiFi router of any brand that has at least one ethernet LAN port.
    Set the 2.4G and 5G channels to any channels you want.
    (Some products will allow setting the 2.4G and 5G channels to different SSID's.  Orbi does not.)
  • Connect as many WiFi access points as desired to this router using ethernet cables.
    Set the 2.4G and 5G channels on these access points to any channels you want.
    Set the 2.4G and 5G SSID's on each access point as desired.

The ethernet cables are required because (I believe) that typical "WiFi extenders" that are connected using WiFi (a) will set themselves to the same WiFi channel as the primary WiFi they are repeating, and (b) their default SSID will echo the primary SSID.  Using ethernet makes these access points entirely independent.

 

So, I believe this will accomplish what you want.  I think it will also be a "mess".  Even if all of these WiFi access points have the same SSID, when a device roams from one place to another it will not "roam" as it would with a mesh system.  The signal level from the first access point will have to fall to nearly zero before the device will look for another.

 

I'm still interested in seeing that WiFi survey.  How large is this property anyway?

 

Message 17 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Hopefully I've managed to attach the file!

 

My understanding was that the 'Tri-band' functionality of the Orbi means that the devices are connected by a dedcated 5Ghz connection and that the other 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands were dedicated to my home network. 

 

My home is already fully cabled, in fact all of the Orbi devices are connected to a Gigabit LAN. I wanted this system to extend out to the gardens. It seems crazy that a company would market a product that doesn't allow you to optimise a wireless network. 

 

Can you recommend a product that gives more control? Which also doesn't swamp half the 2.4ghz band?

Message 18 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???


@CanyonMonkey wrote:

Hopefully I've managed to attach the file!  Got it, thanks.  Assuming "CanyonMonkey" is the Orbi SSID.

 

My understanding was that the 'Tri-band' functionality of the Orbi means that the devices are connected by a dedcated 5Ghz connection and that the other 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands were dedicated to my home network. This remains the "crux" of the problem.  Early "mesh" systems used one 5G channel for both the user devices and the connection between access points. and one 2.4G channel for user devices.  The "Tri-band" in newer mesh systems indicates that they use a 5G channel to connect access points that is separate from the 5G user band.  My Orbi, for example, uses an 80MHz wide 5G channel (36-48) for user devices and an 80MHz wide 5G channel (149-161) for the backhaul.

 

My home is already fully cabled, in fact all of the Orbi devices are connected to a Gigabit LAN. I wanted this system to extend out to the gardens. It seems crazy that a company would market a product that doesn't allow you to optimise a wireless network. Using ethernet backhaul completly negates the value of "Tri-band" from any manufacturer.  It remains lurking there in case the ethernet connection fails, but provides no added value.  (Most of us are intensly jealous of people who ethernet cables in the walls.)

 

Can you recommend a product that gives more control? Which also doesn't swamp half the 2.4ghz band? I suspect the reason you see CanyonMonkey on two 2.4G channels is because "Enable 20/40 MHz Coexistence" is checked on the Advanced Tab, Advanced Settings, Wireless Settings.  When I had it checked, I saw two 2.4G channels.  When I unchecked it, I see only one. The 2.4G WiFi channel design is a horrible mess because they "overlap" so much.  Only channels 1, 6, and 11 do not overlap (in the US.  it appears you may be elsewhere where channels 12 & 13 are supported?)


I often refer to this forum post about the Orbi radios: https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi/Understanding-Orbi-Radio-Fronthaul-Backhaul/m-p/1671092 It has commands to discover the exact MAC addresses of the various Orbi radios.

 

As far as a recommendation, I honestly do not see a "problem".  Compared to most folks, your WiFi space is "nearly empty."

Message 19 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Thanks so much for the help.I tried your suggestiong of turning off 20/40 coexistence but I'm still seeing all three of my APs taking up twice the number of channels in the 2.4Ghz band. 

 

I'm in the UK, the fact I'm spamming RF traffic across so much of the 1 to 13 channel band is making me feel a little guilty. I don't want to ruin other's Wifi experience when improving my own.

Message 20 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

The WiFi analyzer app that you are using uses an unusual "shape" to describe the WiFi signal.  On my Android, I use WiFi Analyzer by Kevin Yuan and WiFi Analyzer by Abdelrahman M. Sid.  Both of those apps show the relative strength of the WiFi signal as a "curve", not as an (almost) rectangle.  So, a WiFi signal on channel 6 interferes mostly with other signals on channel 6.  Not so much on channels 5 and 7.  Even less on channels 4 and 8.  And, not at all on channels 3 and 9.

 

If there were WiFi access points near enough for your Orbi to seriously interfere with them, they would be showing up on the display.

Message 21 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

For anyone finding this thread with the same issue I think I've resolved it for the 2.4Ghz band. I haven't yet tried for 5Ghz.

Most of the replies have been less than helpful so I hope this will work for people finding this thread.

Note: I'm using the system in access point mode so can't confirm this works when using the Orbi as a router.

1) Setup Orbi system. All devices will be on the same WiFi channel, in my case ch1.

2) Change the router 2.4Ghz channel to ch6. The satellites will remain on the original channel.

3) Hard reset one of the satellites and set it up as if it were a new addition to the network. It should connect and use ch6, which the router is using.

4) Change the wifi channel number of the router to ch11. You will then have each device on a separate channel.

It's unbelievably weird that Netgear doesn't provide settings to make this process simple but I guess Orbi is targeted at people with limited radio frequency and WiFi knowledge.

Next will come experiments with the 5Ghz settings.
Message 22 of 25
CrimpOn
Guru

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

I have serious doubts that this actually "works".  Do you have access to a WiFi channel analyzer, perhaps on a laptop or Android device (phone, tablet)?

 

When I open WiFi Analyzer by Kevin Yuan on my Android devices, it clearly shows the access point MAC addresses for my router and satellite, both on the same channel.  When I change the channel on the router, the satellite changes along with it.

Message 23 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

Despite your "doubts" I can confirm it "works".

Screenshot attached of each device running a different 2.4Ghz channel. I've also logged in and confirmed via the interfaces that each is running on those channels.

I'm very disappointed with the knowledge and help from this "community.

Message 24 of 25
CanyonMonkey
Tutor

Re: A whole home wifi system on one 2.4ghz channel???

crimpOn... Reading your post from the 18th of April, I think you need to do some research on radio frequencies, channels, co-channel and cross channel interference.

The "shape" of curves in a wifi analyser app are meaningless.
Message 25 of 25
Top Contributors
Discussion stats
  • 24 replies
  • 4553 views
  • 2 kudos
  • 6 in conversation
Announcements

Orbi WiFi 7