Readynas 102 not backing up and freezing after upgrade to 6.4.2

As a slight diversion but still related, I am now having a nightmare backing up the Nas back across the network to a PC with a 3tb USB WD drive connected to it.

I am using Cobian backup to just copy across everything in the main Artwork / docs folder on the nas.  It appears to be copying files but is throwing up thousands of errors as it backs up saying "system cannot find the path specified" and it shows a filename which does not appear to exist on the nas.  Its like its trying to backup stuff thats no longer there.  Could it be trying to backup snapshot files or deleted files?

I am at my wits end with this now, its cost me an absolute fortune in unbillable hours and time.

All I want to do is backup the blooming thing.  Any suggestions?

Hi

As I said earlier, there I was thinking that I had problems.

I am no expert and I would hope someone who is would offer you help. But here are my thoughts.

Create a simple folder on your NAS called something like Test_01 containing some information that doesn't matter if lost or corrupted.

In fact what I usually do is copy say a few 100mb up to 1gb into this test folder. 

I am using a drive formatted to NTFS by the way. 

Do a file check on the folder to be backed up, so find out the total number of folders and files. Also the total size.

Then perform a test backup. This will be quicker to deal with and give you better more verifiable results.

I did this before attempting a complete data backup to quickly check all was well

Not much help, sorry. You seem to be having more issues than me.

As a matter of interest what not try something even simpler, create a shortcut to the NAS on your desktop. Open the attached WD drive. Go to the NAS, navigate to this test folder and drag and copy the test folder to the WD drive. See if this simple procedure works. If it does it's something to do with your 3rd party backup software.

John

You know like you I am spending hours on this, this being a £120 NAS. I'm wondering about scrapping the NAS, cutting my losses, save wasting time and buying a WD NAS.

Thanks John but I did all that before I left site and drove 250 miles home.

Test folder worked fine, drag and drop worked fine so I scheduled the backup to backup the entire main folder at 7:35pm when everyone had gone home and I would be back in Yorkshire so I could keep an eye on it.  I remotely stopped the backup and fiddled with it, set it off again and its still throwing up the same errors but the WD drive is filling up with what looks like the right files.

I have to do this out of hours as it slows the nas and network right down.  Ill look at it again in the morning before anyone gets in.

Hi

I wonder if irrespective of all the errors, as long as you have a good backup, then perhaps this will have to be the work around?

When I started to have problems I did manual backups and while it was annoying at least it did work.

I never tried a third party software to do it for me but why that should be an issue is a puzzle.

On the other thread I referred to last night I have had a reply from a moderator. Apparently this is all my fault. Netgear last year told me that in order to deal with my fault I would have to take out a service contract......costing around £100 for a device which cost me £120 and to deal with a fault caused by their faulty firmware. It seems because I flatly refused to do this arguing that this was a fault caused by their recommended firmware being installed on a 102 which still had 18 months of warranty then this is why they haven't dealt with my problem. I'll copy and past the comment here for all to read. I hope people take note as to how they treat us.

This is the comment made to me last night on the other thread - have a read people and see what faces us when we get problems not of our making.

mdgm (NETGEAR Moderator) posted a new comment in Using your ReadyNAS on 2016-03-09 12:15 AM :

Re: Readynas 102 extremely slow after update to 6.4.1

Whilst you and some others are experiencing issues for most things are working well in 6.4.2.

YorkBoy you chose not to purchase the support needed for your case (around a £100 folks for a NAS under warranty), then our agent handling the case was informed by a higher tier that there were some changes in 6.4.2 likely to help and you decided you'd rather not try a beta firmware release (too right I did, 6.4.0 had already riuned my drive and they wanted me to try a beta firmware......why should we be test pilots for their faulty firmware?) which delayed things further as we were unable to find out whether 6.4.2 resolved your problem or not till after you updated to it.

We now have an agent looking into your system who will also try to reproduce the problem you are facing. We have a fix for some UI problems whilst USB backup jobs are in progress in 6.5.0 which we expect to enter beta soon.

BarryD

You will be interested that tonight I have had contact from Netgear and they amongst other things have said this:-

1. I ran a few tests with 2 RN102 from our lab: one on 6.2.5, the another on 6.4.2

2. I copied the exact same data to both of them : 15GB (total) - a mix of big and small files

3. I ran backup jobs on both NASes (full backup of the data volume) using the same USB 3.0 stick, NTFS formated and plugged to the rear ports

4. There was a noticeable difference between the 2 backup jobs: it took over 2 hours on 6.4.2 and around 40 minutes for the one on 6.2.5

So finally we have positive confirmation that they are seeing issues with USB backups following this firmware update.

We're not there, but at least this confirms it's not us which we of course already knew!

Regards

John

Thanks for the update.  That is at least some progress and recognition of the problem.

Its a pity though that they did not try the front port which is the one that freezes the unit after that upgrade to 6.4.2.

Perhaps they could look into that also.  My client is backing up around 250gb and it simply does not work on the rear ports even after 15 hours or more.  It also brings the NAS to a crawl and its unusable.  The GUI and back up window fails as well.  It just shows no backup jobs. 

Hi

What I'll do is talk to this Netgear engineer and see if theres a way that you can raise a support request direct to him and then talk to him as obviously our problems are similar.

Yes you are right about the front socket but the fact that finally after five months someone has simply performed a backup and found what I have  being saying is true is a step forward. It shouldn't have taken 5 months though should it?

I think this demonstrates the mess that has been created by this 6.4 firmware series. The fact that a simple test setup shows that the backup on a 102 doesn't work correctly also demonstrates that either the firmware wasn't sufficiently tested or as I suspect to be the case the fact that 102s are base models we are at the bottom of the list for ensuring functions work.

They have no idea of the time we have all spent on this.

Will keep you up to speed.

Regards

John

Thanks John that would be useful as I do need to get it resolved, backing up across the network is not really working very well.

I dont understand why Netgear keep saying the 102 is a basic model.  The one I am working on serves just two Macs, if its not designed to cope with just two computers what is it designed for?

Hi

To be fair 'base model' is my terminology but looking at the catalogues it is the cheapest device and it has already been pointed out to me on here that I shouldn't be using this for business and a 312 was suggested.

Quite frankly I wasn't best pleased by this attitude because to me this was yet another grasping at straws approach to divert me away from the true nature of the defect.

My 102 is a home device on which I have some work data. As I keep saying, data is data, its 1's and 0's and even the moving around and accessing a few files by perhaps two or three computers in a work environment is surely not as 'stressful' for a NAS as say two people accessing media files with films in a true home environment? In any event the daytime use does not alter the fact that overnight unattended backups do not work.

I have already emailed my contact about your issues.

Regards

John

Thanks again John, look forward to hearing from them.

The 102 works fine for what its been put in place to do.  There was an issue with the Macs accessing the drive but that turned out to be an Apple issue.  In terms of performance for accessing the data its fine.  The PC's also back up their Outlook etc to it.  Its just the firmware upgrade 6.4.2 that screwed up the backup that needs sorting.  Fix that netgear and we will all be happy bunnies.

Reply come in

"Hi John, Thank you for your messages. I will test the front USB port with the information you provided, and I will also run a few more tests on the units. Unfortunately, I cannot add another client to the case, but you can advise him to open a separate case for the issue he is seeing. Even if the symptoms are similar, it is always possible that the source of the issue may differ and we need to investigate each case individually. I will let you know as soon as I have more information, thank you again for your patience on this matter. "

It seems you need to raise your own support ticket. Perhaps it might be a good idea to say that this is already being partially investigated and my support ticket is # 26140511 

Ok?

John

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YorkBoy wrote:

Reply come in

 

"Hi John, Thank you for your messages. I will test the front USB port with the information you provided, and I will also run a few more tests on the units. Unfortunately, I cannot add another client to the case, but you can advise him to open a separate case for the issue he is seeing. Even if the symptoms are similar, it is always possible that the source of the issue may differ and we need to investigate each case individually. I will let you know as soon as I have more information, thank you again for your patience on this matter. "

 

It seems you need to raise your own support ticket. Perhaps it might be a good idea to say that this is already being partially investigated and my support ticket is # 26140511 

 

Ok?

 

John

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Thanks

How do you go about raising a support ticket? 

Hi

Look at the top of this page right hand side, Support.

Follow that through.

You'll need information like model and possibly serial no. as well.

Take the support for home route as thats what a 102 comes under I think. Expect hassle.

Remember to point out that all was well until 6.4.0 or 1 or 2 and point out my support ticket no. and that you have been onto the forum and see numerous others all with 6.4.0 issues and especially 102s that won't backup.

Ok?

John

1. I ran a few tests with 2 RN102 from our lab: one on 6.2.5, the another on 6.4.2

2. I copied the exact same data to both of them : 15GB (total) - a mix of big and small files

3. I ran backup jobs on both NASes (full backup of the data volume) using the same USB 3.0 stick, NTFS formated and plugged to the rear ports

4. There was a noticeable difference between the 2 backup jobs: it took over 2 hours on 6.4.2 and around 40 minutes for the one on 6.2.5

This is the same behaviour I see. Transfer speeds of around 1.5MB/s while the GUI becomes unresponsive and the unit requires a hard reset. I have explained in my support ticket (#26576559) that at that rate it would take a month to back up the 4TB drive in my 102.

Hi

If you have not already done so, I suggest you  ask them to refer to my support ticket no.   #26140511  

Finally Netgear appear to be taking this matter seriously and the more people that raise it through the proper channels the more chance we have of getting something done.

John

Ok thanks guys.  I have now submitted a similar support ticket.  #26587405

So it is pretty clear that the upgrade has created this issue.  Ideally I need the front usb backup sorting and not just the backup speeds on the rear port.  The front usb crashes the entire unit and the rear ones are unusable due to it taking too long and rendering the NAS useless.

Hi Barry

if you look at my recent comments to another user they too have had the same issues.

i think we are finally going to get some action but it both annoys and saddens me that it's taken five months of hard slog and bad feeling to get here. This really should not be necessary.

My Netgear  support engineer says he is testing the front socket. 

It almost seems as if the rear sockets are running usb 1. My front socket does work but only does a tiny backup, stalls and then hangs the NAS.

i breathe a sigh of relief every morning when I see a successful backup.

john

---

slotmachine wrote:

1. I ran a few tests with 2 RN102 from our lab: one on 6.2.5, the another on 6.4.2

2. I copied the exact same data to both of them : 15GB (total) - a mix of big and small files

3. I ran backup jobs on both NASes (full backup of the data volume) using the same USB 3.0 stick, NTFS formated and plugged to the rear ports

4. There was a noticeable difference between the 2 backup jobs: it took over 2 hours on 6.4.2 and around 40 minutes for the one on 6.2.5

 

This is the same behaviour I see. Transfer speeds of around 1.5MB/s while the GUI becomes unresponsive and the unit requires a hard reset. I have explained in my support ticket (#26576559) that at that rate it would take a month to back up the 4TB drive in my 102.

---

I just tried this on my RN102 - which is running 6.5.0-T322 beta. The external drive is a Crucial SSD in a Patriot Gauntlet USB enclosure, formatted NTFS. The enclosure was connected to the USB back top port of the RN102.

I ran two local->local backups:

Music: 58.2 GB - 15,414 Files, 974 Folders

42:15 run time, transfer speed ~23,5 MB/sec

Photos: 21.6 GB - 19,417 Files, 483 Folders 

16:48 run time, transfer speed ~22 MB/sec

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StephenB wrote:

---

slotmachine wrote:

1. I ran a few tests with 2 RN102 from our lab: one on 6.2.5, the another on 6.4.2

2. I copied the exact same data to both of them : 15GB (total) - a mix of big and small files

3. I ran backup jobs on both NASes (full backup of the data volume) using the same USB 3.0 stick, NTFS formated and plugged to the rear ports

4. There was a noticeable difference between the 2 backup jobs: it took over 2 hours on 6.4.2 and around 40 minutes for the one on 6.2.5

 

This is the same behaviour I see. Transfer speeds of around 1.5MB/s while the GUI becomes unresponsive and the unit requires a hard reset. I have explained in my support ticket (#26576559) that at that rate it would take a month to back up the 4TB drive in my 102.

---

I just tried this on my RN102 - which is running 6.5.0-T322 beta. The external drive is a Crucial SSD in a Patriot Gauntlet USB enclosure, formatted NTFS.

 

I ran two local->local backups:

Music: 58.2 GB - 15,414 Files, 974 Folders

42:15 run time, transfer speed ~23,5 MB/sec

 

Photos: 21.6 GB - 19,417 Files, 483 Folders 

16:48 run time, transfer speed ~22 MB/sec

 

---

Thanks

Did you try the front port?

Those speeds sound more like it so is this a fix? (Assuming it works of the front port)

That sounds promising. Do you have any idea how long it will be until 6.5.0 Beta is available?

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barryd wrote:

---

 

Did you try the front port?

 

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I used the back top USB 3 port.  I didn't try the USB 2 front port.  I will, and see how it compares.

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barryd wrote:

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so is this a fix?

---

No idea (and also have no idea when 6.5.0 will be released).

Evening.

Reading all this is very interesting.

Please though will someone (Netgear) just test the front socket for goodness sake and put us out of our misery.

Does it hang your 102?

Thanks

John

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YorkBoy wrote:

 

 Does it hang your 102?

 

---

There was no lockup, but the backup speed dropped and the web ui seemed less responsive.

Running the same Music backup  to the same drive connected to the USB front port resulted in

Music: 58.2 GB - 15,414 Files, 974 Folders

2:09:16 run time, transfer speed ~7.7 MB/sec

A big dropoff from 23.5 MB/sec.