Just downloaded the latest release V1.9.1.12 and noticed in the official release notes from Netgear it states as fix 'Continious Improvement in wireless connection stability'..Dosent spefically makre reference to discconections but that sounds like a promising fix. Wonder if and when people update if they post if they have had discconnections (ios or Andriod) since installing V1.9.1.12 then we may know if its been fixed permanently

Netgear Moderators, I would like to attempt one last method to fix these multiple problems with the Orbi product. Rather than complaining, and throwing away my $600 investment, perhaps the Netgear engineers and developers would be perceptive to suggestions which I am sure can resolve some (if not all) of these problems. First, let me say Thank You! Thank you for your attempts to create an appealing looking product. It doesn’t look like a science project gone wrong with 6 antennas and 10 LED lights. It doesn’t cause my guest to ask me, “What is that weird looking thing”. Thank you for your attempts to innovate and solve the large home WIFI coverage problem. Thank you for the speed. Yes, its fast! With all that you made right, some portions of the Orbi product are missing the mark. I believe I may know what you are overlooking. You tried to create an EASY, SIMPLE, and high tech product that could be used by anyone, especially non-technical consumers. Unfortunately, what you “may” be missing is the reality that no one solution for WIFI exist for everyone. Therefore, other WIFI OEMs allow access to advance settings enabling consumer to tweak and tune the product to their specific use case and environment. Homes, buildings come in a large variety of sizes, floor plans, building materials and other variables which can cause interference from other locations. Possibly home appliances and other devices which may not “play friendly” with Orbi, despite your best attempts to find the one configuration that works for everyone. It’s just not possible! Hence, I ask of you. I plead with you. Beg of you! Stop trying to make Orbi work for everyone using your locked-in configurations. Allow some flexibility! Here are my suggestions which have proven to be affective for all of you competitors. Many of these suggestions have been posted in your” ideas” area forum. We must assume you are too busy, or have somehow over looked these suggestions. Allow the 2.4G and 5G radio SSIDs to be separated. All other OEMs which use any type of “smartconnect” ability allow that feature to be disabled. Because it doesn’t always work for EVERYONE. There are too many client devices in this world. 2 devices may work, and 2 may not. Allow this separation and it further removes the burden of band-steering. I can lock in my devices to a specific 2.4G or 5G band, and Orbi doesn’t need to worry about moving my devices to the other 2.4G radio. This should help with disconnects. It also allows Netgear to sell more Orbi Satellites. I would be inclined to buy an additional satellite so I have large 5G coverage, rather than moving to 2.4G. Let the user decide, as all your competition allows. Allow Orbi node/device-steering to be completely disabled. The Orbi is Fast. VERY FAST! It should not be required to force client devices back to the main Orbi router. If my client device has a good connection to the satellite, then let it stay there, or move on its own if the RSSI drops beyond 75. Most modern devices handle roaming VERY WELL, and do not need your help. Don’t risk a client disconnect by forcing the device to move to the router. Please provide the option to disable all band-steering. Please expose the client device, and Orbi Satellite device, RSSI, MCS Data Rate, connected radio, and which Orbi node its connected to. This will allow your users to have troubleshooting ability…AND it will allow better placements of the Satellites if you can show the “REAL” RSSI and MCS of the satellite connections. When a Satellite powers up and gives that white light showing a good connection. What it doesn’t tell you is how stable that connection is. I have two locations in my home that can cause random fluctuations in my signal strength. It will be good one moment, and not good 60 seconds later. I have been FORCED to use a Samsung Android Smartphone with WIFI Analyzer to determine the TRUE quality of a Satellite location because your product refuses to show any detailed information. Please allow automatic updates to be DISABLED. Netgear suffers the same problem all manufactures experience. Sometimes you get it WRONG. Sometimes a code update causes more problems. Your customers should be allowed to choose if they want to update, or NOT. This can be resolved via Orbi light illuminations telling the user something needs to be performed. It can also be notified via the Orbi App. But it should be “notify first, then allow the user to accept or decline the update”. Your recent 1.9.x update has caused more problems than it solved. Further making the Orbi NOT SIMPLE. And there are other “nice to have” features such as vLAN support for guest network. And others…But I would be happy see the above changes made. These requests are ALREADY part of the command line, but using them is difficult, requires research, and should the user make any changes in the Web GUI, the command line changes are lost. Please read this, and please make Orbi work. These changes should take no more than 2-4 weeks. Thank You

Gentlemen, and ladies, if there are some, Orbi needs to work as designed. That means any “fix” that requires; a. Disabling MU-MINO, b. Disable Beamforming, c. Reduce your power, d. Unplug you Satellites, etc, etc. This is NOT a “fix”. If my car is not operating properly and the dealer or manufacture instructs me to disable half my cylinders, never use my AC, radio, or cruise control, etc, keep your RPMs under 3K and never drive faster than 40MPH. Well, I think you would all agree that I would be “complaining”. And asking for a refund. What “I believe” is happening is the Orbi Algorithm is not working for “SOME”. Of course, it will work for some, and not others. WHY? Because there is no single magic Algorithm that works for every environment and client device. Cisco, and many other commercial grade wireless systems usually have a central control station that manages all APs in a multiple AP environment. This control station monitors all connections and status of all APs. It will change channels of some APs depending on the APs location and nearby interference, it will steer clients to other APs based on that devices capability and the overall status of the APs grid. And it will do MANY other things to insure a proper, healthy, functional and stable WIFI experience. It does this dynamically because WIFI conditions are never the same though the day, week, month, etc. One minute it has 10 clients, and one hour later it has 40. One hour the client is close to AP node 1, then it shows its closer to AP node 2. If the device does not move itself to the better AP node, the control station will move it. If I have an Algorithm that instructs; “If” client connects to Orbi Sat using 5G radio, “and” its RSSI is -65 or better, “then” DO NOT STEER to 2G, or Orbi Router. “If” client RSSI drops below -65 using 5G radio, “then” steer to Sat 2G radio. “If” client RSSI is -65 or lower using Sat 2G radio, “then” steer to Orbi Router 2G radio, “only” if RSSI is -65 or greater using Router 2G radio. If client RSSI is -40 or greater using router 2G radio, “then” steer to router 5G radio. The above is a VERY simple Algorithm for example purposes. I think Netgears’ Algorithm is broken, and they are “trying” to find the one Algorithm that works for EVERYONE. I think Netgear is trying to prevent the Sat backhaul from becoming too congested. Hence, the Algorithm is bias to the router and attempts to steer clients to the router as much as possible. The problem with any “bias” to the router, is modern devices that are not STUPID and can see the Sat having a much greater signal (-50 or better, compared to the current -70 it may have), and it switches to the Sat. But then, the Orbi Algorithm runs again and kicks the client back to the router. And the circle starts again. The client devices will “argue” and switch back to the Sat and Orbi will repeat this process again. But, after a few bounces between the router and Sat. the client drops its connection. And this can be due to several reasons. Example; 1. The client MAC is now showing on both Sat and Router and the L2 switching doesn’t know what path to reach the device. 2. The Apple client code realizes it cannot maintain a consistent connection to the WIFI network and hence it gives up and DROPS because its tired of being kicked several times to different AP nodes. It wants to choose the AP node itself, so it says screw you Orbi. Some devices are STUPID, and once they lock onto a BSSID AP Node, they stay. And if steering moves that device to another AP node, then it stays there. Some devices with bad and lazy code are perfect candidates for steering because they lack the intelligence to move to a better AP node. But newer devices with good code DO NOT like steering. They will go to WAR with it. But, the WIFI gods know this, so they created flags that APs can send to clients with “suggestions”. “Hey iPhone, I have this wonderful AP node with a much better signal, so why not try that.” The iPhone can choose to ignore it. If the iPhone has an existing data connection that must be maintained, it may choose to stay on the AP node it is using, and perhaps switch AP nodes once it goes back to idle. Example, Flash is on a WIFI Call. So, NO. I want to stay where I am at because switching may break the connection. I will move later. But if Orbi forces the move and STP and other network features are not used...Guess what...DROP... Again, this is what I believe could be causing the problem, but it’s hard to prove because unlike EVERYONE else who makes Multi-AP platforms with steering and other advanced features. They let you see the Algorithm and change it. They let you disable and enable features that may, or may not, work for YOU. WHY? Because they know there is no one size, no single Algorithm, that WORKS FOR EVERYONE.

We've been putting in significant work on these disconnect issues and wireless stability and every new release typically has improvements in it. The challenge is that there are literally thousands of devices running multiple versions of software that a router or WiFi System needs to work with, and occassionally interoperability issues arise as the two systems try to talk to each other. When that happens, rest assured that we're working very hard to stay on top of these issues and solve them. When we come up with a proposed fix, we always want to test out our fixes in a real-world environment, before rolling it out for everyone and we use the beta program for that. At this stage, we think we have a solution for some of them but we want to test it out in a smaller environment. If you're interested in helping us, please feel free to contact Support. Thanks, Orbi Product Management

Good luck to you all. I have given up and sold my orbi at a substantial financial loss, but with a net gain. I gain back my time and lack of frustration in purchasing another product that just works. Unfortunately, Netgear has a great idea but only a half baked product, hoping that we/you will stick it out until it is fully baked. My fear in that is that with a 1.OMG release, there will be a condition in which the hardware will not be able to support the necessary changes in code to run properly, hence making an Orbi 2.(0H.. this is what it should have been from the start). I am personally not willing to beta any further. Too many issues for something that should just work. Good luck all. Tom

Flash008 wrote:LOL It's called denial, brother. Let me enjoy my denial a little while longer. :smileysad: I want them to work really bad too but I had to cut the ties. Even if I don't stick with the Ubiquiti setup I will not go back to the Orbi's. I will find something else.

Update V1.9.1.12 Netgear officially announcing 'Improvement in wireless connection Stability'

265 Replies

Ts937km
Apprentice
May 01, 2017
I have been In IT for a long time 25+ qt the current T job. so yes I agree. Was just curious.

My air print seems stable as well.

And I don't use parental controls so no issues there.

And what is the -db loss between your router and satellite? Can you tell that?

I wonder if you turned the closest one off if it would help. Mine really cleared up when I got them about 40 ft apart on different levels. So both satellites are about 80 ft apart. And about 40 ft from the central router.

I left 2.4 and 5 at 100%
Ts937km
Apprentice
May 01, 2017
And an addition I migrated came from a single nighthawk 8000. My house is on a hill and external garage was having coverage issues.

Now that I have mine stable. This thing screams. Plex port forwarding and security cameras Arlo and a bunch of wifi cameras, Amazon fire boxes as well,
, ring doorbell, 6 echos etc. Everything working great.

Hope everyone else gets their systems stable soon as well.
fbraz50
Apprentice
May 02, 2017
I ran into an issue with this latest firmware. I am getting consistent packet loss every 15-25 minutes. Sometimes it's small blips and other times it's long enough to kick me out of Overwatch games. I jumped through hoops trying to figure out the problem but have confirmed that it's this firmware update. Keep in mind I use my Orbi's in AP mode.

The biggest pain in the ass was that there was no warning on my Orbi about updates. It doesn't tell you that an update was done. Also the Netgear website doesn't mention release dates of the firmware versions for the Orbi.

What I did to determine issue:

I ran pingplotter to determine if my packet loss was coming from within my network or ISP related. I lost packets to gateway IP as well as Internet so it was on my local network.
I swapped out my firewall/router. I was using the Edgerouter Lite from Ubiquiti. I put in my old Asus AC68U in Router mode (Disabled WiFi Radios). Packet loss continued.
I thought it was the wireless card on my computer for a bit so I bought another one at my local store. Specifically the Archer T9UH. The packet loss continued. So I returned that.
I bought the TP-Link RE450 "Range Extender" because maybe my wireless issues were Windows 10 related and used it as a bridge only for my Desktop. Ethernet attached from Windows 10 Desktop to RE450. All extender features were disabled and I connected the RE450 at 5Ghz to Orbi, disabled 2.4ghz completely. Packet loss continued.
I then turned off all my Orbi's and enabled the Asus AC68U wireless and all my problems went away. My coverage wasn't as good but at least my WiFi was stable. No issues for several hours.
Put my Orbi's back up and disabled WiFi on AC68U and packet loss came back within 20 minutes.
I came to these forums to see if anyone else was having issues like mine. That's when I noticed a new firmware announcement and the approximate release date coincided with my problem. So I thought, I'm a big boy let me downgrade to the previous version and see if it makes things better for me. I tried and the Orbi would just upgrade itself again as soon as it got Internet access. NO WAY TO DISABLE AUTO UPDATE. Come on Netgear let me at least try to see if it works...

How I actually solved my problem:

I set IP reservations for both the Orbi Router and Satellite in my Asus AC68U. Orbi IP never changes no matter how many times I reboot them
I went into the Asus Router (again with WiFi disabled) and enabled "Network Services Filter". Blacklisted the Orbi and Stallite from reaching out to any Internet IP on port 80 and 443 TCP. I figured that's how they retreived the firmware updates.
Downgrade the Orbi Satellite to version 1.8.0.6
Downgrade the Orbi Router to version 1.8.0.6
Check that they cannot update themselves via the Firmware Update checker on Orbi Web management portal. Auto updates fail as expected.
Run through my testing again by playing Overwatch and running Pingplotter in the background and guess what? zero issues.
Also because I don't block ICMP the Orbi's still think they are online so they don't complain about anything now.
For me this firmware borked my Orbi units. Blocking the auto updates at my router/firewall and rolling back the firmware fixed all of my issues.

A less technically savvy person would have returned these or would've just gotten frustrated with them.
- gfrey
  Apprentice
  May 02, 2017
  I tried "Enable Implicit Beamforming" on this firmware. For about 3hrs everything was working great!!! I was ecstatic! Then my Nest cameras started dropping connections left and right... I had to turn off Beamforming to fix this issue yet again. I haven't noticed any improvements over v1.8 except Beamforming lasted longer.
  - jxrxme
    Star
    May 02, 2017
    What angers me most is that whenever a user reports Wifi disconnect issues, the moderator advises to turn off implicit beamforming, mu mimo and turn down the 2.4GHz band transmit power. These suggestions are presented as solution instead of clearly communicating that these suggestions are only a way to lower the risk of disconnects and that the root cause is a known band steering bug they are working on...
    
    This behavior lets me doubt they are working on a fix...
- fbraz50
  Apprentice
  May 07, 2017
  How I blocked updates:
  
  I set IP reservations for both the Orbi Router and Satellite in my Asus AC68U. Orbi IP never changes no matter how many times I reboot them
  I went into the Asus Router (again with WiFi disabled) and enabled "Network Services Filter". Blacklisted the Orbi and Stallite from reaching out to any Internet IP with UDP protocol. This simply blocks DNS translation and prevents Orbi checker from reaching update servers.
  Downgrade the Orbi Satellite to version 1.8.0.6
  Downgrade the Orbi Router to version 1.8.0.6
  Check that they cannot update themselves via the Firmware Update checker on Orbi Web management portal. Auto updates failed to check at all. Now status shows "No Internet" in the update section but Orbi main page still shows online.
  Run through my testing again by playing Overwatch and running Pingplotter in the background and guess what? zero issues.
  Also because I don't block ICMP the Orbi's still think they are online so they don't complain about anything now.
  For me this firmware borked my Orbi units. Blocking the auto updates at my router/firewall and rolling back the firmware fixed all of my issues.
  
  A less technically savvy person would have returned these or would've just gotten frustrated with them.
  
  My Orbi's still updated themselves after a few days with my original guide. I have modified it so it blocks all UDP traffic from Orbi's to the Internet. This in turn blocked DNS so the Orbi can no longer translate IP addresses. This forces the update checker to fail completely. Now it cannot even detect if there is a new firmware.
  - fbraz50
    Apprentice
    May 08, 2017
    fbraz50 wrote:
    How I blocked updates:
    
    I set IP reservations for both the Orbi Router and Satellite in my Asus AC68U. Orbi IP never changes no matter how many times I reboot them
    I went into the Asus Router (again with WiFi disabled) and enabled "Network Services Filter". Blacklisted the Orbi and Stallite from reaching out to any Internet IP with UDP protocol. This simply blocks DNS translation and prevents Orbi checker from reaching update servers.
    Downgrade the Orbi Satellite to version 1.8.0.6
    Downgrade the Orbi Router to version 1.8.0.6
    Check that they cannot update themselves via the Firmware Update checker on Orbi Web management portal. Auto updates failed to check at all. Now status shows "No Internet" in the update section but Orbi main page still shows online.
    Run through my testing again by playing Overwatch and running Pingplotter in the background and guess what? zero issues.
    Also because I don't block ICMP the Orbi's still think they are online so they don't complain about anything now.
    For me this firmware borked my Orbi units. Blocking the auto updates at my router/firewall and rolling back the firmware fixed all of my issues.
    
    A less technically savvy person would have returned these or would've just gotten frustrated with them.
    
    My Orbi's still updated themselves after a few days with my original guide. I have modified it so it blocks all UDP traffic from Orbi's to the Internet. This in turn blocked DNS so the Orbi can no longer translate IP addresses. This forces the update checker to fail completely. Now it cannot even detect if there is a new firmware.
    
    So... I'm going to have to revise this yet again. It seems that since I am blocking all UDP traffic out of the Orbi's now they are deciding they want to be offline. This happened a few days after my revised guide was posted. For the love of god Netgear, let me turn off auto updates. What this is causing is random packet loss. It looks like maybe the CPU or some resources on the router go under heavy load and it in turn causes dropped packets to anything going over the Orbi. I believe it is a load issue because it definately happens when I am on the web interface and when the devices try to check for updates.
    
    So since I have switched back to my ubiquiti router I did some more digging in the logs and found the Orbi reaching out on "FTP" and "WEB - Other" classifications of traffic. I'm not totally sure what "web - other" is but will try to update when I find out. I just set my firewall rules to block outbound Web and FTP for the two Orbis and update checker fails with a no response tag now. They are behaving properly for now. I also tried to let them update again and the same issue as before was happening. Packet loss every 15-20 minutes.
    
    I am on the brink of cutting my losses and trying something else, even if it is slower...
Flash008
Luminary
May 02, 2017
Netgear Moderators,

I would like to attempt one last method to fix these multiple problems with the Orbi product.

Rather than complaining, and throwing away my $600 investment, perhaps the Netgear engineers and developers would be perceptive to suggestions which I am sure can resolve some (if not all) of these problems.

First, let me say Thank You!

Thank you for your attempts to create an appealing looking product. It doesn’t look like a science project gone wrong with 6 antennas and 10 LED lights. It doesn’t cause my guest to ask me, “What is that weird looking thing”.

Thank you for your attempts to innovate and solve the large home WIFI coverage problem.

Thank you for the speed. Yes, its fast!

With all that you made right, some portions of the Orbi product are missing the mark.

I believe I may know what you are overlooking.

You tried to create an EASY, SIMPLE, and high tech product that could be used by anyone, especially non-technical consumers. Unfortunately, what you “may” be missing is the reality that no one solution for WIFI exist for everyone. Therefore, other WIFI OEMs allow access to advance settings enabling consumer to tweak and tune the product to their specific use case and environment.

Homes, buildings come in a large variety of sizes, floor plans, building materials and other variables which can cause interference from other locations. Possibly home appliances and other devices which may not “play friendly” with Orbi, despite your best attempts to find the one configuration that works for everyone. It’s just not possible!

Hence, I ask of you. I plead with you. Beg of you! Stop trying to make Orbi work for everyone using your locked-in configurations. Allow some flexibility!

Here are my suggestions which have proven to be affective for all of you competitors. Many of these suggestions have been posted in your” ideas” area forum. We must assume you are too busy, or have somehow over looked these suggestions.

Allow the 2.4G and 5G radio SSIDs to be separated. All other OEMs which use any type of “smartconnect” ability allow that feature to be disabled. Because it doesn’t always work for EVERYONE. There are too many client devices in this world. 2 devices may work, and 2 may not. Allow this separation and it further removes the burden of band-steering. I can lock in my devices to a specific 2.4G or 5G band, and Orbi doesn’t need to worry about moving my devices to the other 2.4G radio. This should help with disconnects. It also allows Netgear to sell more Orbi Satellites. I would be inclined to buy an additional satellite so I have large 5G coverage, rather than moving to 2.4G. Let the user decide, as all your competition allows.

Allow Orbi node/device-steering to be completely disabled. The Orbi is Fast. VERY FAST! It should not be required to force client devices back to the main Orbi router. If my client device has a good connection to the satellite, then let it stay there, or move on its own if the RSSI drops beyond 75. Most modern devices handle roaming VERY WELL, and do not need your help. Don’t risk a client disconnect by forcing the device to move to the router. Please provide the option to disable all band-steering.

Please expose the client device, and Orbi Satellite device, RSSI, MCS Data Rate, connected radio, and which Orbi node its connected to. This will allow your users to have troubleshooting ability…AND it will allow better placements of the Satellites if you can show the “REAL” RSSI and MCS of the satellite connections. When a Satellite powers up and gives that white light showing a good connection. What it doesn’t tell you is how stable that connection is. I have two locations in my home that can cause random fluctuations in my signal strength. It will be good one moment, and not good 60 seconds later. I have been FORCED to use a Samsung Android Smartphone with WIFI Analyzer to determine the TRUE quality of a Satellite location because your product refuses to show any detailed information.

Please allow automatic updates to be DISABLED. Netgear suffers the same problem all manufactures experience. Sometimes you get it WRONG. Sometimes a code update causes more problems. Your customers should be allowed to choose if they want to update, or NOT. This can be resolved via Orbi light illuminations telling the user something needs to be performed. It can also be notified via the Orbi App. But it should be “notify first, then allow the user to accept or decline the update”. Your recent 1.9.x update has caused more problems than it solved. Further making the Orbi NOT SIMPLE.

And there are other “nice to have” features such as vLAN support for guest network. And others…But I would be happy see the above changes made.

These requests are ALREADY part of the command line, but using them is difficult, requires research, and should the user make any changes in the Web GUI, the command line changes are lost.

Please read this, and please make Orbi work. These changes should take no more than 2-4 weeks.

Thank You
- Cafetom
  Star
  May 02, 2017
  WELL SAID!
  
  If a feature doesn't work, don't offer it. At some level, I am thinking that this is a version 1.OMG product. I should have known that when I bought it, but the marketing of the possibility was intriguing.
  
  What I did find interesting is that some of the features I took for granted in my Nighthawk router simply are not present in the Orbi. And the features that are in the Orbi just don't seem to work as well as they do in the Nighthawk.
  
  If I new i was giving up all those features and functions for the only feature of having a satalite wireless, I would have never purchased this product.
  
  Prove me wrong Netgear. Make it work and implement the features that flash008 suggests.
  - Bing-Stroller
    Luminary
    May 02, 2017
    An Excellent posting !
    
    For someone to take the time to write such a well thought, informative and constructive post such as this deserves recognition.
    
    I only hope that it is read and given due consideration at the highest levels in the Corridors of Netgear !
- fbraz50
  Apprentice
  May 02, 2017
  I agree with most of your points and this is well stated. I do have one comment though. Band Steering is a good thing if done right. Most devices are very bad at roaming. This is why all Enterprise equipment has this feature and it tends to work very well in those environments. Granted they are adjusted based on the environment.
Flash008
Luminary
May 03, 2017
Rolling back to 1.8.x.

1.9.x has proven to make my WIFI in my home useless for all devices. I cant use SlingTV, WIFI calling or much of anything that requires a stable connection.

Netgear. Per my previous post, please open the Orbi advance options to allow us to tweak and tune this product to match our needs. You do not know my home, nor my devices, nor my enviroment and any other factors which may prove incompatible with your configuration.

I need control.

Asking me to disable beamforming, MU-MIMO, reduce power levels, and other changes, effectively disables the prime feature set of this product and is not a solution.

BMW asking me to not use anti-roll stability, iDrive, adapative cruise control, other special BMW features, and to keep it under 50MPH, somewhat defeats the purpose of owning a BMW.
- tubastank
  Apprentice
  May 03, 2017
  Flash008 wrote:
  Rolling back to 1.8.x.
  
  1.9.x has proven to make my WIFI in my home useless for all devices. I cant use SlingTV, WIFI calling or much of anything that requires a stable connection.
  
  Netgear. Per my previous post, please open the Orbi advance options to allow us to tweak and tune this product to match our needs. You do not know my home, nor my devices, nor my enviroment and any other factors which may prove incompatible with your configuration.
  
  I need control.
  
  Asking me to disable beamforming, MU-MIMO, reduce power levels, and other changes, effectively disables the prime feature set of this product and is not a solution.
  
  BMW asking me to not use anti-roll stability, iDrive, adapative cruise control, other special BMW features, and to keep it under 50MPH, somewhat defeats the purpose of owning a BMW.
  I tried rolling back 1.8.x yesterday and couldn't. It acted like it was going to work but when the Orbi came back up the version was still 1.9.1.12. Perrhaps you'll have better luck.
  
  If you do, please provide the steps taken to do so.
  - Flash008
    Luminary
    May 03, 2017
    
    After rollback to 1.8.x I can report 2+ hours straight and not a single problem with SlingTV or WIFI calling (no more than usual with 1.8.x). Version 1.9.x was causing buffer and disconnect problems every 10-30 minutes.
    
    To role back you only need to download 1.8.x files from Netgear Support site. Login to both Orbi router and satellite. Browse to the file and select upload.
    
    It will ask if you want to "downgrade" from the newer version. Say yes. It will reboot and you should be on 1.8.x.
    
    Understand, after reboot/downgrade it will indicate that new 1.9.x update is available. What I do not know is, "will Orbi auto update to 1.9.x again", without my permission. I guess I will know if my client devices begin miss-behaving again. I could block the Orbi IP addresses with my firewall, but then the Orbi lights will come on complaining about “no internet”!!!! I am also using AP mode, not router mode. Hence, blocking the Orbi IP will work for me, but not for someone using Orbi as the internet router.
    
    Netgear, ARE YOU LISTENING?????
- Cafetom
  Star
  May 03, 2017
  Rolling back to 1.8.0.6 myself.
  
  When my wife (Mrs. dialup patience) notices a wireless problem it has to be bad.
  
  Flash008. I think asking for things to be open might be a bit too much right now. How about they get things stable to start. Don't do anything else except fix wireless stability. Then maybe we can ask for the standard things that come in most home routers for the past 20 years. :(
  - Flash008
    Luminary
    May 03, 2017
    Thank You Cafetom for the reply,
    
    I used bad English. Sorry.
    
    What I mean is "OPEN" = advanced options to control band and Orbi device steering. And other advanced options found on most mid-high tier consumer WIFI routers/APs.
    
    I highly suspect device and band steering is the main problem for disconnects. Also allow the 2.4G and 5G BSSID to be separated, along with disabling auto-updates. Look at 1.9.x and the problems it is causing. How do most non-techy users stop Orbi from updating to a code level that clearly should be pulled from the update servers?
    
    So yes, OPEN may be the wrong word.
    
    I sound like a broken record now. Maybe if I repeat the same thing 100 times Netgear will listen. HA HA HA! Did you hear about the kid you wrote a letter to Stanford with only, "Black Lives Matter" 1000 times. He got accepted. Finally, we know the secret to get the attention of large organizations.
Flash008
Luminary
May 07, 2017
Great update post!

Very sad. Clearly Netgear doesn't care, even though we can see posts from Darren (Netgear Moderator). Not even an acknowledgment.

Time to move on and find another solution I guess.

1.8.x has been far better than 1.9.x. For those who say 1.9.x is working for you, congratulations. For us who pulled the short stick, very, very, sad.

Maybe in the future we will find a DDWRT or Tomato, or other custom firmware that can make this product work for the other 50 percent who have problems. Until that time, Netgear, don't expect any further investment from me.
fbraz50
Apprentice
May 07, 2017
Hey Flash,

I was thinking about loooking at other solutions as well. I'm torn as the Orbi is still the fastest of these mesh wifi systems. I would much rather go with multiple wired AP units in my place but I don't own it and don't want to make that type of investment. I work in IT so I have the pleasure of working with enterprise grade hardware that is way better then this stuff and support that is very responsive.

I'll be taking a look at some of the ubiquiti gear next. It's the closest I can get to enterprise grade without spending a ton of money and it looks like they released a mesh like system as well recently. To give you an idea of enterprise class costs 2 x APs of what we use at my office would run me over $2k msrp.
Flash008
Luminary
May 07, 2017
You are preaching to the choir.

20 years of IT working with the best of the best can make opinions of consumer grade products challenging. I try to keep my opinions and criticism grounded. I know it's not realistic to expect commercial grade experiences, but a basic level of functionality and customer service should be realistic.

The sad thing is most consumers now accept that the poor experience they have is "normal". They have no reference of what minimal quality should be. Of course they want things cheap, and there is some truth that "you get what you pay for". But Netgear decided to charge "near" mid-commercial grade prices, and hence set a high expectations.

I too spent hours running copper Ethernet through my home, and Orbi led me to believe I could mitigate that large weekend task and not sacrifice much in terms of performance. Boy, how I got played!!!

I have considered ubiquiti but given the significant investment into Orbi, I was trying to save that investment, but now I must accept that reality.

Sad, but good, that ubiquiti disabled their band and device steering on newer products because they knew it had problems. I respect that! Which is why Netgear is so disappointing. Many newer devices prefer to handle roaming on their own and fight third party steering, but yes older devices may need it. Which is why it is a user controlled feature.

Netgear just doesn't get it, or they don't care. In any case I will most likely move to ubiquiti as I should have before.

What can I say, I drank the Netgear koolaide.
Malik2k1
Star
May 08, 2017
Hey Everyone,

So I've spent some time reading the forums and it's evident that some people have found the orbi to be more stable with the new firmware and others have said it's gotten worse. I wanted to share my experience as it's been an odd one to say the least.

My Setup:
ISP Modem (Bridge Mode) -> Netgear Nighthawk (Router) -> Orbi (AP Mode)

When I first got Orbi, I was plagued with reboot issues and after reading suggestions on the forums, I switched the Orbi to AP mode. This stabilized performance and cut down disconnects and all was fine and dandy. I had MUMIMO disabled, beamforming enabled, WMM enabled and both radios (2.4 and 5ghz) at 100% transmit.

With the firmware update on May 5th, my whole setup fell apart and I started seeing latency issues on all iOS devices. I did some more forum research and tinkered with settings, moved Orbi router, moved Orbi satellite, adjusted transmit power and even prayed for a miracle. Nothing worked.

Completely dejected, I decided to unplug my modem, nighthawk and Orbi devices and put things back the way they used to be until a new firmware update would resolve the issues. The strange thing is that everything is working fine now and I have no clue why.

The Orbi router is in my basement and satellite is on the second floor of the house (50-60ft apart) and I'm no longer seeing the latency problems on my iOS devices like before. I have no clue what the made it stable but the household is at peace again without constant nagging that the internet isn't working.

Now not everything is fine and dandy as I do notice my iOS device dropping wifi and reverting to LTE when I'm moving about the house (not in use but in my pocket) but as soon as I unlock the phone it seems to hop onto wifi and function properly.

Not too sure what else to say but I'm hoping you guys have the same luck as I did. I do really enjoy the Orbi as it's much better than anything I've previously used. I wish it wasn't so finicky and I wish netgear got firmware out quicker but then we'd live in a perfect world!

Anyways, the point here is I really hope you guys see similar results in possibly just unplugging the whole system, moving the Orbi devices farther apart and possibly just rebooting all your network devices as I did. I know it seems a bit amateur but it seems to have helped me and hopefully it works for you too!

🙂
fbraz50
Apprentice
May 10, 2017
I checked my units and I can confirm that there doesn't seem to be any obvious hardware revision printed on them.
- Flash008
  Luminary
  May 11, 2017
  Good news, and bad news.
  
  Bad news first.
  
  I was on travel this past week. I returned home today, and discovered my Orbi did auto-update to 1.9.x (after blocking http and https TCP, not UDP). I did see the previous posts indicating the additional firewall steps required to block Orbi auto-update. I will work on that this weekend (Netgear, I have a work and personal life, hence not extensive time to continue fighting Orbi).
  
  And yes, my family told me this morning that “the internet began having problem in the past 2 days”. I wonder why????
  
  The good news….
  
  Netgear sent me an invite for a beta code release. But, they asked me to sign/agree to an NDA. So, to avoid losing my access to the beta code I now have, forgive me for not sharing too much.
  
  I have the files as of 30 minutes ago and will load that new code/firmware tonight (after family goes to sleep).
  
  May the force be with me, and with us ALL.
  
  And thank you Netgear for showing me, and us all, that you seem to be listening and you care.
  - Bing-Stroller
    Luminary
    May 11, 2017
    Good Luck !!!
    
    Good to hear Netgear have made this available to someone who has been actively trying to sort out these problems.
    
    Also well done to Netgear !

Forum Discussion

Update V1.9.1.12 Netgear officially announcing 'Improvement in wireless connection Stability'