Reply

AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

ycchang
Aspirant

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

*sigh*

The latest message I got from the support team (before my ticket closed) is
"This is noted"

All the reviews and advertisements said that like it's big brother, the AX4200 came with the 2400Mbps backhual. Just out of curiosity. Does anyone actually open their RBR750/RBS750 and confirm that both have the correct antenna configuration to deliver 2400 Mbps backhual?
Message 26 of 85
campolo313
Apprentice

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

I haven't been letting them close my ticket, but I am getting incredibly frustrated.  I paid a lot of money for this product and the responses I have received are not giving me much confidence.  The one I got before the last one said "as long as its not affecting your network sir it should be fine."

I'm not going to risk popping it open, but it's either not able to reach backhaul speeds as advertised or there's an issue with the firmware preventing it, and the lack of willingness to look into it doesn't give me much hope on this item.  Sadly, I'm out of my return window, but my next step will be asking for a RMA.

Message 27 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

I'll see if I can get some information on this... 

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 28 of 85
doghound
Star

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

My last ticket the support rep sent me a bunch of information on MTU packet sizes and then closed my ticket. The "as long as its not affecting your network sir it should be fine" sentiment is the frustrating part because I know my needs rely on having that backhaul performing at the speed on the tech sheet. Sure, my devices can get the full speeds from my ISP, but I also have a lot of internal-only network devices using the backhaul that never use my internet connection.

 

My final test is going to be using iperf3 to max out the backhaul between two devices. It is going to take a lot to setup as I'll need to powerup my two desktops, my NAS, and a hardwired laptop. Two wired connections on satellite, two wired connection on router, and see what speeds I get. If I get around 1900Mbps, then I'll be happy. If I don't, I will be returning these devices. Sadly.

Message 29 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

First off we should establish that the 2400Mpbs connection rate is seen with 1 RBS place near and in line of site with the RBR. Say 10 feet or so. If the rate is NOT seen with the RBR and RBS, then testing iPerf will problaby not change this. I believe the connection rate should be 2400Mpbs if idea conditions are met and placeing the RBS near the RBR at 10-15 feet line of site should tell us if this is happening or not. 

 

IPerf doesn't take too much to get setup...You don't need a NAS, just two PCs will work too...

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 30 of 85
doghound
Star

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

Yes, I have done that. I put the router and satellite (turned off the 3rd satellite) right next to each other. I reset them and still the router only reported 1201M in the statistics for the WLAN backhaul. See attached image.

 

The reason for so many wired devices when running the iperf test is because I need 2 iperf streams running. Two wired devices will max out the 1Gbps wired connection before they max out the supposed 2400Mbps backhaul. Four wired devices will be able to send 2Gbps over two wired connection (1Gbps each). Wired devices capable of running iperf are limited to the 2 desktops, a laptop, and the NAS.

 

The setup:

* Two wired devices into a satellite

* Two wired devices into the router

* Start 1st iperf test between two wired devices. Expected result: around 950Mbps. This would also be right around max for a 1201Mbps WLAN backhaul.

* Start 2nd iperf test between the other two devices to stress the backhaul further. Expected results: around 950Mbps (limits of a wired connection).

* Expected result with both running: around 1700-1900Mbps total transfer speeds.

Message 31 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

Ok well since you have proved that the connection rate isn't 2400Mpbs while in line of site, theres no need to do much more until NG looks more into this and gets the backhaul connection rate to where its supposed to be. 

Orbi AX4200 Router and AX4200 Satellite
(600 + 1200 + 2400Mbps)

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 32 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

I just checked my two wireless RBS 850s and the connection rate is 2400Mbps:


RBSConnRates.png

 

So I presume there is a problem on the 7 series...Smiley Embarassed

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 33 of 85
Mikey94025
Mentor

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps


@FURRYe38 wrote:

I just checked my two wireless RBS 850s and the connection rate is 2400Mbps:


RBSConnRates.png

 

So I presume there is a problem on the 7 series...Smiley Embarassed


My RBS850 shows the same stat values for 2.4G, 5G, and WLAN backhaul as yours.  Interesting that the OP's screen shot shows half our RBS850 numbers for all 3 stats.  Maybe the display is just wrong?

Message 34 of 85
doghound
Star

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

The 7 series is:

2.4Ghz - 600Mbps

5Ghz - 1200Mbps

5ghz Backhaul - 2400Mbps

 

So, the 7 series is reporting everything right except for the backhaul speeds (showing 1201M).

Message 35 of 85
doghound
Star

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

I am starting to wonder if the backhaul is being limited by the device-side wifi. Just a thought that crossed my mind while pocking around in the web admin portal. Does anyone think that is possible. Notice how it says the wifi 5Ghz is in 1201 Mbps mode... I cannot find a place to change that anywhere.

Message 36 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

Spec sheet reports the wireless back haul is supposed to be 2400Mpbs like the 8 series so we presume this could be seen between the RBR and RBS connection. 

 

 

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 37 of 85
Mstrbig
Master

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

Today I decided to run a test of the backhaul between an RBR750 and RBS750. I set them up 10 feet apart and the backhaul connection shows 1201M. However wth that said, it is a known fact that the GUI and app report false results.

Orbi RBK53 System/RBR50/RBS50/RBS50. + Orbi Voice RBS40V
RBK753 system/RBR750/RBS750/RBS750 + RBK853 System/RBR850/RBS850/RBS850
SXK80 — Orbi Pro AX6000 WiFi 6 Tri-Band WiFi System
There's always a logical answer, if you have all the facts!
Message 38 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

Thank you for confirming this as well. Seems like there is an issue that NG needs to fix. 


@Mstrbig wrote:

Today I decided to run a test of the backhaul between an RBR750 and RBS750. I set them up 10 feet apart and the backhaul connection shows 1201M. However wth that said, it is a known fact that the GUI and app report false results.


 

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 39 of 85
campolo313
Apprentice

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

My case has remained open, but I haven't received a response back in nearly a month despite me replying near weekly.  I am not really sure what else to do.

Message 40 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

Can only wait is all. Won't happen over nite. Glad it's still open. 

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 41 of 85
campolo313
Apprentice

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

 


@FURRYe38 wrote:

Can only wait is all. Won't happen over nite. Glad it's still open. 


My concern is that I haven't even received a "we are still looking into it response", most of the responses I've received have been "well the system is working, it doesn't matter you're not getting full speeds."

Message 42 of 85
schumaku
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps


@Mstrbig wrote:

Today I decided to run a test of the backhaul between an RBR750 and RBS750. I set them up 10 feet apart and the backhaul connection shows 1201M. 


Reads like they crippled both the fronthaul (by the lower cost specs for the special sales channels) and the backhaul from 4x4 to 2x2 (both operating at 80 MHz bandwith) - probably on the driver level - by error.

 

 

 

 

Message 43 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

I know. NG isn't great on letting us know status. Just have to keep on them. 


@campolo313 wrote:

 


@FURRYe38 wrote:

Can only wait is all. Won't happen over nite. Glad it's still open. 


My concern is that I haven't even received a "we are still looking into it response", most of the responses I've received have been "well the system is working, it doesn't matter you're not getting full speeds."


 

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 44 of 85
Mstrbig
Master

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps


@schumaku wrote:

@Mstrbig wrote:

Today I decided to run a test of the backhaul between an RBR750 and RBS750. I set them up 10 feet apart and the backhaul connection shows 1201M. 


Reads like they crippled both the fronthaul (by the lower cost specs for the special sales channels) and the backhaul from 4x4 to 2x2 (both operating at 80 MHz bandwith) - probably on the driver level - by error.

 


I was also thinking specifications typo, since the specs from the 750 should not be the same as the 850, or no one would purchase the 850.

That's why I went with the 750, because the specs were close. I think the 2400Mbps(5GHz) is the typo.

750 specs Tri-band Wi-Fi 6 AX4000: 2400Mbps (5GHz) + 1200Mbps (5GHz)+ 600Mbps (2.4GHz)

850 specs Tri-band 4x4 Wi-Fi 6 AX6000: 2400Mbps (5GHz) + 2400Mbps (5GHz)+ 1200Mbps (2.4GHz)

Orbi RBK53 System/RBR50/RBS50/RBS50. + Orbi Voice RBS40V
RBK753 system/RBR750/RBS750/RBS750 + RBK853 System/RBR850/RBS850/RBS850
SXK80 — Orbi Pro AX6000 WiFi 6 Tri-Band WiFi System
There's always a logical answer, if you have all the facts!
Message 45 of 85
FURRYe38
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

It's possible, however, I would think and feel that NG may want to keep the same backhaul connection rates between the models. I guess depending upon what marketing and engineering wanted to do. The HW is the same, sans the chip set model # is just one number less between the 2 models. I've seen this before with NGs XR gaming series routers 450 and 500. There both same hareware wise, sans the only difference is the 2.4Ghz connection rates. 600 vs 800 on 2.4Ghz. Thus only a $100 difference for 200Mpbs. Smiley Surprised

 

Hopefully NG will let us know what the issue is if it's a typo or otherwise. IF the spec sheets are wrong then would be kind of mis-leading. Hope not. Smiley Embarassed

My Setup Internet Cable 1000↓/50↑ CAX80 Mode Mode | ISP SparkLight | Wifi Router Orbi CBR752 v4.6.7.7(Gateway Mode), Wired BackhaulSwitches Netgear GS105/8 | 

Additional NG HW: C7800/CM1100/CM1200/CM2000, Orbi CBK40, CBR750, RBK953(v6.0.3.68) & XR450(v130), RBK853 v4.6.7.5(AP) & RBK752 v4.6.7.5, RBK50(v23), SXK30(v110), R7000(v34), R7800(v84), R7960P(v84), RAXE500(v78), EX7500/EX7700, GS308v3 and WNHDE111


 


 


Testing

Message 46 of 85
campolo313
Apprentice

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps


@Mstrbig wrote:

@schumaku wrote:

@Mstrbig wrote:

Today I decided to run a test of the backhaul between an RBR750 and RBS750. I set them up 10 feet apart and the backhaul connection shows 1201M. 


Reads like they crippled both the fronthaul (by the lower cost specs for the special sales channels) and the backhaul from 4x4 to 2x2 (both operating at 80 MHz bandwith) - probably on the driver level - by error.

 


I was also thinking specifications typo, since the specs from the 750 should not be the same as the 850, or no one would purchase the 850.

That's why I went with the 750, because the specs were close. I think the 2400Mbps(5GHz) is the typo.

750 specs Tri-band Wi-Fi 6 AX4000: 2400Mbps (5GHz) + 1200Mbps (5GHz)+ 600Mbps (2.4GHz)

850 specs Tri-band 4x4 Wi-Fi 6 AX6000: 2400Mbps (5GHz) + 2400Mbps (5GHz)+ 1200Mbps (2.4GHz)


I don't think it's a typo, the backhaul has historically been faster than the client side band.

If you look at the RBK753 Specs vs the RBK53 Specs, RBK753 is basically the same just with WiFi 6 Speeds


AC3000 Tri-Band WiFi : (1,733+866+400Mbps)

AX4200 Tri-Band WiFi : 2.4GHz (600Mbps) + 5GHz (1200Mbps) for WiFi devices to connect to the Internet. 5GHz (2400Mbps) dedicated WiFi link for faster data connections between Orbi Router and Orbi Satellite

Message 47 of 85
Mstrbig
Master

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps

I heard back from Netgear Support regarding this topic. I tried to post their verbatum  explanation 3 times now. But it appears a Moderator keeps removing the post. So this is my interpretation:

The AX4200 is a combined throughput when you have 1 router 600Mbps 1200Mbps, 1 Satellite 1200Mbps, 1 Satellite 1200Mbps. The 2400Mbps backhaul is derived from the 2 combined satellites connecting to the router giving 1200Mbps+1200Mbps connection.

Orbi RBK53 System/RBR50/RBS50/RBS50. + Orbi Voice RBS40V
RBK753 system/RBR750/RBS750/RBS750 + RBK853 System/RBR850/RBS850/RBS850
SXK80 — Orbi Pro AX6000 WiFi 6 Tri-Band WiFi System
There's always a logical answer, if you have all the facts!
Message 48 of 85
campolo313
Apprentice

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps


@Mstrbig wrote:

I heard back from Netgear Support regarding this topic. I tried to post their verbatum  explanation 3 times now. But it appears a Moderator keeps removing the post. So this is my interpretation:

The AX4200 is a combined throughput when you have 1 router 600Mbps 1200Mbps, 1 Satellite 1200Mbps, 1 Satellite 1200Mbps. The 2400Mbps backhaul is derived from the 2 combined satellites connecting to the router giving 1200Mbps+1200Mbps connection.


With all due respect to whoever told you that, that is completely and utterly false.


System speed has never been based around the number of satellites, the system itself is tri-band and the "speed" is adding the band speeds together.

2.4 GHz Fronthaul - 600Mbps
5 GHz Fronthaul - 1200Mbps
5 GHz Backhaul - 2400Mbps

That's why you'll see every single Orbi RBK75X System labeled as AX4200, same with RBK85X being AX6000 with variants of each ranging between 2-4 satellites.

There's only a couple possibilities here, either it is a bug (firmware or Router GUI) or the system's specs are incorrect.

Message 49 of 85
schumaku
Guru

Re: AX4200 (rbs750) backhaul only works at 1200Mbps


@Mstrbig wrote:

The AX4200 is a combined throughput when you have 1 router 600Mbps 1200Mbps, 1 Satellite 1200Mbps, 1 Satellite 1200Mbps. The 2400Mbps backhaul is derived from the 2 combined satellites connecting to the router giving 1200Mbps+1200Mbps connection.


Hmmmm, interesting interpretation - the specs for the router and the satellite show something completely different - reads to me some Netgear support entity with no much tech insight has tried to explain that the wireless backhaul is sufficient for two satellites.

Borrowed from the Router + 1 Satellite Tech Specs (https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/mesh/rbk752 -> Specs -> Technical Specs :

 

  • Router: AX4200 Tri-Band WiFi : 2.4GHz (600Mbps†) + 5GHz (1200Mbps†) for WiFi devices to connect to the Internet. 5GHz (2400Mbps†) dedicated WiFi link for faster data connections between Orbi Router and Orbi Satellite
  • Satellite: AX4200 Tri-Band WiFi : 2.4GHz (600Mbps†) + 5GHz (1200Mbps†) for WiFi devices to connect to the Internet. 5GHz (2400Mbps†) dedicated WiFi link for faster data connections between Orbi Router and Orbi Satellite

 

So this isn't an AX4200 kit - much more a AX3000 in this case? 

 

But hey, already the "... for WiFi devices to connect to the Internet." is an odd marketing explanation for the max PHY link speed of the fronthaul. Iterating this a litle bit more, 600+1200 would be more than what the backhaul can handle if the interpretation from above should be true. 

----

 

Now some fun: This screenshot does show the confusion and errors which obviously exist in Netgear and on the (new?) Web site - RBK853 -> Specs -> Tech Data -> Satellite   ... LOMA ... who can spot all errors?

 

RBK853 Satellite Tech Specs.PNG

 

Does Netgear proof-read specs before publishing? The interesting part - the same RBS850 specas are falsely duplicated insted of re-used.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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