Re: Nighthawk D7000 2.4Ghz WiFi issues

SAWS · ‎2018-01-19

@browntea wrote:
Erm doesn't Chrome on Windows have Chromecast built in... has this been ruled out or in??

Chrome has the ability to cast to a Chromecast on all platforms, and Android phones do too, through a variety of apps. I don't think the ability to cast to a Chromecast is necessarily the same thing as being a Chromecast. It seems like the issue is behavior of the Chromecast and other Google Home products as a result of their firmware. I've never had issues with my Android phones or Chromebook causing trouble on my network.

By the way, my D7000 completely **bleep** the bed last night - I was getting authentication failure on both 5Ghz and 2.4Ghz. First time that's happened. Still running 1.0.1.44. I saw the FW update notice from Netgear in my email this morning, and I'm going to upgrade after work today. It can't be any worse....

ukoldgit · ‎2018-01-19

@michaelkenward wrote:
@ukoldgit wrote:

....I dont understand why it has triggered for people around the same time despite the different ages of the D7000.

That one is easily answered by reading the rest of this discussion.

The wifi meltdown got triggered around the same time because Google caused the issue with an update to its systems.

Think of it this way, if Microsoft puts out a dodgy update for Windows, it will clobber equipment made my many different manufacturers. It will even hit your Netgear connected devices even though Netgear doesn't really use Windows.

That's what Google did. It put out a "patch" that hit many different manufacturers.

I've read most of the other discussions.
So can you be more specific as it would seem people are saying its due to chrome cast/google which I and many others don't use google products and still have this problem, does it affect android tv's and phones.
Reason I ask is because it might be my sons TV that is causeing the problem and do you think netgear will overcome this problem or pass the buck to Google.
Whilst I was reading the discussions I saw that some people were trying beta firmware but its unclear if this has helped all that have tried it or just a few.

gobes · ‎2018-01-19

A response I just got from Netgear via Twitter:

"The latest update on D7000 is we are seeing good results from the trial firmware 58 that we have in the lab and given to the community users who have been helping us test through this process. Based on the results so far we are moving the firmware to the next step in our process which will get the firmware further in our formal release process. We want to thank the users that have been helping us test and look forward to them providing additional information on the progress of their testing."

johnmcl7 · ‎2018-01-19

@gobes wrote:
A response I just got from Netgear via Twitter:

"The latest update on D7000 is we are seeing good results from the trial firmware 58 that we have in the lab and given to the community users who have been helping us test through this process. Based on the results so far we are moving the firmware to the next step in our process which will get the firmware further in our formal release process. We want to thank the users that have been helping us test and look forward to them providing additional information on the progress of their testing."

I think that's a little out of date now, I think someone posted here that they were working on a slightly newer firmware version that explicitly dealt with the Google devices flooding the network.

Brum80 · ‎2018-01-19

Just a quick update, I was testing v58 for over a week with no issues. I have been testing v62 for a couple of days now, again with no issues. Just to add, I do have a chromecast (powered by my TV so it's not on 24/7) and a couple of Android devices.

droman · ‎2018-01-19

Latest update for D7000 as of 10AM (Pacific Time), January 19, 2017

Here’s is the latest for the D7000. We are working to formalize the new firmware release that should help to patch the 2.4GHz disconnects. As many in the community have pointed out, some of the disconnects seem to be related to a known Google issue with Android and Chromecast built in devices. We have seen the Chromecast effect in our lab, as well, but wanted to be as thorough as possible as we have also seen posts that users who do not have Chromecast or the affected Android apps were still seeing disconnects. Therefore we wanted to continue testing a variety of other possibilities. Additionally, we see in various publications that Google will be releasing firmware updates for their affected devices. We would suggest you disconnect the Google Chromecast, Google Home, and associated Android apps to reduce disconnects until we release our firmware patch as soon as practicable with our SQA testing and/or you update the firmware on your Chromecast devices. Although we certainly believe the new firmware will help alleviate the drops, we want to still hear from the users who do not use the Google products should you continue to see disconnects after installing the new firmware. As always, we very much appreciate our users who have helped us test through this process and also appreciate the continued conversation in the community which helped to guide us to a solution.

Thanks, Dave

nscolli · ‎2018-01-19

A brief status report on my testing of beta/trial FW V62.

17 Jan installed V62 and it ran faultlessly for 31 hours before the power company cut off electricity to the house to install a new meter.

After that the D7000 on V62 has been running faultlessly for 47 hours with only one minor issue. D7000 clients include:

iPad (2.4G and with Google Home App), iPad (5G), iPhone 7S (5G),

Android: Huawei Nexus 6P (2.4g and with Google Home App), Samsung Galaxy S3 (2.4G)

Chromecast (5G), Chromecast (2.4G)

WiFi Extender WN3500RP (2.4G)

4 laptops (all 2.4G)

Ethernet: two NAS, printer, TV (via powerline)

PC dual connected: Ethernet and 2.4G

Humax HMS1000T set top box (5G)

The minor issue is that the D7000 GUI shows all connected devices, but does not show the IP address for a random few.

I have done some casting during this time.

So far so good.

.

nscolli · ‎2018-01-19

@Case850

I believe that Chromecast FW updates are automatic and not available for any sort of manual download. Checked the versions of the Chromecast and they have not been updated.

Android Google Play Store is at V8.5.39 W-all [0] [PR] 178322352 (what ever all that means!)

Google Play Services is at V 11.9.51 (440-177350961) (Ditto!)

I have automatic updates on and neither of the above or the Android OS version (8.1.0) have been updated and they are not being shown as available for manual update.

I suspect that Google, to not overload their servers, schedule updates across the world based on those with the largest population of Google devices being done first. Therefore I guess Australia is probably a fair way down their list!

johnmcl7 · ‎2018-01-19

@nscolli wrote:
@Case850

I believe that Chromecast FW updates are automatic and not available for any sort of manual download. Checked the versions of the Chromecast and they have not been updated.
Android Google Play Store is at V8.5.39 W-all [0] [PR] 178322352 (what ever all that means!)
Google Play Services is at V 11.9.51 (440-177350961) (Ditto!)
I have automatic updates on and neither of the above or the Android OS version (8.1.0) have been updated and they are not being shown as available for manual update.

I suspect that Google, to not overload their servers, schedule updates across the world based on those with the largest population of Google devices being done first. Therefore I guess Australia is probably a fair way down their list!

The google patch for the phones is currently only in beta, they don't appear to have released a full public version yet. The initial feedback on the beta patch seems good so far with people noting a considerable reduction in the flood of packets from their devices.

johnmcl7 · ‎2018-01-19

@Case850 wrote:
@johnmcl7, thanks for the information.

I've been keeping an eye on this Google package, it's currently showing as last updated 4th January - i think when Google release the new patch, this should show a newer date:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.gms

nscolli · ‎2018-01-19

@Case850 wrote:
Thanks for the update, the other questions I have are not related to Google MDNS. Do you have any clients that support 802.11n 256 QAM to fully test the 600 Mbps on 2.4G Band or is your testing/observations confined to a max of 289 Mbps on 2.4G?

@Case850

You give me too much credit for knowledge! 🙂 I searched re QAM and found this discussion https://www.cwnp.com/forums/posts?postNum=307358

I suspect all my laptop clients are too old to have the chip/feature to handle QAM and I am not aware of the more recent devices capability re QAM. One of the iPads is more recent as is the iPhone 7S and the Nexus 6P is not so old but I don't know the detailed WiFi specs for them. I also don't know the WiFi specs of my two Chromecasts (1st Gen), nor that of the Google Home Mini. The latter is not on the network as requested by the engineers anyway. My PC is Ethernet connected but also has a USB TP-LINK Archer T9UH AC 1900 High Gain dual band WiFi adapter (so I can tether to my phone when the ISP's copper goes down) and again here I don't know the detailed specs for it. However the retail packaging says "2.4gHz 600Mbps".

That is a long winded way of saying "no" to your question!

nscolli · ‎2018-01-19

@Case850 wrote:
@nscolli, see bottom of page 92 of the D7000 user manual.

On the newer devices(iPhone 7S) try installing Wifi Sweetspots free on iOS and Android and run it on the 2.4 G and see what max speed you get. I don't know if the iPhone 7S supports 256 QAM on 2.4G(I am trying to find out) so I would be interested in the results.

@Case850

My page 92 is about MTU. I checked that it was the correct setting for PPoE i.e. 1492.

Installed Wi-Fi Sweetspots and ran it in the same room as the D7000 for twenty seconds and 227.2Mbps.

I found QAM on page 97 and I am limited by WPA-PSK security as in the note on the page "WPA-PSK security supports speeds of up to 54 Mbps. Even if your devices
are capable of a higher speed, WPA-PSK security limits their speed to 54
Mbps."

Installed Wi-Fi Sweetspots on the android Nexus 6P and ran it for 20 seconds in the same room as D7000 got 119.3Mbps.

Not sure that any of this helps you but it was an interesting exercise.

nscolli · ‎2018-01-19

@Case850 wrote:
@nscolli, We must have different versions of the manual. The D7000 I downloaded is dated July 2017 202-11536-03.

@Case850
You are not wrong, mine = September 2015
202-11536-02

nscolli · ‎2018-01-20

Customer testing progress report:

21 Jan 2018

17:40 (AEDT) All connections are up and accessing the internet. V62 has been running since 10:40 18 Jan giving a faultless uptime of 3 days 7 hours. In this time frame I have not seen that any of my Google related devices have received FW upgrades. Also have not received an upgrade to Google Play Services. This leads me to the belief that Netgear engineers may have achieved success with this trial/beta FW release. Whether the fixes were inherent D7000 issues or were fixes to handle the MDNS floods from Google or both, the D7000 has been performing properly for this test period.

GlennD · ‎2018-01-21

When will Firmware Ver 62 for the D7000 be released to users as a final fix ?

Tomhurst · ‎2018-01-21

Do you have to be invited for that firmware?
All of us without an invite have been sitting here with crappy routers for 2 months now and I'm getting bored of it

Brum80 · ‎2018-01-21

You need to email Netgear to request the beta firmware, they did post their email address in an earlier post.

Hesparado · ‎2018-01-21

Any chance of a link to the post? This thread is a bit of a monster.

Cheers

nscolli · ‎2018-01-21

@Hesparado wrote:
Any chance of a link to the post? This thread is a bit of a monster.

Cheers

@HesparadoI found a customer's post # 192 on page 8.

Netgear must have removed the referenced Knowledge Base article because the link errors out in my browser.

You could try the support email address mentioned in this post to see if they want more customer testers.

My D7000, running beta/trial FW V62 has been running for over 4 days 7 hours without a hitch which is really promising.

Hesparado · ‎2018-01-22

Great. Thanks for the reply.

Jamesfx · ‎2018-01-22

So, does anyone know when Netgear are gonna roll out a fix for the masses and not just the testers.. Really struggling as is everyone else.

boiledfrog · ‎2018-01-22

I'm running the 1.62 code, without the diagnostics portion loaded, and have been since Friday 19Jan.

While the 2.4g disconnects have either gone or are unnoticeable, there are a couple of issues, specifically relating to chromecast 2.4 (original) devices with good quality connections to the modem/router. Chromecasts are running production firmware (1.29.104827). There are no substantive 2.4g channel conflicts.

1. Bandwidth to devices appears to vary dynamically on the local WiFi network, with streams (from different sources and CDNs - Netflix/BBC/Youtube) chopping through the variable bit-rate (VBR) streams or stopping entirely to buffer (this on a good quality DSL connection with 50/20mbit). Streams coming from wired connections through the same router do not suffer this.

2. Other devices connected to 2.4 and running streams have similar issues (PCs/Laptops) with VBR encoding struggling to find stable bandwidth.

3. Local cast media controls are unreliable, appearing and disappearing from 'phone (Android 8 OnePlus 3T) and laptop (Mac Pro), meaning that streams are not reliably controllable in the local network. This is across multiple google home, chromecast audio and video devices. I note that there has been some parallel discussion about Google Play Services having an update - mine is still 11.9.51 from Dec 2017 and there are no updates available.

So, while the 1.62 code may stop the disconnects, it will introduce other issues that may make it unpleasant or unpalatable to operate in a home environment. Looking forward to the next iteration.

boiledfrog · ‎2018-01-22

@Case850

As per detailed notes provided, the issue is WiFi only and Android/Chromecast devices are running the latest production firmware.

WiFi Multimedia (WMM) and Quality of Service (QoS) are turned on and the uplink bandwidth is matched to (just under) the available uplink bw at 19mbit/sec.

nscolli · ‎2018-01-23

@Case850 wrote:
@boiledfrog
Has the Android 8 OnePlus 3T received the MDNS patch?

You note is not of sufficient detail to form a conclusion. Can you install Wifi Sweetspots (free on Android and iOS) and run some bandwidth test on the 2.4G & 5G band. What sort of numbers are you getting?

Are you running Dynamic QoS? Do you have the option to run Manual QoS?

@Case850You keep making reference to an android MDNS patch. As I had not found a link to such a patch I did a chat session with Goodle Home Support. He/She/It? responded guardedly.

I quoted the Google website statement "The team has identified the issue and is actively releasing a fix, which will start rolling out via a Google Play services update this Thursday, January 18."

I then stated "It is now 23 Jan and I have not seen any updates to Android on my phone, nor on chromecasts and Home Mini".

The Google response was "Upon checking on my resources, the update will roll out over a two week period. But as soon as the update is available we will get in touch with you the soonest that we can" followed by "Via email. But we will also post it on our website to let anyone know specially those who have been affected by this."

So it is a waiting game now.

boiledfrog · ‎2018-01-23

Hi @Case850

As stated, the Android handset is as up to date as I can make it, running production firmware and production google apps. I cannot force the play store to include me in rollout groups. I have rebooted this device daily to try and force updates, but to give an example, this morning there was an update to google sheets that I can see was released 3 weeks ago.

Similarly, the chromecast devices (there are 2 original 2.4GHz devices on the network, 3 chromecast audios on 5gHz, a wired android TV and 3 google home minis on 5gHz) are all running the current production firmware for their generation.

As for QoS, the D7000 has a check box for this - on or off. It's on and the rules for this are the default for 'by service' (so skype and google talk are highest, then messenger services, followed by FTP and finally torrent services (not used on this network). Services were working fine before all this kicked off in late Nov/early Dec 2017.

Finally, what numbers are you expecting from WiFi Sweetspot? Looking at its' performance graph for 2.4gHz at the location (within 20mm) of the most used chromecast device, I can see speeds ranging from 15-77mbit/sec, averaging 50.52mbit/sec with a signal strength of -65dBm. It's a domestic suburban location, so there are some other 2.4gHz networks, but that's to be expected and I'm on the least busy channel location.

None of this explains the disconnects from controlling devices to streams on the 2.4gHz band or the VBR changes that are only observed using devices connected to 2.4gHz.

To try ruling the OnePlus3T out, I have a Nexus 6 that I will dust off and see if it functions predictably.