I'm going to tear in to the unit some day, most likely after my upcoming vacation (leaving in 4 days, so i might not have time to get to it before that.) but i fully expect it to be a total loss.
There is no power to the thing, what so ever. No lights, no fan-spin, nothing. So, it's more then likely a total write of, on the NAS.
But it has 4x500gB drives in it, a mix of random leftover drives. This thing has been used as "cold storage" for stuff that i (mostly) had other backups of, but since i cant for the life of me remeber exactly what was on it, i would like to hook the drives up to a PC and look through them. I know there is a "magic" way of doing this, but i cant find any details on it. Is it something someone here on the forum can share some info on, or do i have to take my chances with support, that may or may not be that interested to deal with 6 year old hardware, that when it was bought aparently was on the end of the lifecykle already?
I'm hoping this is public knowledge, that i just havent been able to find.
The perfect solution would be if i can slam the drives in my USB reader, make an image, and run a virtual machine to access them, see what there is, and pull anything that i might not have elsewhere. Pretty sure i ran X-RAID.
I have a feeling that the UK £76+£12 in shipping, that it will cost, to get a replacement RND4PSU1 is outside the spectrum of what it's worth. Especially since at this point it's just a guess that it is the PSU.
I MIGHT end up grabbing a 20 pin ATX extension cable, and chop it up to make a patched cable that would let me use a ATX PSU to power the unit. At which point i would know if it works or not, and perhaps more importantly, i would be able to pull anything stored on the unit, that i want.
that alternative would cost me just over AU $4. Here in Sweden the first alternative translates to almost 1000SEK, but the second alternative is 29SEK. That is substancial enough to be a factor. (USD $114 vs USD $3.3 if that helps showing what kind of monopoly money SEK is.)
Anyway. Chopping up cables, and going that route is my alternative if i can't find a better way of getting access to the drives, since that is only a fix for the PSU, and i can't really confirm that it IS the PSU that has given up... Would still prefer to be able to image the drives, hook them to a VM, and read them that way.
Netgear might still replace the psu for you. Even if they can't, you can source one from Amazon/eBay. The part number should be on the psu itself.
Note that applied to a specific range of serial numbers.Though @JennC recently posted that Netgear has no more inventory of these PSUs. I'd still ask, as that might not apply to all geographies.
Would still prefer to be able to image the drives, hook them to a VM, and read them that way.
If you can connect the drives up to a PC (sata or USB) you can boot the PC with a linux "Live" boot disk and then use the procedure here: http://home.bott.ca/webserver/?p=306
My unit isn't one with a matching serial, so that bit doesn't really matter.
Thank you for the link, i'll look in to that. I "should" be able to run the drives as images, in a VM, with a "Live" CD/DvD, based on that instructionset.
If i cant do that, i'll pull hardware out of storage, and run it on a barebones system, excluding the virtual machine extra complications. Thanks again.
Actually, after poking this a little, it looks like i'll be doing things halfass backwards. I've ordered a 24 to 20 pin ATX adapter. On it, i will have to reroute pin 12, and 18 from their current, -12v and -5v, to 12v, and after that it should be pin compatible with the NV+ v1.
If it fires up at that point, i'll just pull the data that way, and then sell it as "for parts" with the cable, and whoever buys it can decide if they want to run it as is, or scavenge it for parts. That way i get a confirmation on if the unit works or not. The 24 to 20 pin adaptor cable was cheaper then a 20 to 20 pin one, for what ever reason.20 to 24 pin ones are even cheaper, but wouldn't help me.
But, if this fails, i got the backup solution of going with the VM or PC extraction method.
Either way, i'm of on vacation in a few days, and wont have time for this untill i get back, so in my usual manner, i'll report back how it ended up in a few years or so...
As noted in the post above, i ended up using a ATX 24 to 20 pin conversion cable, cut 3 wires, and hooked 12v power to the ATX speced minus lines by simply connecting 2 of them to the third.
The 24 to 20 one actually works best. You can route either the -5V or -12V to the extra +12 on the additional 4 pins. The other (-5V or -12V) you can just leave disconnected and the NAS will get enough power.
I cut 10, 12 & 18, and hooked 12 & 18, to 10, and patched 10 back up, and covered it all with a bit of heatshrink tubing. Not a perfect solution, the heatshrink tubing is a bit to large on the side with a single cable, but it's more then long enough that i could tie it of with a zip tie.
I might end up using it in the future, since i always need more storage space, but not with a full size ATX PSU. I'd grab something like a PC Laptop to ATX powersupply, and stick it in the old powersupply's case.
Curiosity made me check the wattage pulled from the wall, or rather, from the UPS, and it's on the order of 60 watts, during a rebuild, with bloody old 500gB drives, 1gB RAM, and a pre "80+" standard PSU. I have NO idea why the PSU in these things were so much "overkill" to start with, but i guess larger drives can use a bit more power at times... Anyway, there are lots of suitable PSU's that would work with a cable like this, but i would rather pick up a "picoPSU" style, then a FlexATX one. But then, i happen to have a laptop PSU left over that could be used to power the darn thing, if that isn't the case... then i guess it's more of a even deal, seen to expences.
Anyway, what you are saying is that i could just as well had left pin 10 alone, and used pin 11 on the 24 pin connector, to feed pin 12 and, or, 18, on the 20 pin connector. This would have lowered the total draw on pin 10 in the 24 pin connector.
I might be of base here, but the pins are rated for somewhere in the neighborhood of 8A@12v, just shy of 100 watts.
I "should" be safe. If i do decide to make something more permanent i'll get a second cable, and pas 10 through, and steal my 12v from pin 11. And you are saying that it doesn't really matter if one uses both, pin 12 & 18, or just one, and leaves the other one not connected? Is one prefered over the other, or they are just bridged together on the NAS motherboard?
Thanks. I know how it came to be, i just couldn't seem to fix it.
I used BBcode for the link, to display text, rather then the link, and the forum didn't aprove. After which i couldn't get the link to behave... Sudently it was shown as text, but actually was a broken link. Bleh.
As always with me, someone needed something, and this time it was someone on the interwebz that also had a NV+ V1, that died. And of course he had data on it that they needed. Like, badly needed. So, i offered to take a look on it, seeing as i had my old unit "for spares", or to simply swap their drives in to.
Turns out the PSU was toast in that unit as well, so i slammed the drives in to my weird contraption, and fired it up. Wouldn't you know it, works perfectly.
Set up the FTP, had the people grab their data, and then wiped the system clean. Got a small amount of cash, and a free set of 2tB harddrives for the trouble. Thuroghly used, of course.
Anyway, since having a big ass ATX PSU, a horrific cable with mods on it, and a tangle with wires doesn't sit to well with... well, anyone really, i went and grabbed a pico style PSU. This one specifically:
(Yeah... Not going to try and pretty that up. The forum just kills me...)
I don't know if it's per design of these PSU's, or if it's something with the ATX connector, but it gets HOT. While trying to figure **bleep** out, i managed to pull a wire from the pin in the ATX 24->20 adapter, and decided to simply start over. I am now waiting for a new cable, and a second PSU (identical PSU, sligtly more expencive adaptor cable, hoping for better cable to pin connection quallity...)
In the end i'll probably end up clamping the PSU between a pair of aluminium heatsinks, with some thermal pads to make sure they transfer somewhat ok, and stick it all in the case, but i'd really like to know it wont try to light it self on fire first. Now that i sudently have a set of extra drives, i sort of want to bring the NAS back from retierment ;- )
Anyway, turns out the Pico style PSU will power these things just fine, but at least the one i got, run uncomfertably hot, and i will swap it, just in case.
The 24 to 20 one actually works best. You can route either the -5V or -12V to the extra +12 on the additional 4 pins. The other (-5V or -12V) you can just leave disconnected and the NAS will get enough power.
Sooo... I got my self a slightly better quality ATX 24->20 pin adaptor, one that, as a bonus, had the right colorcoded cables on it.
I took your advice, well, partly, and went the slightly smarter route, and took 12v from pin 11 on the 24 pin connector. I still connected both pin 12 and pin 18 on the 20 pin connector, to that slot, mostly out of "coz i can" reasons. A bit of shrinkwrap over the soldered connection, and a zip-tie strapping the two cables together and i feelt that was it.
I also got my self a second of those pico like PSU's, since the first one ran... uncomfertably hot. The second one is no different, so i guess they just run that hot. I'm powering the contraption with a 19v 6.4A laptop brick, and as when i ran it with the old ATX PSU, it settles in at around 60w, during a rebuild. NO idea what it will run at under full load, doing something like torrents, but i suppose it's not going to be a lot worse. Meaning that if the laptop brick can stand up to 24/7 use at 50% load, this thing is set.
I MIGHT try and sort out something in the way of cooling the pico style PSU, i have some thermal pad materials, that could be cut to size, so that i could sandwitch the PSU between a par of alu heatsinks, which would block more of the air's path through the old PSU compartment, hopefully actually make the PSU cooler, while directing more air to flow past the drives as well. Not that it's an issue right now, but it's winter...
Turns out, i have no choice, i have to do something to at least limit the airflow through the compartment with the pico "formfactor" PSU. At full load, with sustained network transfers to the NV+, and constant writes to the array, i hit 36-41C on system temp, and drives. System temp probably is just fine at 36, but drives 2 and 3 at 40 and 41C isn't going to do to well during the summer. There is a bit left in the fan, it's only at 2419 rpm, but i've decided that i have to do something to block the airflow through the PSU compartment, forcing more air through the drivecompartments.
This means the PSU will get even hotter, which just isn't something i'm comfortable with. I'm going to get me a few bits of copper, make some "shims" and stick them to the PSU, on both sides, with the thermal pads, and finaly sandwitch the whole thing between a pair of heatsinks, with some thermal paste between the copper, and the heatsinks. With a bit of tinkering i hope the "new and improved" PSU will, just like the original one, provide enough restriction for the airflow, to make the drives cool of a bit more, and leave me with a good and reliable spare unit.
At max transfer the system pulls 51-53w, at idle it drops to 20w.
I javen't been able to figure out how that compares to the stock PSU, and at least for full load numbers, the drives probably makes a significant amount of it, meaning they would be subject to change, with other drives. I'm currently just running as a "test" which means i have 4 500gB drives in the system. 3 good, one bad, weirdly, the NV+ reports all the drives as "good" even tho one drive has 12 relocated sectors...
2 WDC WD5000AAKS, 1 WDC WD5000AAJS, and one Hitachi HDT721050SLA360. Once i've tortured the system enough, and fiddled with the PSU to my hearts content, i'll replace these drives with 4 2tB seagate drives supposedly for video survilance systems. If i remeber, i'll swing by and drop the watt figures at that point as well.
i'll replace these drives with 4 2tB seagate drives supposedly for video survilance systems. If i remeber, i'll swing by and drop the watt figures at that point as well.
I suggest using the Ironwolf drives. They should run cooler than what you have now, and the NV+ is limited by the performance of the CPU, so the slower rotation speed won't have much impact on transfer speeds.
My NV+ was retired, since it's PSU broke. I grabbed a ATX extension of ebay for something like 2 USD just so i could check if the stuff on the drives really was all backed up elsewhere, and then the system was put away. After which someone showed up with a different unit that also was dead, and wanted their data of it.
So i stuck the drives in my unit, and got it back for them. Got the drives as a "thank you for your efforts, but we don't want those old drives anymore, have at them" bonus, and stuck them in a HP X300 media vault., moving the drives in it to a Supermicro system, and then the drives in the supermicrosystem suddently started laying around. And it seems like something of a waste to have 4 2tB drives laying around, just coz they don't have anything to sit in, so, i went and explored alternatives. With idle 20, and peak at most as 60w, the pico type PSU is way overkill, and someone could probably get away with the smaller 80-150w 12v variants, but i wanted to power it of laptop PSU's, so i had fewer options. Still, 22 usd shipped home was nothing, and as it turns out, i now have a spare, since i sort of thought the first one was, if not faulty, at least overly hot, but it's now 2 for 2, and it doesn't really seem to have any issues...
Anyway, if i hadn't had the drives laying around, i wouldn't have spent money on getting the system running. Now it just became something i wanted to do, just to see if i can make it work out well enough. Once i have a finalized setup, i'll probably grab a second ATX extension, and do the same thing to the other NV+, and put it in storage, just as a spare.
Not that it adds much to the thread at this point.
Got the 4 Seagate ST2000VX002-1AH166 installed, and the X-RAID expanded to it's max capacity. Powerconsumption dropped to 40-43w as reported by both the wattmeeter, and the UPS.
Temperatures of the system, and drives, in a 25c ambient room, is 32-35c for the drives, and 34.5c for the system.
I looked around for a heatsink i could modify and stick on the PSU, but had no luck finding anything that would suit my needs.
Considered using square aluminium tubing, and drill a few holes through it to make for a limited airflow, but in the end went with a custom CNC made chunk of aluminium, letting me fit the PSU between two parts, bolt them together , and then sandwitch it between the chassi PSU tray, and the inner chassi structure with more thermal pads. At this point you can barely tell where the PSU is located on the inside of the chassi by touch on the bottom of the tray, and i decided that has to be cool enough. I'm fairly sure it's overkill, it probably never needd the extra cooling, but it directs more airflow past the drives so i hope they will do fine in the summer. I see high 30 something ambient during the summer, and with a 7-10c delta, that puts the drives just shy of 50c... Not ideal, but clearly the best i can do. With any luck the fan spinns up when the drives get warmer, so it should help things along.
Anyway, i doubt this thread will see any more updates, this one was fairly useless, and more for my own amusement, then anything else. A record of the hows and why's that i can look back at, the next time i start poking this thing, if memory fails me at any point.
