Re: Orbi RBR/RBS50 not syncing and connected devices not showing

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

I'm currently running firmware version 2.5.1.8 on both the router and the satellite. Up until recently they were working reliably and the system has been great. Two things may have affected that and I'm not sure which. We recently added a Ring doorbell to our home network and it doesn't stay connected consistently. We also had a recent very brief power outage and now the satellite doesn't sync with the router, and the connected devices don't show up. They are connected and do function, but the backhaul status shows as disconnected so connections do sometimes drop. I can see the list of devices that have permission to be on the network, but they don't show up as connected. The number of connected devices shows as anywhere between 1 and 5 and varies from time to time.

I've seen other users with similar problems where the solution seems to be to manually update the firmware to the version I'm running. Not sure what to do to fix this?

CrimpOn · ‎2020-03-10

A manual firmware update is not the solution, because the Orbi is already on the most recent release.

What steps have already been tried:

Power them both off.

Power up the Orbi and wait until it comes up, which takes a LOT longer than I expect it to.

Power up the satellite.

Does that have an effect?

The "last resort" is to perform a "Factory Reset" on the system, based on the theory that "something got corrupted" in operating memory by the power outage and that "starting fresh" will create all the internals correctly. Depending on how much was done to customize the Orbi (device assignments, defining device names, customizing DNS entries, setting up DDNS & VPN, etc. etc.) this can be a serious effort.

This is usually done in two ways: (1) before the reset, save a copy of the configuration file to an external computer. This is on the Orbi web interface, Administration, Backukp Settings. After the reset, there will be a chance to "restore previous settings". So, way 1 is not painful at all. (2) However, if way 1 fails to solve the problem, The second method is to say, "Nope. I am setting this up manually", and enter every blasted item by hand. My tactic is to NOT set the Orbi WiFi name until the very last. With a different name, no devices will connect to the Orbi and mess up my configuration process. After all entries are done, I change the name, the Orbi restarts, and it's a wild scramble as all the devices connect. In order to do this, I make screen captures of every single page of the Orbi web interface and save them in a Word file.

The Factory Reset process is explained in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMw4ePACgc4

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-03-10

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too?

What is the distance between the router and satellite(s)? 30 feet is recommended in between RBR and RBS to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected. https://kb.netgear.com/000036466/How-far-should-I-place-my-Orbi-satellite-from-my-Orbi-router

What channels are you using? Auto? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.
Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Try enabling Beamforming and MIMO(MIMO may or maynot be needed) and WMM. Under Advanced Tab/Advanced Settings/Wireless Settings

Try disabling the following and see:
Armor, Circle, Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Set Short preamble instead of Long preamble modes. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

@AIRgauge wrote:
I'm currently running firmware version 2.5.1.8 on both the router and the satellite. Up until recently they were working reliably and the system has been great. Two things may have affected that and I'm not sure which. We recently added a Ring doorbell to our home network and it doesn't stay connected consistently. We also had a recent very brief power outage and now the satellite doesn't sync with the router, and the connected devices don't show up. They are connected and do function, but the backhaul status shows as disconnected so connections do sometimes drop. I can see the list of devices that have permission to be on the network, but they don't show up as connected. The number of connected devices shows as anywhere between 1 and 5 and varies from time to time.

I've seen other users with similar problems where the solution seems to be to manually update the firmware to the version I'm running. Not sure what to do to fix this?

Retired_Member · ‎2020-03-10

@AIRgauge wrote:
I'm currently running firmware version 2.5.1.8 on both the router and the satellite. Up until recently they were working reliably and the system has been great. Two things may have affected that and I'm not sure which. We recently added a Ring doorbell to our home network and it doesn't stay connected consistently. We also had a recent very brief power outage and now the satellite doesn't sync with the router, and the connected devices don't show up. They are connected and do function, but the backhaul status shows as disconnected so connections do sometimes drop. I can see the list of devices that have permission to be on the network, but they don't show up as connected. The number of connected devices shows as anywhere between 1 and 5 and varies from time to time.

I've seen other users with similar problems where the solution seems to be to manually update the firmware to the version I'm running. Not sure what to do to fix this?

How did you end up with 2.5.1.8? How long have you had it? Was your system working before 2.5.1.8?

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too? CICSO DPC3849V - provided by my cable provider and our cable also runs through it.

What is the distance between the router and satellite(s)? 30 feet is recommended in between RBR and RBS to begin with depending upon building materials when wirelessly connected. https://kb.netgear.com/000036466/How-far-should-I-place-my-Orbi-satellite-from-my-Orbi-router

30 feet, separated by one floor, and always worked perfectly until now. When I plug the satellite in, it shows a blue circle after it connects to the network, but does not sync.

What channels are you using? Auto? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.
Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

I have tried changing channels as you described but no luck. We have 9 wifi neighbours nearby.

Try enabling Beamforming and MIMO(MIMO may or maynot be needed) and WMM. Under Advanced Tab/Advanced Settings/Wireless Settings

Tried this - it didn't help.

Try disabling the following and see:
Armor, Circle, Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Set Short preamble instead of Long preamble modes. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

Don't have Armor or Circle enabled, but will try the others.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

I have automatic updates set via the app. I'm not certain how long I've had it as it was set to automatically update, but it has always worked reliably until now.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

I have tried the steps you described and it changes the number of connected devices that show up, but the number is not accurate and the satellite still doesn't sync.

Thanks for the links and info on factory resetting - hope I don't have to go that route but that helps if I do.

Retired_Member · ‎2020-03-10

@AIRgauge wrote:
I have automatic updates set via the app. I'm not certain how long I've had it as it was set to automatically update, but it has always worked reliably until now.

So you didn't manually perform the FW update and you have no idea how long you've had it?

My recommendation: Roll your FW back to the previous version....OR...continue on with what you see here.

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-03-10

Seems that you may have a ISP modem with built in router and wifi.

Do you know what mode the modem is working in? Router or Bridged?

This would be a double NAT condition which isn't recommended. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT
https://kb.netgear.com/30187/How-to-fix-issues-with-Double-NAT
Couple of options,
1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop

Try removing the RBS from the RBRs web page. Then factory reset the RBS by pressing the back reset button for 15 seconds then release. Once the top ring LED slowly pulsates WHITE, press the black sync button on the RBR then on the RBS. I would do this with the RBS in the same room as the RBR. If you get it sync'd, then place back in remote location.

A reset of the RBR maybe needed as last resort.

Retired_Member · ‎2020-03-10

@FURRYe38 wrote:
Seems that you may have a ISP modem with built in router and wifi.
Do you know what mode the modem is working in? Router or Bridged?
This would be a double NAT condition which isn't recommended. https://kb.netgear.com/30186/What-is-Double-NAT
https://kb.netgear.com/30187/How-to-fix-issues-with-Double-NAT
Couple of options,
1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge or modem only mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.
2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ/ExposedHost or IP Pass-Through for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.
3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router. https://kb.netgear.com/31218/How-do-I-configure-my-Orbi-router-to-act-as-an-access-point and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7LOcJ8GdDo&app=desktop

Try removing the RBS from the RBRs web page. Then factory reset the RBS by pressing the back reset button for 15 seconds then release. Once the top ring LED slowly pulsates WHITE, press the black sync button on the RBR then on the RBS. I would do this with the RBS in the same room as the RBR. If you get it sync'd, then place back in remote location.

A reset of the RBR maybe needed as last resort.

How do you explain...." Up until recently they were working reliably and the system has been great.?"

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

It is bridged and was done at install by the ISP at the same time as I installed the RBR - have had both working together successfully for almost 3 years.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

I did remove the RBS manually but have not performed a factory reset on it. Can try that.

Retired_Member · ‎2020-03-10

@AIRgauge wrote:
It is bridged and was done at install by the ISP at the same time as I installed the RBR - have had both working together successfully for almost 3 years.

wow...3 years....pretty good!

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

Agreed - it's been a great system which is why I'm trying to stick with it.

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-03-10

Lets try that.

I and others have v2.5.1.8 loaded and working.

https://community.netgear.com/t5/Orbi/Router-Randomly-Dropping-Internet-Connection/m-p/1871687/highl...

You can go back to working FW as well if you want to.

@AIRgauge wrote:
I did remove the RBS manually but have not performed a factory reset on it. Can try that.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

Factory reset of satellite does not appear to have fixed the problem. The backhaul status is still showing up as disconnected and the connected devices are not displaying. It did not prompt a firmware update following the reset - wondering if it worked properly.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

Power light briefly blinked red during reset and then turned amber.

Retired_Member · ‎2020-03-10

@AIRgauge wrote:
Factory reset of satellite does not appear to have fixed the problem. The backhaul status is still showing up as disconnected and the connected devices are not displaying. It did not prompt a firmware update following the reset - wondering if it worked properly.

Based on the problems you listed, I doubt your problem with the Sat

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-03-10

Did the RBS top ring LED turn blue then go out or does it remain ON?

Is FW on the RBS the same version as the RBR? Just checking here.

A reset of the RBR maybe needed then.

@AIRgauge wrote:
Factory reset of satellite does not appear to have fixed the problem. The backhaul status is still showing up as disconnected and the connected devices are not displaying. It did not prompt a firmware update following the reset - wondering if it worked properly.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

RBR and RBS are running the same version of firmware.

RBS light goes blue, stays blue for a long time but eventually goes out.

FURRYe38 · ‎2020-03-10

Try the reset on the RBR. Then add the RBS.

AIRgauge · ‎2020-03-10

@Retired_Member I agree it's not likely the satellite. I was going to try to repeat the factory reset but now cannot remove the satellite manually. It disappears momentarily and then pops back up again. Still shows as backhaul status disconnected.

Retired_Member · ‎2020-03-10

@AIRgauge wrote:
@Retired_Member I agree it's not likely the satellite. I was going to try to repeat the factory reset but now cannot remove the satellite manually. It disappears momentarily and then pops back up again. Still shows as backhaul status disconnected.

I would leave the sat alone. Also if you're using the app, don't. Many posts about its problems. It's better to login to your router using a web browser. Try and locate the previous fw and roll it back to both router and sat

-Malux- · ‎2020-03-10

There's definitely a problem with the 2.5.1.8 firmware. I'm having the same issue with the backhaul status and with the number of connected devices. Here are a few more data points:

The Orbi app shows the satellite connected
The web interace into the router at 192.168.1.1 shows the satellite as disconnected
Logging into the satellite (192.168.1.54) shows a long list of devices connected to it.

Like the OP, i've had this setup working just fine until this weekend. By the way:

I'm a software dev who has worked with networks for a long while
I factory reset the router AND the satellite
I flashed the firmware on both the satellite and router to a clean 2.5.1.8
I setup the network again from scratch.
Like the OP, I did not manually install 2.5.1.8 firmware.

Right now, everything works save for the UI issues and the fact that the router does not identify the devices on the network.

theoak · ‎2020-03-11

@-Malux- wrote:
There's definitely a problem with the 2.5.1.8 firmware. I'm having the same issue with the backhaul status and with the number of connected devices. Here are a few more data points:

The Orbi app shows the satellite connected
The web interace into the router at 192.168.1.1 shows the satellite as disconnected
Logging into the satellite (192.168.1.54) shows a long list of devices connected to it.
Like the OP, i've had this setup working just fine until this weekend. By the way:
I'm a software dev who has worked with networks for a long while
I factory reset the router AND the satellite
I flashed the firmware on both the satellite and router to a clean 2.5.1.8
I setup the network again from scratch.
Like the OP, I did not manually install 2.5.1.8 firmware.
Right now, everything works save for the UI issues and the fact that the router does not identify the devices on the network.

@-Malux- I was experience the EXACT same issues as you.

I got my Orbi system. Out of the box it was on an older firmware, so I manually updated it to 2.5.1.8. Things seemed to be working, but internet was off and on, so I factory resetted. This is when I experienced the same. I downgraded to 2.3.5.20. Things were great. Because I am a sucker for punishment, I decided to upgrade to 2.5.1.8 again. Long story short - it is working now.

I can only conclude that my original firmware upgrade had "issues" and that by downgrading and upgrading again, those issues were corrected.

So you can try downgrading and then upgrading again? Yes, a pain - sorry 😞

Depending on how complex your configuration is, while you are on 2.5.1.8, take a backup of your settings; hence, when you get back on 2.5.1.8, you can just restore your settings back.

With all of the above being said, when I was on 2.3.5.30, it seemed to be stable and regardless of the GUI used, satellites and attached devices list was accurate. You might just want to sit on 2.3.5.30 also.