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Forum Discussion
sleat
Nov 25, 2020Tutor
Problems with CM1150V upstream on Comcast Xfinity
There are a number of past threads (now closed, or I'd be replying to them) about problems people have had with the upstream path on a CM1150V with Comcast Xfinity. I believe I understand the underl...
- Dec 30, 2020
sleat wrote:So it makes sense that the BGA3131 is designed to operate up to 205MHz. However, notice the sentences I've highlighted. In my case, Comcast is running four upstream QAM channels (no upstream OFDM) at frequencies of 173MHz, 273MHz, 303MHz, and 367MHz. So not only are they asking the CM1150V do do something it was never designed to do, they are blatantly violating the DOCSIS 3.1 spec!
sleat I've read this thread multiple times (having my own Upstream Issues!) and took this at face value;
but only just spotted this fundamental error in your analysis ..........
The Comcast Upstream frequencies are not as you indicate, you are a factor of 10 off
i.e. they are 17.3MHz, 27.3MHz, 30.3MHz and 16.7MHz
i.e. 17300000 Hz (5 zeros) = 17,300,000Hz or 17.3MHz
So actually operating well within the DOCSIS 3.1 Spec and well within the design capability of the Chipset.
As I've said I'm having my own Upstream Issues with my CM1150V (and actually got a replacement from Netgear) and there is definitely a problem - but it's not because it's being asked to operate outside its spec.
decosse
Dec 30, 2020Apprentice
sleat wrote:So it makes sense that the BGA3131 is designed to operate up to 205MHz. However, notice the sentences I've highlighted. In my case, Comcast is running four upstream QAM channels (no upstream OFDM) at frequencies of 173MHz, 273MHz, 303MHz, and 367MHz. So not only are they asking the CM1150V do do something it was never designed to do, they are blatantly violating the DOCSIS 3.1 spec!
sleat I've read this thread multiple times (having my own Upstream Issues!) and took this at face value;
but only just spotted this fundamental error in your analysis ..........
The Comcast Upstream frequencies are not as you indicate, you are a factor of 10 off
i.e. they are 17.3MHz, 27.3MHz, 30.3MHz and 16.7MHz
i.e. 17300000 Hz (5 zeros) = 17,300,000Hz or 17.3MHz
So actually operating well within the DOCSIS 3.1 Spec and well within the design capability of the Chipset.
As I've said I'm having my own Upstream Issues with my CM1150V (and actually got a replacement from Netgear) and there is definitely a problem - but it's not because it's being asked to operate outside its spec.
- sleatDec 14, 2022Tutor
In a previous post, two years ago, I presented an analysis of problems with the CM1150V. (https://community.netgear.com/t5/Cable-Modems-Routers/Problems-with-CM1150V-upstream-on-Comcast-Xfinity/m-p/2030739/highlight/true#M29475)
I just returned to that post and saw the reply by decosse pointing out a fundamental error in what I said. That topic is closed, so I can't reply there, hence this.
Yes, I realized the error sometime after making that post, much to my utterly cringeworthy and mortifying embarrassment. It's an object lesson in dyslexia combined with falling prey to the seduction of beautiful but misguided theories. I'll never live that one down, at least in my own mind. Not to excuse my own sloppiness, but I'd argue that Netgear is being more than a little silly in displaying the upstream frequency in Hz, not MHz. I guarantee those last few digits are completely meaningless.
Nevertheless, I'm on my third CM1150V and still having problems with the modem. When the second modem I received exhibited the same problems as the first, I spent hours dealing with Netgear customer support and eventually sent them a long video demonstrating that there was a very sharp temperature threshold below which the upstream amplifier would fail. (This was about 62 degrees F at the surface of the metal shield can over the front end components.) This was sufficient to get them to send me the third modem, even though this was long past the warranty and support period. Of course, the third modem had the same problem. At this point, having other things to do in my life, I just wrapped the modem up in a blanket of bubble-wrap to keep it warm via its own self-heating and moved on.
It's now December and even though I'm in Northern California, it's cold. The room that the modem is in regularly gets down to the low 50's F, and the modem is failing again. I've ordered some replacement NXP BGA3131 upstream amplifier chips, on the chance that there's a bad batch that Netgear got into. Incidentally, that same chip is used in the XB6-T (aka Arris TB3482G) modem that I rented from Comcast for a while during all of this. That modem performed fine, and I think I cooled the amplifier explicitly to test this, though that's a bit lost in the mists of time so I'd have to rent another one and repeat the experiment to be absolutely sure. If that was a valid test, it suggests that either Netgear got some bad (counterfeit?) chips, or their design is somehow abusing the chip. I'll post something here if I do indeed get around to replacing the chip.
BTW, decosse, if you're listening, I apologize for not seeing and responding to your post of 2020-12-15 12:46 PM. To answer your questions if you still care, yes those upstream power numbers look fine, and yes, the most obvious symptom is poor download speeds. There's no easy way to see if your upstream packets are making it back to the head end, but if you're requesting downstream packets and your requests never make it upstream, then of course you won't get your data. This is one of the things that made it so hard to understand early on. The other notable symptom will be a large number of T3 Timeout errors in the log file. However there seems to be a bug in their logging code in that most of the time I see it simply overwrite the last entry rather than accumulating errors, making the whole thing even more confusing.
- FURRYe38Dec 14, 2022Guru - Experienced User
So is this a heat or cooling problem?
Is the modem failing if it gets too cold or hot?
Can you please post a copy and paste of the modems connection status and event log page.
- sleatDec 16, 2022Tutor
The modem fails when the BCM3131 upstream amplifier gets too cold, which is somewhere between 50F and 60F. You can dig through the whole saga in the past posts if you want to know more, just ignore the whole aspect where I went down the rabbit hole regarding Comcast upstream frequencies. That was just a complicated distraction resulting from a simple mistake.
- decosseDec 14, 2022Apprentice
Don't beat yourself up too bad sleat - it's a simple error, that was all too easy to make and you've done a lot of other good analysis to attempt to resolve for yourself and others.
I gave up on the Netgear - never could get to the bottom of what was making them incompatible with my local Comcast service - two modems, same inconsistent issues (would work perfectly for a while and then have issues) I had no issues with the Comcast supplied modem, even with splitters restored and reluctantly just stayed with that.
I believe that there was some marginality over my local service that the Netgear was unable to accommodate, while the Comcast modem could, comfortably.Honestly the whole support saga and general warranty policy has completely soured me of Netgear as a whole and I won't be back. Have moved to Asus for my Router (I did not have any issues with my Netgear Router system - left it behind as part of my whole smart home setup - it's just that warranty/support thing that will preclude me from ever buying another of their products ) and now looking at Arris or Motorola for the modem at this point to save the exorbitant Comcast rental fees. (I'm now in WA, no longer at original address where I had reported on this)