Orbi RBK853 Second Satellite unable to work using ethernet backhaul

[coolmoss]

I am now using ethernet wired connection only for one Satellite because I can never get the other satellite to work. 

Setup would have been star topology (if it works).

Firmware: V3.2.16.6_1.4.4

Router Mode

My Router is in the kitchen because there's where my modem is.

My Satellite A is in the living room connected using ethernet cable

My Satellite B is in the 2nd floor connected wirelessly via Satellite A

I always thought it is as simple as plugging in LAN to get Satellite B to work but it's not the case.  If I plug in the ethernet cable Satellite B would turn solid blue, I get connected to the wifi, but there's no internet.

I have read in other threads about "daisy chain" setting but this is not available in my login.

How do I get Satellite B to work using LAN?

[FURRYe38]

Are both RBS directly connected to the back of the RBR or is there a ethernet switch in between? 

What happens if you swap RBS A for RBS B positions just to see if RBS B works at RBS A location? IF it works at RBS A location, then you may have a faulty cable in between RBR and RBS B location. 

Check RBS A at RBS Bs location. 

After the RBS are wirelessly synced first, then connect the ethernet cable. 

[coolmoss]

Hi

Thank you for the reply.

Both RBS are connected through 'pass through' from the kitchen, to the living room and to 2nd floor respectively.

I have tried swapping the unit and it is the same, so it is not the RBS.  I have also connected the LAN directly to my laptop and it works so it is not the wiring

RBS at first floor is connected using LAN and it is fine

RBS at the 2nd floor is the one that is wirelessly synced because it won't work when connected to LAN.  

I have tried:

a) wirelessly sync and then connected LAN -NG

b) power off, connect LAN, power on - NG

c) side note: connect LAN directly to laptop - OK

Pls let me know what else I can try.  Thank you very much

[FURRYe38]

What is this "pass through"? A hole in the wall?

So when you swap locations with the RBS, the problem follows the one RBS? 

[coolmoss]

"Pass through" (they are all in the kitchen at ground floor) is basically the "data point" that allow me to plug/connect a LAN from the Router; and then in each of my room I have these connected data points that I can then plug LAN cable to my whatever devices.  Each "pass through" will have a corresponding data point in each room at different floors.  I could have called it data point but that's what the guys here call it.

When I swapped the RBS, the problem remained at 2nd floor (ie there is no problem with the unit)

[FURRYe38]

So if the problem didn't follow with the RBS, then  I would presume there is a problem i the cabling or these "data points"...

[coolmoss]

The data points work because when I plug the LAN directly to the laptop I get super fast connection (800mbps).  Also do note that when I plugged in the Satellite, I first get blue light (which means it received data?) but after that somehow it just won't connect to the internet.

Do you think it is the 'daisy chain' setting that could solve this issue?  This setting is not in AX though

[FURRYe38]

Try turning OFF the other RBS. Then turn ON the one RBS that doesn't seem to work. See if this changes anything. If not, then there is an issue at this data point area. 

[coolmoss]

OK just to make sure that I do it correctly, this is what I will do 

1. Turn off Satellite A (which is already connected to LAN)

2. Turn off Satellite B (the 'problem unit') and plug in LAN

3. Turn on Satellite B

Is that correct?

P/S: as mentioned earlier the data point connecting to Satellite B is working because when I plug in the LAN to my laptop I can get the internet

[FURRYe38]

Yes Then also try B satellite at A satellites position as well. Does B satellite work at A satellites position? 

[coolmoss]

Below are my tests for 2 scenarios and the outcome:

Scenario 1
power off satellite A (nearer to router at ground floor)
power off satellite B (at 2nd floor) and plug in LAN
Satellite B seems to be working ok with LAN (I tested it only for a few minutes)
power on satellite A (wifi OK)
After Satellite A is ON, Satellite B becomes unstable (connection seems slow, page sometimes load but took unusually long and sometimes take forever -more than 30 seconds and still spinning.. Guest network seems to be running normal. Note that I'm less than one meter to the Satellite so it can't be the distance. Just to be sure I toggle from Main to Guest a few times, everytime Guest is ok but Main is not )

Scenario 2
swapped satellite A and satellite B
satellite B (now at ground floor) OFF
satellite A (at 2nd floor) plug in with LAN - internet workig for Main (500+mbps) and Guest
tried using satellite A with Main network for about an hour with no issues at all
switched on satellite B, wifi working well.  safe to say satellite B has no problem?
came back to satellite A, main network is again unstable, sometimes the page loads, then halfway it stopped (some pictures in the site is not loading), and sometimes it takes very long to load a page

So it appears to me that when I start connecting 2 Satellites to LAN then the problem will start happening at the same location (in this case 2nd floor). I was guessing that the satellite that is nearer to the router (also at ground floor) is trying to connect with the 2nd floor satellite using wireless backhaul even when it is connected to LAN and causing some conflict. Could this be a possibility? If not, what is the potential reason that we can deduce from here?  Why Guest is OK but Main is not?  Is there a setting that I should change on my RBR or RBS?

Sorry that's a lot of questions, do appreciate your help in this so far.
Thank you so much for your help again!

[coolmoss]

I will take back my word on Guest network...

It worked 'most of the time' like it can go on for an hour or two and then suddenly the connection dropped.  The funny thing is switching it to Main will make it work again but not for long (less than 15 min), and then after that I will have to switch back to Guest to make it work again, and this keeps repeating.

I have to switch back to wireless until we have a solution for ethernet backhaul.

I like the wired connection stability and high internet speed but I'm still trying to get it to work.

[FURRYe38]

What Firmware version is currently loaded?
What is the Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT the NG router is connected too?

Did you first wirelessly sync the RBS to the RBR before connecting the RBS via ethernet?

Are the RBS directly wired to the RBR or is there a switch in between? 
What is the Mfr and model# of the ethernet switch in the configuration?
https://kb.netgear.com/000051205/What-is-Ethernet-backhaul-and-how-do-I-set-it-up-on-my-Orbi-WiFi-Sy...

What is the size of your home? Sq Ft?
What is the distance between the router and satellite(s)? 30 feet or more is recommended in between RBR and RBS to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected.

[coolmoss]

Firmware version: V3.2.16.6_1.4.4
Mfr and model# of the Internet Service Providers modem/ONT: Huawei EchoLife HG8240H

Setup: (this was sometimes ago, I believe these are the steps) First connect wirelessly to ground floor satellite, then connect wirelessly from first satellite to another satellite. After that connect first satellite with LAN

Connection: Both RBS were connected directly to RBR (Star topology). Now only one RBS is connected to RBR since another RBS can't work with LAN. There is no ethernet switch in between.

Size of ground floor and 2nd floor are around 1500 sq ft each. There is a mezz between ground floor and 2nd floor.

Distance between RBR and Satellite (ground floor): around 25 ft clear path to each other however RBR is enclosed in wooden kitchen cabinet
Distance between 2 Satellite (one of them at 2nd floor): around 20 ft
Distance betwen RBR and the further Satellite (2nd floor): around 32 ft (diagonal distance through 2 concrete ceilings)

[FURRYe38]

If you swap the 2nd RBS where the 1st RBS is and ethernet connect the 2nd RBS here or take the 2nd RBS to same room as RBR and use a patch cable to connect the 2nd RBS dirctly behind the RBR. Does the 2nd RBS work with ethernet connections in either of these places? 

[FURRYe38]

25 feet is a bit too close. 30ft for more is recommended distance. 

[coolmoss]

I have tried swapping the RBS before as per my previous posts, the problem remains at the same location (ie different unit has the same problem)

About this -> 25 feet is a bit too close. 30ft for more is recommended distance. 

What happens when it is too close?  shouldn't it connect to any of these units? 

[FURRYe38]

So that means there is a wire cable problem at the one problem location or wire segment that feeds to this area has a problem. 

Having too much wifi signal overlap can cause problems between the RBR and RBS. Placement is key as well as distance. Placement in a line out from the RBR can be used in will daisy chain the RBS. Placed in a star formation out from the RBR is common practice. 

[coolmoss]

I think you could have misunderstood the problem.

RBS (ground floor) that is less than 30 ft to RBR is not the satellite having problem.  It works perfectly fine.  So I don't think interference is the issue here

RBS (2nd floor) that is unable to work using LAN is the problem.  This RBS works when using wireless backhaul.  It also works if RBS at ground floor is turned of and then use LAN for internet (meaning LAN/data point is not the problem)

Swapping these RBS I can still replicate the exact issues.

The main problem related to subject happens only when I'm trying to connect both RBS using LAN

I am thinking it could be setting in the router but not sure which to change.  Read some thread about daisy chain setting but it's not available with AX units.

Contacted the support here and couldn't solve the problem.  He offered to replace the units but I don't think that will solve the issues.

Anything else that I can try?  Thank you.

[FURRYe38]

So if you take both RBS to the same room as the RBR and ethernet connect them behind the RBR, do they appear in the RBRs web page correctly as wire connected? 

[coolmoss]

I don't have to take it to the same room, because when connected to LAN to the data point (2nd floor), RBS (2nd floor) did show wired connection to RBR (without LAN it just shows wireless).

[FURRYe38]

You need to test them both in the same room at the same time while ethernet connected to the back of the RBR. Were looking to rule out your remote connection areas here. 

If both connected to the RBR while in the same room still shows the problem, then you'll need to either return the system you have or contact NG support and ask about an RMA.

[coolmoss]

Thanks so much for the help thus far.

I really don't think it is the RBS because I have tested them individually and I could replicate the problem.  I have also tested them at different location and each time the problem only happens when two are connected to LAN.

Data point is also not an issue, I have 2 data points so I can test both units at the same time. I have used these data points before directly plugged into my laptop, so I know for sure they are working

Unless you are saying RBR is the problem when connected to both (and it cannot support that).  

One question beore I do this test, if both RBS are in the same room, how do I know whether the RBS is working, since they both share the same SSID?

[FURRYe38]

When you connect BOTH RBS to the back of the RBR, have the RBRs web page open to the connected devices page. Check the connection status there. If the RBR and RBS and cables inbetween are working, then BOTH RBS connection rates will show wired. 

[coolmoss]

What if they both show wired, but the connection is unstable for one of the RBS?  how would I know that which is having problem?  Since one unit will be stable everything will seem OK when it is not.

That was the exact problem when I connected both to LAN during the test.  The difference is I can easily tell the unstable connection because I'm connected to the RBS closest to me.