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Virtuoso

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@Case850
Respectfully agree with your disagreement. In this case, my thoughts were that he/she should stay in old fw, as long as it works fine, until another better fw comes along.
I did that with old 1.0.3.54 for a while during the chaotic period earlier this year, keeping my mind keenly aware of issues regarding security, VPN, and others... I took that risk, in the same time coordinating/working with NG (in this particular case R8000) so that they can come up with some better solution (hopefully).
I respect your points of views, and I'm pretty much in line with it... but some times we have to keep balances.
Best
Terry
Message 26 of 49
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Master

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@Case850, @TerryPh,

 

I think NG has caused many of the update/install problems as they've 'quietly' changed what should be done.

 

For instance, my NEW R8000 surprised me by having a STICKER on it (which is next to impossible to get off) stating I should use the NIGHTHAWK app from either the Apple iOS or Andriod store to install the router. Previously it had to be done WIRED, not wireless. Check the QUICK START GUIDE.

 

Next look at the README files for the updates.

 

For V1.0.4.18 (https://kb.netgear.com/000058796/R8000-Firmware-Version-1-0-4-18). Some statements from it:

 

===============

Write down all the settings which you changed from the default values, since you may need to reenter them manually.

.

.

Important Note:

  1. The update process is completed when the on-screen progress bar completes. If power LED light turns amber and is blinking, power cycle the router to complete the upgrade.
  2. If the update progress bar on the web interface does not display correctly during firmware update, you can still check the status using the Power LED.
    The Power LED should be blinking (amber) during firmware update. After the firmware update is done and the system boots up, the LED changes to a steady amber color.
    DO NOT power off or reboot the device during firmware upgrade, it may corrupt the firmware and cause the device not to work.
 ==================
 
It doesn't state ANYWHERE you should reset the router or re-enter the settings manually. Oh, the #1 above, my LED is WHITE when up.
 
Basically, that README has not changed much since the initial release. The LATEST R7000 documentation/readme is identical other than the link info.
 
Now I looked at the R7000 Initial f/w release, https://kb.netgear.com/23795/R7000-Firmware-Version-1-0-0-96, although the same basic wording, this line is on the top missing for other f/w releases:
 
======
Note: Please remember to do factory default after firmware upgrade. Enter "Backup Settings" in the web GUI and click "Erase" button of "Revert to factory default settings". 
======
 
Clearly at some point NG changed what one needed to do?
Message 27 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

Hi

I don't understand this story about factory reset and have to re-input the settings by hand.

Well I can understand that in some specific cases .eg: when settings are dropped in new firmware. But here, all settings in former firmware are still needed in new firmware, so they have their "location".

Out of that, new firmware was not working, but all settings have been returned undamaged with the new firmware.

And third : if it is mandatory and recommended by the manufacturer, it is only necessary ( and easy ) for the manufacturer to add the factory reset in the update procedure.

 

I am open to any argument about this story, but for the moment, and because of lack of factual information, I have no choice but to consider this as an urban legend: a true story that has been taken out of its own context.

 

Message 28 of 49
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Master

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@beer2beer,

 

I wish I had the answer or know when or why this has changed...

 

At one time:

 

  • Updates were ONLY to be done via a wired connection.
  • Install of the router required a wire connection.
  • New firmware required a RESET of router and manual input of settings.

Over time, many user for the last point at least, discovered that resetting and manually re-entering settings wasn't needed. Maybe something to be done if you had a problem.

 

Also, at one point I 'think' *resetting* the router would actually bring you back to the SHIPPED STATE. Now it doesn't it seems. I basically clear 'most' settings, and I've seen cases where the USERID and PASSWORD for the modem was not restored to the default values or those on the bottom label fo the router but kept what the user changed them too. It leaves you with basically a 'clean state' on the present firmware installed.

 

The first 2 bullets above sort  of changed over time. Again, I don't know why, but the 2nd bullet might be the clue. Recently it seems NG has enabled 'automatic update' in its routers. That means the router had to get the flash file down, either zipped and un-zip it or the actual .CHK file and then have you install it all via the router. If you were connected wirelessly and tried to update the router there always was a minute chance the file coming over wirelessly to the router could be corrupted due to a transmission problem. That also ties into the 1st bullet, because many times the router you buy will be back-level, so during the install process the router will check to see if there is an update and offer to install it if there is one. I can only speculate, either NG is quite sure the possibility of a corrupted .CHK file is almost impossible to happen or they 'checksum' the file before installing.

 

All sounds good, but there is also a possibility that NG messed up the README at one point and dropped the reset requirement. Since they are all basically the same other than the router name and the filename and location it is possible that someone removed the requirement from the master template by accident and that requirement has 'disappeared'?

 

All I can tell you is if someone has a problem, the reset and manual re-entry of the settings does fix the problem in some instances.

 

Without looking at the source file it is hard to tell what or why. Probably has more to do with new functions being added and pointers into the data area moving.

 

It isn't 'urban legend' though, at one point it was probably true. What isn't clear is why it had changed over time, and without a specific announcement to reason why? What doesn't make sense in the README is why you'd need to copy down the settings if you'd need them later? Why would that be, it isn't explained is it?

Message 29 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

Well, reading the "readme" ( here : https://kb.netgear.com/000058796/R8000-Firmware-Version-1-0-4-18 ) : NETGEAR recommends the firmware update be performed on a computer with wired connection.

Write down all the settings which you changed from the default values, since you may need to reenter them manually.

turn recommendations into obligations is not a good thing, just like the captain of the Titanic who was ordered to "take the women and children first", and who applied "take the women and children only".Man Embarassed

That's what I told before : You tell us a true story that has been taken out of its own context.

 

You wrote : All I can tell you is if someone has a problem, the reset and manual re-entry of the settings does fix the problem in some instances.

That means that you are sure that this someone got a problem, reboot, still got the same problem,  reset+reentry( EXACTLY the same.. without forgetting anything before, without correcting a former misconfiguration without realizing it ... )  and problem vanished, and reboot and problem still vanished.... Are you sure about all that ? Sorry, but I think this is just impossible. even if you yourself had this problem, it is almost impossible to verify this point outside a scientific approach ( eg : recording every step with a video recorder ).

Message 30 of 49
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Virtuoso

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@Case850, @IrvSp and @beer2bee
Just Woke up.😊😊😊😊😊😊, shortest post from me.
Cheers
Message 31 of 49
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Virtuoso

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@Case850,@IrvSp

No, it does not make sense to me. A forced autoupdate would be ok in a perfect world, when there is absolutely no faulty problems. As a user and owner of a consumer product, I rather have an absolute control on how I use the product, taking responsibility on my own of the consequences.

So, NETGEAR... hear us... at least, and give the consumer the options...

Message 32 of 49
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Apprentice

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

TerryPh:

This is off subject, but I'll ask you anyway. I am staying with 1.0.3.54_1.1.37 (R8000) because I have not read anything from you really endorsing any of the R8000 firmware releases since 1.0.3.54 (although you seemed to be hopeful about this last release). I am "stable" on 1.0.3.54, which means I have DNLA off, the 2.4 radio off (pathetic speeds when on). QoS off, and I deal with the re-boot loss of any USB3 connected HDD. I have too many settings and port forwarding entries, to play around with "try the new firmware - 30/30/30 resets - re-enter everythng manually" - just not worth the aggravation.

I am ready to get another router and use the R8000 as a dumb AP - do you have any information that the R8000's growing list of problems will successfully be addressed?

Thanks.

Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 33 of 49
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Virtuoso

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@grumpa43

At this moment, I do NOT have information whether the growing list of R800's problems will be dealt with successfully  It is, I assume, a grandieux task that NG enginneers tend to take time to digest, figure them out (hopefully) or just simply ignored them. 

I am trying to get to real people from NG new management team to give them the new list of R8000's problems, with tentative, technical "guidance thoughts" to steer them to the right direction. This is only hope that they will try. Still waiting for the management response.

As far as the new firmware 1.0.4.18: Initially I was very skeptic and hopeful, but after about 1 week running it, technically stressing it, I saw nothing improving from previous 1.0.3.54 version, except that there might be security patch for VPNMalware virus, and the update SHA256 in place of MD5 certificate for openVPN feature in the router.

I still have to disable DLNA and Parental Controls (both Circle and open DNS off) with my 2 USB drives attached, and manually configure other protocols in the router to make v1.0.4.18 work.

If I were you, I would update to v1.0.4.18 with wired connection, and check for all parameters to make sure that they are the same as in 1.0.3.54, with DLNA and parental control Circle + open DNS both off, and then soft reboot or just power off/on the router to see if it works and stable. 

You do have option/know how to reverse it back to old faithful version, anyway..

Humbly thanks for asking.

Terry

 

 

Message 34 of 49
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Virtuoso

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

@ChristineT, @Blanca_O
Please see message 43, 44 above
Thanks
Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 35 of 49
Highlighted
Master

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection


@TerryPh wrote:

@Case850,@IrvSp

No, it does not make sense to me. A forced autoupdate would be ok in a perfect world, when there is absolutely no faulty problems. As a user and owner of a consumer product, I rather have an absolute control on how I use the product, taking responsibility on my own of the consequences.

So, NETGEAR... hear us... at least, and give the consumer the options...


But at least on the R8000 this IS an option?

 

==========

Router Auto Firmware Update

Enable router to automatically update to future firmware. This keeps your router up to date with the latest features and security fixes.
Select one of the following options:
Enable       Disable            

============

 

I put mine on DISABLED (not sure what the default is?).

 

The fact that it was put into the Firmware was included in the README for V1.0.4.18...

 

Supports the Auto firmware update feature.

 

Message 36 of 49
Highlighted
Virtuoso

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18. Broke my Internet connection

In Orbi system, that is where the issue of FORCED Autoipdate comes alive.... and that is where I have serious problem with.
Thanks @IrvSp for reminding us that R8000 has autoupdate options.
😉
Message 37 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18

I have had this FW since release and have nothing but issue with it. The internet connection will drop out for ALL wireless connected devices and any NEW wired connections, if the wired connection was there at time of drop it stays. This then forces a manual reboot from either the Genie app on my phone or I have to do it from the hardwired computer. The internal network is fine, it is just the connection to the internet. This issues happens 4-8 times a day and some times with in 15 minutes of a reset it does it. I have called Netgear twice in the last month and thier great fix (After being told by the 2nd rep "I have this router at home and it never has an issue". That is really nice but I am calling because there is an issue and that is not what I want to hear.) was to have me set the wireless channels to 6, 40, and 149. Still having issue. Rolled it back to the FW V1.0.4.12_10.1.46.

Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 38 of 49
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Guide

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18

Yep, same problems and Netgear is a useless company, will never buy another product of theirs. Their firmware has been problematic since last November, for crying out loud. It is about time they got their act together.
Message 39 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18

Maybe an explanation on the reason of this last catastrophic firmware: the XR500 comes with a new firmware that is not developed by Netgear but by netduma. This XR500, powerful as the R7800 may prefigure the abandonment of netgear side firmware. This last firmware could have been updated by disengaged and soon reclassified teams .

Hopefully Netegear will have the courtesy to deploy this partnership and produce the right firmwares for the R8000.

 

Message 40 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18

Here is an update. NO ISSUES SINCE I ROLLED BACK THE FIRMWARE TO THE LAST ONE BEFORE THIS CRAPPY ONE. Now in my scientific opinion that means the latest firmware is crap and causing the issues.
Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 41 of 49
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Master

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18


@Vampyre82nd wrote:
Now in my scientific opinion that means the latest firmware is crap and causing the issues.

Scientific? I doubt it. If anything the evidence is that at worst it doesn't break everyone (obvious opinion Smiley Happy), at best, something is different on your router? Maybe a mix of settings, failed update, some external reason.

 

So just how did you install the update that you had problems with?  Wired or Wifi? Did you do a reset prior or after installing the f/w?

 

When you rolled back, same questions?

 

Since you feel you can rollback and it will work, and since you have it working now, would you try installing the newest f/w again and test?

Message 42 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18

So IrvSp, Let us start with a little back ground.

 

I have had this router for 3 years (the lady from the overseas call center said it was close to 4 years and then tried to sell me tech support, this was after she told me the F/W issue would be fixed by changing the channels of the wireless) in that time period I have not had an issue with it that would require me to have to reset it 4-5 times a day, much less call the idiots at Netgear tech support. Which I am figureing you are a paid employee of Netgear, if you are not then I hope that Netgear gives you a ton of free swag for all the time that you have spent on this forum.

 

My Personal Set up:

The router is plugged in to a battery backup unit (APC Power-Savings Back-UPS Pro 1300) with my modem and personal cloud drive, it is connected to my modem with Cat6 Ethernet cable and my personal cloud drive is also connected to the RT with Cat6 Ethernet cable. I also have an SSD back up drive connected though the USB 3.0 port. My three computers (Custom built gaming Rig, Gaming Server host machine, and Office Tower) are also connected to a battery back up, the same model actually. I then have my old router (Netgear WGR614 v9) connected to this router as an extended access point for my work laptop and my gaming laptop. All of that is connected with Cat6 Ethernet cable that I personally cut and crimpt, then tested to verify, oh and the wireless is off on the WGR614 v9. I then have 23 other devices (phones, tablets, game consoles, tv's, and such) that connect wirelessly to this router. I purchased this RT because I wanted something that I did not have to do a bunch of configuring to, you know, PnP. I mean if I wanted to I could just buy a Cisco RV340W, login to the Cisco IOS and do configurations from the command line. But I wanted a simple to use GUI and a no head ache experience, that up to this point, is exactly what I got.

 

Now to answer your questions.

 

NO I did not, nor have I ever, had to reset the RT to factory settings when doing a F/W update. Not when I updated to the current F/W or when I rolled it back. Let me clarify it for you, I HAVE NEVER DONE A FACTORY RESET ON THIS RT. As I am sure you know the RT does a reboot when you install the F/W and that is the only time that it has been reset prior to the issue that the most current F/W has caused. I do all of my configurations and F/W updates through my HARD WIRED computer.

 

NO I WILL NOT RETEST THE CURRENT F/W ON MY RT!!. I do not want to go back to listening to my family complain about dropped internet connections and all the head ache that it caused me. 

 

I have been a loyal Netgear customer for many, many years. The last 4 RT that I have purchased were Neatgears because Linksys pissed me off. I will be starting to look for a new RT that is not a Netgear product. I am actually looking at a Ubiquiti Network Router Poe Model: ERPoe-5 with a standalone wireless access point.

 

Please do share this with your managment so that they can understand how frustrating it is to deal with a company that does not care about its customers. If I were to push out a peice of software to my customers that caused this many issues my boss would fire me after he made me fix it. I am sorry I forgot to mention that I am a System Administrator/Software Developer for a public organization.

Have a good day!

 

 

Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 43 of 49
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Master

Re: New R8000 F/W released, V1.0.4.18

@Vampyre82nd,

 

No, I do not and never had worked for Netgear nor have and 'connection' to them. I was (retired now) a s/w developer for a large 'computer' company and have worked with PC OS's and TCP/IP. Only true NG employees here have a NG symbol after thier names and usually are more 'moderators' than true Support people you reach via e-mail or phone. I also get NOTHING from NG, but I suspect I do get some respect from them when I contact a moderator (which I have no OFFICIAL channel access to, only the same way you can, a private message or reference within a posting).

 

I too have had and still have working many NG products like you, and also has LinkSys and ASUS routers that had many similar problems like here and because of those problems switched to NG.

 

Our setups are quite similar... down to UPS's which are on ALL PC's and one specifically for the modem, router, and USB drives on the Router. Matter of fact, during the last Hurricane we lost power but the cable company never lost the signal to the modem. Due to the low power draw on those 3 devices I was able to use an iPad for over 6 hours to see what was going on.

 

As @Case850 has shown you via a link, there can be many reasons why you should do a reset. However, I like you had my R7000 for probably over 6 years and have not done many resets as I've gone from F/W to F/W. However, more than once after the F/W was installed had problems and then did the RESET and manually reentered the settings and that fixed it. Once I had to backlevel the F/W, reset and reenter settings and verified all was well. Then loaded the new F/W again and it worked fine. 'Things' happen.

 

A F/W load and its reboot is not the same as erasing NVRAM. You're a programmer right? Think of the NVRAM as holding 2 things... program and its associated data. Some of that data is settings, other data is 'program' data, log area, data to display, etc. Now consider way back when with the initial release a specific line was drawn for where the user settings start. Now the NVRAM has to contain the program, the data, and also an area where the new version can be put when it is installed. Basically the .CHK file is written to an area in NVRAM and then the router's boot loader will copy it (probably unpacking it as it goes) to the program area and then boots. With that in mind, what happed if F/W 'A' which is replaced by F/W 'B' has a different address pointer for a specific setting? Try getting the Open Source code for the F/W and try to figure that out... I didn't investigate that too much though but I did glance at an older version a long time ago. The point is things can change.

 

With that in mind, tell me why you have a problem and someone else doesn't? Simple, the usage of the router and the used settings. No one really knows the 'triggers' that cause problems or if it is a combination of triggers?

 

If you think the 'problem' is Netgear only, I suggest you look at other vendor forums.

 

Oh, I now have an R8000 as my R7000 started to act flakey after a recent f/w update (not immediately). The router would basically 'hang' days apart, and the power light would turn amber. Powering off and on again fixed it for a few days. I tried backleveling, NVRAM erase, everything. It continued. Changed power adapter, still happened. The R7000 had a good run, so I replaced it.

 

You mentioned 'overseas', but since you were out of warrany you probably were not connected to true NG support possibly, but either a company that advertises as NG support on the web or NG's support for those out of warrany. Both of those do charge. They do try to sell you the support. Support in general tries or suggests the easy things first. They usually will work from 'scripts' as well. I'm under support on my R8000 and have an open case with real NG support. Since 3/31/2018 no less with NO resolution. They keep telling me it is Windows that is the problem and I keep going back with real data that shows the problem to be in the firmware. I can't get the security problem through supports heads... they keep coming back and telling me it is a windows problem, but umpteen web pages say that router code must be changed to protect the router... I can't reach support management either to complain. Just a level 1 agent who sends me updates, passes my response to level 2, and I get a new update that is the same as the old one. I can talk to the level 1 agent, but no one else it seems. FRUSTRATING. I wish I worked for NG or had access to a private channel to management, but I do not!

Message 44 of 49
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Aspirant

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18 broke my Internet connection. Naughty...

This is exactly what i am going through right now.  I thought i was hacked by the Russian threat....  I have to reset my router every 2 to 3 hours.  It now has poor range and its weird because some of my devices will be able to connect and whereas some of them will not.  Or all of them will be able to connect and a little time into the connection one of them will loose connection while the others stay connected... for example i will not be able to play a video game online due to loss of connection but netflix will be playing on the other TV just fine.  Or everything can connect to the internet but my phone no matter what i do and the only thing that can be done is a soft reset.... then its on to limited conncection time.  I am really frustrated this router initially had very good range and it was very quick I had absolutely zero problems with connection or connection drops before this latest update. (Current update now availabe July 30 2018.)  It's even more confusing when i cannot play xbox live hardwired in the front room all of a sudden but my son can play it wirelessly in his bedroom but i can get on the PS4 and play just fine online.  The only thing that I have not tried is a factory reset but from what I have seen and been told is that you do not have to do that.

 

Can anyone help me out is this going on with other peoples R8000 and will there be a fix for what we are going through?

 

Are they going to fix this problem.

Message 45 of 49
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Master

Re: R8000 F/W V1.0.4.18 broke my Internet connection. Naughty...

2 suggestions.

 

If still under warranty, contact NG Support.

 

Try going back one level of firmware and see if that fixes it.

Message 46 of 49
Highlighted
Tutor

What is the Latest Stable R8000 F/W

Hey guys I am still running 1.0.3.54. and it has been very stable. I upgraded to 1.0.4.4 but I got the disconnection issue that everyone was experiencing so I downgraded and has been good since.

 

I would like to try an upgrade once more and based on the forum posts I have read 1.0.4.18 is bad as well.

 

Could you guys confirm that 1.0.4.12 is the latest stable release for the R8000?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 47 of 49
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Master

Re: What is the Latest Stable R8000 F/W


@lesko wrote:

 

I would like to try an upgrade once more and based on the forum posts I have read 1.0.4.18 is bad as well.

 

References for the above please?

 

I've been on 1.0.4.18 for a long time without disconnects.

 

More than likely the problem is either other settings, your type of connection, or you need to reset and re-apply manually settings.

Message 48 of 49
Highlighted
Virtuoso

Re: What is the Latest Stable R8000 F/W

@lesko

I havew been running version 1.0.4.18 for as long as I remember and there was/is no problem with it. Of course, version 1.0.3.54 is still the best as far as stability, but newest one proves to be stable as well.

Problem may present  most likely if QoS is on, but even it is on, it will not disconnect the internet on daily basis. probably every 2-3 weeks, hypthetically speaking.

Give it a try.

Best

Model: R8000|Nighthawk X6 AC3200 Smart WIFI Router
Message 49 of 49
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