Orbi on NBN FTTP MS Teams Video not work

[Rnubes]

hi, I have Telstra NBN FTTP at 250/22Mg speed with Orib RBK50.

For some reason, MS Teams on windows 11 using the native MS Teams client does not do video very well, it just does not work. I can see video but my video is blank. This is probably due to the Orbi sending lots of traffic to the NBN and the NBN policer dropping packets. If I use MS teams video in a browser it works fine. I have tried to put a managed switch to reduce the egress to fit the 22mg profile with the switch between the NTD and Orbi but it still does not work. If I put the Telstra Smart Modem 3 as the router it works perfectly for the MS teams video. Clearly the Telstra Smart Modem is doing some form of traffic shopping for the upload. What I want to know, is why I cannot get the Orbi to do the same thing? It has no ability to shape traffic on the egress nor QoS, for such an expensive unit its disappointing. Yes I have the latest firmware etc. I prefer the Orbi for the parental controls and the fact I use two satellites.

If someone has some idea on how to over come this issue please let me know. The only solution I have now is to use the Telstra Smart 3 with the Orbi in AP mode which clearly removes all the parental functionality etc. Oh, I used the Tp-Link 4 port managed switch most use and followed the settings on the internet and it just did not work.

Appreciate some thoughts and for the @netgear to fix this problem as I am sure other have it given we work from home now.  Thanks!

[michaelkenward]

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@Rnubes wrote:

hi, I have Telstra NBN FTTP at 250/22Mg speed with Orib RBK50.

For some reason, MS Teams on windows 11 using the native MS Teams client does not do video very well, it just does not work. I can see video but my video is blank.

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I'm intrigued. What makes you think that your RBK50 is responsible for these problems?

I would look first at Microsoft. I do know that Teams is a bugger to get to play nicely.

I have two PCs on my desk. One happily uses the Teams client, the other won't work unless I use the browser interface.

I put this down to problems with one of my Windows (11) installations.

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This is probably due to the Orbi sending lots of traffic to the NBN and the NBN policer dropping packets.

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Can you explain what that means?

Is there something in the router's logs that leads you to this conclusion?

In many years watching this place, I have never come across a problem that is down to "sending lots of traffic" to anything.

But even if this is correct, don't you think that your first port of call should be whatever this "NBN policer" might be?

Of course, if anything is "sending lots of traffic" it would be the Team's client. The router just does what things tell it to do.

Appreciate some thoughts and for the @netgear to fix this problem as I am sure other have it given we work from home now.  Thanks!

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Before Netgear can fix anything, it needs to be convinced that it is something that it can, and should, fix, rather than something else.

People have reported problems with Netgear routers and Teams but they don't seem to relate to the experience you describe. So it may take a lot more evidence to jerk the coders into action.

Search - NETGEAR Communities – teams

Perhaps you could review those messages – maybe you have done that already – and come back with some evidence to back up your interesting theory.

[Rnubes]

hi you are correct that it is not the orbi but teams that has the issue with data. But what I find interesting is that the Telstra smart router 3 seems to allow it to play nicely so something is going on here with the ISP router vs Orbi. In any case, the orbi is now just an expensive wifi without using the other great features.

[FURRYe38]

If your ISP Modem already has a built in router and wifi. This would be a double NAT (two router) condition which isn't recommended. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT
https://kb.netgear.com/30187/How-to-fix-issues-with-Double-NAT
Couple of options,
1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop

Try option #2 first. 

Be sure your using a good quality LAN cable between the modem and router. CAT6 is recommended. 

What is the size of your home? Sq Ft?
What is the distance between the router and 📡 satellite(s)? 30 feet or more is recommended in between RBR and RBS🛰️ to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected.
https://kb.netgear.com/31029/Where-should-I-place-my-Orbi-satellite ‌‌🛰️

One User Experience/Configuration:
https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi/Most-Stable-Orbi-Configuration/m-p/1941087/highlight/true#M970...

[michaelkenward]

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@Rnubes wrote:

But what I find interesting is that the Telstra smart router 3 seems to allow it to play nicely so something is going on here with the ISP router vs Orbi.

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Is the Telstra thing sitting in front of the Orbi?

Are they running them in serial (one after the other)?

If so you should investigate how they work together.

If the Telstra "smart router 3" really is a router, then as @FURRYe38 suggests, you may run into this problem:

What is Double NAT? | Answer | NETGEAR Support

Your system should be able to accommodate that during the setupstage, but there's no guarantee there.

I didn't pick up on your earlier comment:

I have tried to put a managed switch to reduce the egress to fit the 22mg profile with the switch between the NTD and Orbi but it still does not work.

I don't understand  most of that, or why you went down that road, but I fear that you are making life hard for yourself. Don't follow up ever daft idea you find on Google and get back to basics.

My guess is that your Teams issues are down to something else that is amiss in your setup.

[Rnubes]

When the problem occurred, I removed the orbi and used the ISP Telstra supplied router and it worked. The only way I can use them both is to use the Telstra modem with the orbi in AP mode. that sorted the teams problem out. Interesting is that this problem also occurred when I used Optus nbn. I do agree teams is the problem, but what I cannot work out is why swapping the orbi for the ISP router fixed it. It seems the ISP router somehow caters for this teams mess when both were configured the same.

I did read that the NBN do 'police' excessive uploads by dropping upload traffic in excess of your plan. it is a terrible service where you pay for 250mb download speed but only get 22mb upload speed, i am sure if they allowed faster upload teams would work as it worked when I was in the US on a fast upload.

I will stick to the orbi being in AP mode for now connected to the ISP router. Maybe teams will be fixed one day but I doubt it.

[michaelkenward]

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@Rnubes wrote:

I do agree teams is the problem, but what I cannot work out is why swapping the orbi for the ISP router fixed it.

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I do not suggest that Teams is the problem so much now that we know that you are throwing two routers into the fray. That wasn't in your first message.

Now we know that you might be another victim of "double NAT".

What might be the issue is how the Teams client and the browser work with they encounter the double-NAT

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It seems the ISP router somehow caters for this teams mess when both were configured the same.

Again, that is not the conclusion I would take from this. That you can get it to work with the Orbi in AP mode suggests that the setup on your network in the cause rather than the behaviour of individual devices.

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@Rnubes wrote:

The only way I can use them both is to use the Telstra modem with the orbi in AP mode. that sorted the teams problem out.

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A more conventional way to deal with this sort of problem is to see if you can put your modem/router into bridge (modem only) mode.

But that depends on what features you want the Orbi to manage.

Disabled Features on the Router when set to AP Mode | Answer | NETGEAR Support

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I did read that the NBN do 'police' excessive uploads by dropping upload traffic in excess of your plan. it is a terrible service where you pay for 250mb download speed but only get 22mb upload speed, i am sure if they allowed faster upload teams would work as it worked when I was in the US on a fast upload.

I can't see how the upload traffic would differ much between the Teams client and the browser version. Again, if you want to take that up with your ISP, you should provide more evidence or they may just put it down to a badly configured network at your end.

When I encounter problems, I usually start with the simplest explanation (the network setup) rather than jump to conclusions about wicked ISPs (and NBN), buggy cloud services (Teams) or crummy hardware (Orbi).

[Rnubes]

thanks for the replies.

I am not using two routers to result in double NAT, if I do use two, I use the ISP router with the Orbi in AP mode (ISP wifi disabled).

The network is configured the same when using Orbi vs ISP router and does not have any complications.

Teams client vs browser traffic I am not sure what is going on here so any experts on team may be able to provide info, the client does have more functionality so assuming it does more caching etc.

It may be a 'simple' fix, but a quick search of other forums indicates this is an extensive issue with many users, who typically solve it using the ISP router or with a non ISP router by shaping the egress traffic.

I am resigned to the fact it is not easily solved and will use the ISP router with the Orbi in AP mode with limits on parental controls which is something I wanted to use.