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Confused by legacy network extenders still connecting
hi would appreciate some advice
I am UK based, with vodafone fibre 500 connection.
Recently purchased orbi 370 with 1 base unit and 2 satalites to replace the vodafone default router and vodafone extender
With the default set up my SSID was vodafoneXXXXXX and for devices connected to the extender it was the same vodafoneXXXXXX_EXT (with the _EXT being additional). It was a true extender and not a mesh system as i had to manually set devices to either the main router or the extender (albeit they shared the same password).
Vodafone also offer 5G back and the SSID vodafoneXXXXXXX_5GEXT also used to appear on my selectable networks albeit i never connected anything to it
So this weekend i installed by new Orbi 370 set up, using the wizard on the app. All pretty straightforward i followed the instructions and used the previous vodafone SSID and password to save having to reset all my devices. Everything went seamlessly the only tricky items were 2X desktop PC's which detected the change somehow and i just had to re-enter the password to rejoin.
Now what is really strange is that despite the old vodafone router and extender being unplugged and in a cupboard the SSID's vodafoneXXXXXX_EXT and vodafoneXXXXX_5GEXT are still appearing on the networks list as joinable on multiple devices (computers, phones, consoles etc.)
Stranger still is that many devices are default connecting to _EXT despite this extender not being there..... and even more strange is that when i force devices off _EXT and onto the 'main' network they keep disconnecting. This computer I am typing on now connected by default to _EXT this morning. I forced it to forget the _EXT network and join the vodafoneXXXXX network which is does for a bit but then drops connection and asks for the password again. After multiple attempts to join vodafoneXXXXXX I have given up now and reconnected to vodafoneXXXXXX_EXT and the connection is solid. So bizarre
Interestingly when the PC is connected to vodafoneXXXXXX it is at 5GHz, when connected to vodafoneXXXXXX_EXT it is at 2.4Ghz
Other than this strange issue with the computer needing to be connected to _EXT everything seems to be working OK its just bizarre that the _EXT network is still visible and connectable
Can anyone explain what is going on?
41 Replies
oh i should have clarified the old vodafone router is completely disconnected - i have unplugged and removed it completely. The Orbi base unit is plugged directly into the openreach fibre modem
Did you perhaps set up the guest and iot network to use these _EXT SSIDs???
no didn't set that up at all. There is no guest wifi set up
I am tempted to re-do set up and call my network something complete different then manually re-add everything
no didn't set that up at all. There is no guest wifi set up
Start by turning off the Orbi (both the router and the satellites), and see if those networks disappear.
This is what my iPhone is showing ; it’s connected correctly
sky is a neighbour
the netgear is the router default I didn’t set up
the 2 not connected Vodafone’s are the old ones with no infrastructure remaining. I’ve told my phone to forget both
my computer connects to Vodafone xxxxxx_ext and won’t work connected to the correct one
Many of the WiFi Analyzer apps will show the hardware address of each WiFi access point. The Vodophone router and extender should have their hardware address printed on the label.
Would be interesting to see if this mysterious WiFi access point matches either of the Vodophone units. (and if the one of the many web sites indicates that the OUI (Organizational Unique ID - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organizationally_unique_identifier) belongs to Vodophone.
such as: https://www.wireshark.org/tools/oui-lookup.html
Another thought is to open a WiFi Analyzer app and walk around the house observing the signal strength of this mysterious access point. Eventually, the signal strength should "max out" when your phone gets very close to it. For example, I have one router and three satellites in my house, currently showing signal strength of:
- -22 (the one I am sitting 4' from)
- -57
- -59
- -66
my main router IP is 10.168.168.1 (vodafone3FF4F9)
satallite 1 is 10.168.168.64
satallite 2 is 10.168.168.109
my computer claims to be connected to Vodafone3FF4F9_EXT IP gateway 10.168.168.1 (its IP address is 10.168.168.84)
On the network map on the orbi app it is showing connected to the main router (rather than the satallite which is a few feet away)
Another thought is to open a WiFi Analyzer app and walk around the house observing the signal strength of this mysterious access point.
You can use the free airport utility from apple for this (enabling wifi scan in the app settings after you install it, and then relaunching it).
is it possible the Orbi got itself in a mess and somehow created multiple networks rather than just 1?
The puzzle here is that you are seeing the two vodofone _EXT networks when the Orbi router and satellites are turned off. So it can't be the Orbi (unless you forgot to turn one of the elements off when you tried that).
But it must be something paired with the Orbi, since it is using the 10.168.168.x subnet.
Try the analyzer test with the Orbi turned off.
thanks for help. Its so strange.
Right i got naffed off with the issue so turned everything off for an hour; the ONT, the router the satallites etc. I then used a paperclick to do a factory reset on the router and 2 satallites. Also deleted the orbi app. All the vodafone networks disappeared from devices, and i could still see the neighbours.
Turned the ONT modem only back on - let it boot up then checked wifi on devices - no vodafone, still only the neighbours showing.
I did a fresh install of the Orbi kit, but this time left it with the default Orbi SSID and password etc.
All went well. I have just been going round the house manually setting up the wifi on everything with the 'new' Orbi SSID and password - everything has connected without issue
This PC I am typing on is now 'properly' connected to ORBI36
hi all any further thoughts on this? I can still see _EXT and _5GEXT on every device as selectable networks. 100% it is the Orbi boradcasting these but why? The whole point of a mesh system is one SSID seamlessly managed by multiple satalites.... it causing me to think the network is not set up properly or optimised with these showing.
_EXT and _5GEXT does NOT come from Orbi systems. NGs EX and EAX series extenders have these extensions when setting up those extenders.
Might see these if someone configured the SSID name maybe on the Orbi system. However by default, those are not seen from Orbi systems.
Might need to factory reset the Orbi system and setup from scratch. Be sure to Turn OFF all ISP wifi radios on there equipement prior to starting the reset on the Orbi system.
i all any further thoughts on this? I can still see _EXT and _5GEXT
As FURRYe38 says, Orbi systems do not normally use these network names, so this is a puzzle. Part of the puzzle is that you said that you are still seeing these names even when the Orbi elements are all turned off. Is that still the case?
Did you try CrimpOn's wifi analyzer test? It'd be useful to confirm the location of whatever device is broadcasting these networks.
Hi sry if I’ve not been clear in updates. When I turned everything off all the networks eventually disappeared
I then turned just the open reach modem back on and left it 30mins - no networks appeared
I factory reset the Orbi router and satellites . Deleted the app. Reinstalled and did a fresh set up of the Orbi kit using the default Orbi settings for ssid and password
it is 100% the Orbi producing these networks
it is also producing a NTGRBH…… network
as far as I can tell all the networks are coming from the router and the satellites
It would be very helpful to know the hardware address of the WiFi access points that are broadcasting these WiFi SSIDs.
My tactic would be to install WiFi Info View (free for Winows at https://www.nirsoft.net/utils/wifi_information_view.html)
This app will produce a list of WiFi access points currently broadcasting and display the hardware MAC address of each. If the ORBI36*** networks are being broadcast by the 371 router and 370 satellite, they will have the same hardware MAC address as the ORBI36 network.
p.s. NTGRBH_E0C2501FC5E4 is the "backhaul" WiFi network between 371 router and 370 satellite. In previous Orbi models, Netgear engineers did not broadcast the SSID of this network. (There being no point because users cannot possibly connect to it because they do not know the long, complicated password.) For some reason known only to (probably nobody) the engineers chose to broadcast the SSID of this backhaul network on the newest products and thus (a) confuse customers, (b) annoy customers, and (c) ignore countless pleas on the Community Forum to "turn off the damn SSID on the backhaul."
Thanks - I’m not able download stuff on pc as it’s a work computer and they’ve locked it down. I tried various iOS apps but can’t seem to find one that gives the MAC address of each access point
sry for my lack of expertise but can you advise an iOS app that is suitable and exactly what I’m looking for
thanks
I tried various iOS apps but can’t seem to find one that gives the MAC address of each access point
As I recommended before, you can use Apple's Airport Utility for this. Go into Apple Settings->apps->airport utility and turn on "Wi-Fi Scanner" before you run it.
There will be some nuisance screens as it looks for Apple Airport products you don't have, but once you get through those you'll see a Wi-Fi Scan option at the top right of the app screen. That will give you the signal strength, mac addresses, and network names of all the networks it finds.
It'd be helpful to know if these networks are coming from all three Orbi elements, or just some. The signal strength (RSSI) and mac addresses can help you figure this out.
WiFiman gives me this if that helps ?
I have Ubiquiti WiFiMan installed on an Android phone. Rather than "Discovery", I selected "Scan" which provides a list of WiFi access points, and shows the MAC address of each.
Just realised you can get the MAC addresses in the Orbi app itself
satellite 2 is E0:C2:50:21:54:46
Satellite 1 is E0:C2:50:20:A0:A2
router is E0:C2:50:1F:C5:E0
does this help ?
Yes, the goal is to compare those hardware MAC addresses with the WiFi access points which are broadcasting those "EXT" WiFi networks.
For example, when the system has a Guest or IoT WiFi network defined, the access points will broadcast those WiFi SSIDs as well, and they will come from the same MAC address as the primary WiFi network. If the new ORBI36 device is broadaasting the "EXT" and "5GEXT" WiFi networks, all of these networks will come from the same hardware address.
If they come from wildly different addresses, that supports the concept that they are coming from a different hardware device.
Hi this is what WiFi scanner shows
the MAC address for _ext and _5gext are the same but don’t match any of the orbi macs
they also don’t match the macs of anything else on my network
Tell a lie using device manager on the Orbi app I’ve found 2x tenda devices each with the matching mac code
these are not separate physical devices I promise there is nothing physical in my house I am not aware of
these are somehow integral in the satellites
i
