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Disabling automatic subnet reconfig
I was wondering if there was a way (yet) to disable Orbi’s automatic IP reconfig if it detects a “conflicting” subnet? I understand the spirit of what it’s for, but frankly it’s a bugged feature (yes, see example #2).
1) I began using an AT&T Fiber gateway (BGW320-505) in front of my Orbi. Both devices were configured for the same subnet (192.168.1.0/24), however there were zero IP conflicts or overlapping DHCP scopes.
• Orbi: 192.168.1.1 & DHCP Range .150-.190
• GW: 192.168.1.254 & DHCP Reservation for a single IP (Orbi’s WAN, for IP Passthrough).
...but Orbi kept frequently reconfiguring itself for 10.0.0.0/24. I would receive:
“To avoid conflict with your Internet Service Provider, your router's IP address has been update to 10.0.0.1.”
I assumed perhaps it didn’t like the existence of multiple DHCP servers. Fine. So I reconfigure GW for 172.16.0.0/24. Problem goes away for a bit...
2) Last night I introduced two Netgear GS108Ev3 (managed, layer 2) switches to the network with IPs of 192.168.1.2 & 192.168.1.3. Everything is working properly. The very last thing I do is update their firmware. Click ‘Update Firmware’, it says it’s dropping itself in to loader mode. I perform the firmware update without issue but notice the rest of my network has disappeared. I check Orbi and it has reconfigured itself. Again. I perform the update on the second switch? Same thing happens. There are no DHCP services on these switches. They just exist on the same network. I can at least understand the potential why with the first example (to avoid double NATing and/or routing conflicts), but this...?
At best, I’d really like a way to disable this feature. At worst, I’d like to understand specifically what is tripping the behavior as the L2 switches don’t make any sense.
1) I began using an AT&T Fiber gateway (BGW320-505) in front of my Orbi. Both devices were configured for the same subnet (192.168.1.0/24), however there were zero IP conflicts or overlapping DHCP scopes.
• Orbi: 192.168.1.1 & DHCP Range .150-.190
• GW: 192.168.1.254 & DHCP Reservation for a single IP (Orbi’s WAN, for IP Passthrough).
...but Orbi kept frequently reconfiguring itself for 10.0.0.0/24. I would receive:
“To avoid conflict with your Internet Service Provider, your router's IP address has been update to 10.0.0.1.”
I assumed perhaps it didn’t like the existence of multiple DHCP servers. Fine. So I reconfigure GW for 172.16.0.0/24. Problem goes away for a bit...
2) Last night I introduced two Netgear GS108Ev3 (managed, layer 2) switches to the network with IPs of 192.168.1.2 & 192.168.1.3. Everything is working properly. The very last thing I do is update their firmware. Click ‘Update Firmware’, it says it’s dropping itself in to loader mode. I perform the firmware update without issue but notice the rest of my network has disappeared. I check Orbi and it has reconfigured itself. Again. I perform the update on the second switch? Same thing happens. There are no DHCP services on these switches. They just exist on the same network. I can at least understand the potential why with the first example (to avoid double NATing and/or routing conflicts), but this...?
At best, I’d really like a way to disable this feature. At worst, I’d like to understand specifically what is tripping the behavior as the L2 switches don’t make any sense.
CrimpOn : Did some final testing and now confident in the conclusion.
What triggers the "reconfiguration" behavior appears to be whenever Orbi detects any other network device on the other side of it's Internet (WAN) port sharing the same subnet. It doesn't matter if there's an actual conflict or not -- simply it's existence. From a consumer support standpoint this is actually a pretty clever mechanism (though I wish they'd give us the option to disable it for various use cases).In my *personal* case - the issue was that I'd put the ports in their respective VLANs (10 for WAN, 20 for LAN) but left VLAN 1 in place. Regular (untagged) traffic was working just fine. My guess is that during a firmware update on those GS108Ev3 switches, it was sending out a broadcast across all configured VLANs, Orbi was seeing that broadcast on the Internet port, hence reconfiguration is triggered. I removed VLAN 1 from all ports and haven't been able to replicate the problem since.
As for your question about the use case for the two switches? This as a method to extend out multiple networks over a single cable. My current configuration looks like this:
VLAN 10 = WAN Traffic
VLAN 20 = LAN Traffic
-----BASEMENT
GS108Ev3 - Port 1: VLAN 10 Tagged, VLAN 20 Tagged
GS108Ev3 - Port 2: VLAN 10 Untagged
GS108Ev3 - Port 3-8: VLAN 20 UntaggedAT&T Gateway LAN plugged in to GS108Ev3 Port 2
UPSTAIRS OFFICE
GS108Ev3 - Port 1: VLAN 10 Tagged, VLAN 20 Tagged
GS108Ev3 - Port 2: VLAN 10 Untagged
GS108Ev3 - Port 3-8: VLAN 20 Untagged
Orbi Internet Port plugged in to GS108Ev3 Port 2
-----
Port 1 is the single physical cable running between the two switches. It will pass all traffic for either VLAN (LAN or WAN side) without either seeing one another as the traffic is "encapsulated" (isolated from each other). Port 2 on each side is where you plug in the WAN side of things. In the basement I have several runs from around the house plugged in to ports 3-8 (LAN). In the Office, I also have a bunch of devices plugged in to 3-8 (LAN). Two separate floors but they'll all end up in the LAN side.The notion that someone shouldn't be using managed switches in a network topology is a silly one, assuming the configuration is correct. In my particular case (and the fix to the original problem I posted about) turns out to simply be "don't let Orbi's Internet port see any traffic with a subnet that matches it's LAN side". Simple enough, makes a lot of sense. Once I understood what was triggering the reconfigurating, finding the root cause was simple.
(Extra thanks to schumaku for the sentence that led to the conclusion -- "Somehow the Orbi system does see any 192.168.x.x network on it's WAN/Internet port.")
28 Replies
You need to either change the RBRs IP address string to something different than 192.168.1.1 or try the following:
This would be a double NAT (two router) condition which isn't recommended. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT
https://kb.netgear.com/30187/How-to-fix-issues-with-Double-NAT
Couple of options,
1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop- FURRYe38 : While I (genuinely) appreciate the reply, you didn’t actually read the post.
1) I already changed the RBR to sit on a different subnet than the other router (GW is now 172.16.0.0/24. I’m *already* passing back the WAN IP directly to the WAN interface of the Orbi, hence there is no double NAT.
2) All WiFi radios are already disabled on the modem as well.
3) The real mystery here is surrounding the Netgear switches (GS108Ev3), not routers, that cause the same behavior upon initiating a firmware update.What happens if you change the Orbi to 192.168.0.1?
Also your switche are Smart managed switches, something that can cause problems with Orbi systems. Try to disable all IGMP protocols AND Green Ethernet featues on these switches.
NG GS-105/108v4, D-Link DGS-105/108 and HP ProCurve 1400/1800 series switches work for Orbi systems.
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