ORBI blocks iPhone updates which work fine on non-ORBI Wifi, same cable connection

[rjd185]

RBR10 and 2xRBS10 setup (model numbers that no longer appear on the drop down list above although this package is less than one month installed). Summary of the issue here is that iPhones cannot update when connected to the Orbi mesh but connected to another WiFi network on the same network, all works OK.

The RBR10 takes the Ethernet cable from a BT Home Hub. The BT Home Hub is still offering a WiFi network (call it WifiBT), while the Orbi mesh is offering another WiFi network (call it WifiOrbi).

We have multiple iPhones in the house and they all show the same behaviour - the iPhone when connected to the network WiFiOrbi reports an error when trying to update the iOS version ('Unable to check for update' with message 'An error occurred while checking for an update' with option to Cancel or Try Again - trying again gives the same result). However, switch the iPhone to use the network WifiBT and the operation works flawlessly first time. Also once the iPhones are updated and no longer need the update, then the iPhone will report 'No update needed' on either network.

Connected to WifiOrbi, all other Internet access seems OK (speeds are 40Mbps down/10Mbps up, which is correct; browsing and services like YouTube or iPlayer all streaming fine; etc). Same if using the WifiBT connection as well.

The Orbi app shows no blocked URLs nor as far as I could see any other indication of blocking connections. But the iPhones were all prevented from updating iOS (14.1/2 to 14.3) while going through the Orbi mesh network. Turning off all the Orbi components and restarting the entire mesh produced the same results. Armor is on but not indicating anything. Internet port is correctly indicating the BT Home Hub (external IP, subnet mask, gateway and DNS address). RBR10 firmware is v2.3.6.18 and the RBR10 device appears correctly on the BT Home Hub as Ethernet off port 2 (so it is connected in the right place).

The ORBI app does say that internet is 'Offline' while at the same time being able to perform a speed test and get the correct results for Internet connectivity as well as allowing all regular Internet access to WifiOrbi connected devices. No indication why.

Since the BT WiFi and Orbi WiFi both feed off the same cable connection, the iPhone updating properly on the BT WiFi demonstrate that this isn't a problem with connectivity to the Apple servers from the house.

So everything looks good apart from Wifi through ORBI is compromised to Apple iOS updates. Any suggestions on how to determine what the Orbi mesh was doing, or how to rule it out as a cause, and if it is the ORBI mesh, options on how to diagnose/control that behaviour/suppress it?

[CrimpOn]

This is a tough one, given that it may be months before the next iPhone software update. Hard to do experiments when the situation cannot be replicated.

One suggestion: The setup as described appears to be two routers in series, which is often described as a "Double NAT" condition:

https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT  Thousands of customers have two routers and lead happy lives.  There are specific situations, however, where two routers make applications impossible: things like port forwarding, VPN, and some types of gaming.

The two most often recommended ways to eliminate the "Double NAT" are:

• Put the ISP device into "bridge" or "passthrough" mode, which will also disable its WiFi, or
• Put the Orbi into Access Point (AP) mode. 
  Most people choose to disable the ISP WiFi in order to reduce congestion in the house.
  Alas, switching the Orbi to AP mode can be done only from the Orbi web interface, not the app.
  And, switching to AP mode disabled many features on the Orbi.
  https://kb.netgear.com/000061277/Disabled-Features-on-the-Orbi-when-set-to-AP-Mode 

Basically, I have no idea what caused this to happen. If the Orbi is put into AP mode then the next iPhone software update will be a good test and the BT WiFi an always be restored to make the update.

[rjd185]

I hadn’t considered the double NAT (we have 192.168.2.x and 10.0.0.x) - good thought. I will see how I can remove that as a possible cause - we have one more iPhone still needing the update and I can switch off the BT WiFi. I’ll reply here again if it helps. Thanks.

[FURRYe38]

1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop